How Long does it take one to be knowledgeable in Cuban cigars.

[Silverstix]

7 hours ago, SirVantes said:

How long is a piece of string?...

Do the truly knowledgeable ever profess knowledge, even to themselves?...

In this age of uncredentialed punditry, do we not need more Socratic ignorance?...

...Just how strong IS this whisky I’m drinking?...

 

What is a horseshoe?  What does a horseshoe do?  Are there any horesocks?  Is anyone listening to me?

[Ethernut]

 

20 minutes ago, HDGSN said:

What are the 5 cigars?

 

Great question and truly my point in the very first statement I make in the Noob Thread which is, "There is no cigar better than the other." The answer is, the 5 cigars are absolutely not a Marca or Vitola. It would be 5 Cigars filled with the best tobacco in different blend ratios and literally has nothing to do with a brand or size. That's the most difficult thing for folks to understand. Great cigars are filled with great tobacco period and that tobacco doesn't necessarily follow a particular brand or size.

 

 

[cfc1016]

7 hours ago, SirVantes said:

How long is a piece of string?...

Do the truly knowledgeable ever profess knowledge, even to themselves?...

In this age of uncredentialed punditry, do we not need more Socratic ignorance?...

...Just how strong IS this whisky I’m drinking?...

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning–Kruger_effect

[dominattorney]

Dudes and dudettes, just forward all your questions to me.  I know everything already. 

[Colt45]

2 hours ago, Silverstix said:

Are there any horesocks?

yes.

[Wilzc]

I would like to think that I'm rather knowledgeable about wine!

 

I know red wine, I know white wine!!   ..  i can even tell the difference!!

[NotLawReview]

9 hours ago, El Presidente said:

It took me by surprise and I didn't have an answer.  

I suppose it is a little like someone wanting to learn about wine. It is intimidating. 

My wife has been trying to teach me about wine for about as long as I've been trying to learn about cubans, and I'm WAY further along in my "development/education" in cigars for one main reason: this forum/your video reviews. I can't tell you how many times I've lit up a stick while sitting on the back porch glider bench, first trying to identify flavors myself, then watching one of your video reviews (while smoking) to see if I noted anything similar to yourself, or even more to see if i could identify the flavors once they were pointed out to me. This website and everything you do to maintain it is a TREMENDOUS resource and you can add me to the long list of members that are ever-grateful for what you've built here. Thank you very much.

[El Hoze]

I would use this opportunity to thank the FOH crew and its many helpful members, as this place is just a fantastic and irreplaceable resource for getting yourself up the curve fairly quickly and getting your hands on great cigars. I’ve been smoking cigars regularly for less than 10 years, the last 5 nearly all Cubans. I smoke probably 10 cigars a week these days. To many people I’m a bible of Cuban cigar knowledge, to many on here I’m rookie leagues. When it comes to wine and cigars some stuff interests me some stuff doesn’t, but my favorite part is the smoking and drinking part. 