2021 US Vehicle Dependability Study

[El Presidente]

..as a Land Rover owner, I am just glad we beat somebody 

J.D. Power 2021 U.S. Vehicle Dependability Study (VDS)
Problems per 100 vehicles. 2018 model year.
Rank	Brand	Score
1.	Lexus	81
2.	Porsche	86
3.	Kia	97
4.	Toyota	98
5.	Buick	100
5.	Cadillac	100
7.	Hyundai	101
8.	Genesis	102
9.	Lincoln	106
10.	Acura	108
10.	BMW	108
12.	Chevrolet	115
13.	Mitsubishi	116
14.	Mazda	121
--	Industry Average	121
15.	Mercedes-Benz	122
16.	Ram	123
17.	Dodge	125
17.	Mini	125
17.	Subaru	125
20.	Audi	127
21.	Nissan	128
22.	Ford	130
23.	Infiniti	137
24.	Jeep	141
25.	GMC	143
25.	Volvo	143
27.	Honda	145
28.	Volkswagen	163
29.	Chrysler	166
30.	Jaguar	186
31.	Alfa Romeo	196
32.	Land Rover	244
--	Tesla*	176
* Tesla not official; includes data from only 15 states.
Source: J.D. Power 2021 U.S. Vehicle Dependability Study

[Bijan]

As a Tesla owner I'm glad we had less problems than Land Rover, Alfa Romeo and Jaguar, even if the numbers aren't official ?

[NSXCIGAR]

Porsche came in #1 in Consumer Reports. I know they always rate high in customer satisfaction and customer retention. They're certainly doing something right in Stuttgart. 

[El Presidente]

7 minutes ago, Bijan said:

As a Tesla owner I'm glad we had less problems than Land Rover, Alfa Romeo and Jaguar, even if the numbers aren't official ?

Have your had many issues with your Telsla?

 

[Bijan]

5 minutes ago, El Presidente said:

Have your had many issues with your Telsla?

 

Not too many but a few, most minor and resolved by their mobile service, one recent one a bit more serious, the heater failed (unfortunately at the start of a 5-6 hour drive home), from my debugging I think it was the internal humidity sensor that failed, but I happily let service replace the heating element as it was covered under warranty (not an expensive part as mine is the original model with resistive heating not the newer one with heat pump).

I should probably be a bit worried as warranty will be out soon since I drove so much (I'm at 78,500km out of 80,000km, after less than 2.5 years of 4 years, though drivetrain and battery is covered for 160,000 and 8 years).

[mprach024]

How’d my Lamborghini do?  Why aren’t they listed?

[Ken Gargett]

1 hour ago, El Presidente said:

..as a Land Rover owner, I am just glad we beat somebody 

J.D. Power 2021 U.S. Vehicle Dependability Study (VDS)
Problems per 100 vehicles. 2018 model year.
Rank	Brand	Score
1.	Lexus	81
2.	Porsche	86
3.	Kia	97
4.	Toyota	98
5.	Buick	100
5.	Cadillac	100
7.	Hyundai	101
8.	Genesis	102
9.	Lincoln	106
10.	Acura	108
10.	BMW	108
12.	Chevrolet	115
13.	Mitsubishi	116
14.	Mazda	121
--	Industry Average	121
15.	Mercedes-Benz	122
16.	Ram	123
17.	Dodge	125
17.	Mini	125
17.	Subaru	125
20.	Audi	127
21.	Nissan	128
22.	Ford	130
23.	Infiniti	137
24.	Jeep	141
25.	GMC	143
25.	Volvo	143
27.	Honda	145
28.	Volkswagen	163
29.	Chrysler	166
30.	Jaguar	186
31.	Alfa Romeo	196
32.	Land Rover	244
--	Tesla*	176
* Tesla not official; includes data from only 15 states.
Source: J.D. Power 2021 U.S. Vehicle Dependability Study

out of interest, just who did you beat? 

you came in 32nd with 244! 

tesla was not included because it was only 15 states but even with that, they were only 176. 

land rover didn't even beat your kids' bikes! 

not only that, with 244, worth noting that no one else even made 200. 

[JohnS]

1 hour ago, mprach024 said:

How’d my Lamborghini do?  Why aren’t they listed?

[Ken Gargett]

16 minutes ago, JohnS said:

that was a great flick. 

[Fosgate]

I'm suprised at a few on that list. Kia, Hyundai? Back about the time when Daewoo was failing no car salesman would every say Hyundai and good car in the same sentence. 

Cadillac being as high as it is. Over several years I thought it was ridiculous about how poorly they held together. I've written checks for 2 CT6's recently. One was parked on an icy driveway, slid down the driveway and into a tree in the rear 1/4 panel. Local body shop didn't think it was too bad until they tore into it. Buckled part of the unibody made with sections of 13 different alloys and closest place willing to look at it and certified to repair it was Colorado Springs CO. Transported it all the way from Rapid CitySD to Colorado Springs CO. Got a stupid high repair estimate we just totalled the car. Stupd, absolutly stupid. 

GM's manufacturing inefficiencis is what suprises me to see them above the list of the likes of Honda or almost anybody really. I used to be a big fan of GM until after the got their bailout and they kept failing to adopt the "Toyota" method of efficiency and correcting quality issues at the production line. 

Mercedes  is also another that sort of suprises me. Personal expereince with one. I was never so happy to get rid of a vehicle as time came to turn in my lease S550. What a waste of metal to build that thing. 

Lamborghini. C'mon man! They don't test "kit cars"!  I don't think any supercar owner would want to see how their car stacks up against a mass production car. Very few can be considered daily driivers let alone put the miles on to compare with a mass production car. Porshe 911 or Lamborghini Gallardo are about the only two I can think of to even consider trying as a daily driver as proven by a few out there that have tried. 

[KCCubano]

7 hours ago, NSXCIGAR said:

Porsche came in #1 in Consumer Reports. I know they always rate high in customer satisfaction and customer retention. They're certainly doing something right in Stuttgart. 

As the previous owner of several I can say yes fun to drive and great handling at high speeds but a trip for repairs will run you 4-5 boxes of Siglo VI. 

[Chibearsv]

@Fosgate I thought those GM numbers were weird too.  How is every GM make better than industry average except GMC?  JD Power must've thought it would look more credible to put at least one GM over the line.

[djrey]

There are some serious flaws with the J.D. Power surveys. They also include issues with infotainment or any other aspect of the vehicle (in which the customer does not understand). I work in the tech side with BMW and we have quarterly reminders about ensuring customers know how to use things such as voice commands, navigation, profile settings etc. so we do not get hit in the J.D. Power listing. A brand will therefore do infinitely better if they simply deliver their car to their customer and they explain everything in detail. In other words, "dependability" needs to be taken very lightly with this. 

[rcarlson]

Hard to see that the numbers mean much without breaking out models.  I'll bet the bulk of the problems come from certain models for each manufacturer, especially with the US automakers that build some of their lines domestically and some foreign.  Unless something has really evolved over the last few years, US manufacturers have the same level of QC as the Cuban cigar industry.    

[Fosgate]

25 minutes ago, rcarlson said:

Hard to see that the numbers mean much without breaking out models.  I'll bet the bulk of the problems come from certain models for each manufacturer, especially with the US automakers that build some of their lines domestically and some foreign.  Unless something has really evolved over the last few years, US manufacturers have the same level of QC as the Cuban cigar industry.    

Fords lines and Dahlmer Chrysler have both adopted Toyotas techeneques at manufactureing and quality control as well as virtually every European manufacturer. They have to in order to stay competitive with one another and pull themselves back from the brink of failure if we remember when ownership was changing hands. Ford adopted before Dahlmer Chrysler and DC adopted after Fiat bought them in 2011. GM still insists on building the same model accross multiple lines and the operating with it's same old inefficiencies. One would think they would have adopted the production technique during their joint venture with Toyota in the early 80's (NUMMI). https://hbr.org/2009/09/nummi-what-toyota-learned

Tesla on the other hand is a whole different level. Love their cars but I would not want to own one outside of warranty. 

 

[MrBirdman]

Land Rover Freelander was by far the worst car I ever owned. The engine literally tore itself apart after 25,000 miles. You do not want to be a broken down car on the Schuylkill Expressway where the breakdown lane is half a car wide. 

[triphitter]

I'll take my F-150 over any vehicle from the top 10 companies.

[mprach024]

2 hours ago, Fosgate said:

Lamborghini. C'mon man!

I do not have a Lamborghini ?

[Fosgate]

47 minutes ago, mprach024 said:

I do not have a Lamborghini ?

I figured that. Just had to rag on Lambo and reliability. 

[rcarlson]

1 hour ago, Fosgate said:

Fords lines and Dahlmer Chrysler have both adopted Toyotas techeneques at manufactureing and quality control as well as virtually every European manufacturer. They have to in order to stay competitive with one another and pull themselves back from the brink of failure if we remember when ownership was changing hands. Ford adopted before Dahlmer Chrysler and DC adopted after Fiat bought them in 2011. GM still insists on building the same model accross multiple lines and the operating with it's same old inefficiencies. One would think they would have adopted the production technique during their joint venture with Toyota in the early 80's (NUMMI). https://hbr.org/2009/09/nummi-what-toyota-learned

 

 

The 80's US manufacturing legacy, thanks to Iacocca.  What a mess. 

[porkchop]

Surprised to see Volvo beneath Jeep (Just Empty Every Pocket). Not sure about the last couple years, Toyota Highlanders have been going 250k plus miles easy. 

[Fosgate]

18 minutes ago, rcarlson said:

The 80's US manufacturing legacy, thanks to Iacocca.  What a mess. 

Yeah that was a mess. Ford had a nasty reputation from the Pinto also. https://www.motherjones.com/politics/1977/09/pinto-madness/

[SpecialK]

15 minutes ago, Fosgate said:

Yeah that was a mess. Ford had a nasty reputation from the Pinto also. https://www.motherjones.com/politics/1977/09/pinto-madness/

Remember those days... My parents were shopping station wagons and the pinto wagon was in the mix..(don't know if the tank was located in a safer place however). Thankfully we ended up with a 77 toyota corolla wagon... it was bulletproof (until I wrecked it beyond repair)

I remember the Pinto nickname was "chariots of fire" 

 

[zigarrenziggy]

Perfect. All the validation that I needed to buy a Porsche...

 

On another note, not at all surprised by Jeep. My girlfriend's Jeep blew two engines in the span of 9 months. 0/10 would not recommend

[joeypots]

3 hours ago, djrey said:

There are some serious flaws with the J.D. Power surveys. They also include issues with infotainment or any other aspect of the vehicle (in which the customer does not understand). I work in the tech side with BMW and we have quarterly reminders about ensuring customers know how to use things such as voice commands, navigation, profile settings etc. so we do not get hit in the J.D. Power listing. A brand will therefore do infinitely better if they simply deliver their car to their customer and they explain everything in detail. In other words, "dependability" needs to be taken very lightly with this. 

Interesting. I have a Honda Ridgeline. It's a great vehicle for me except the infotainment is an electronic mess.  I could see Honda doing better if there were less issues with it.  I'd take the Toyota system any day.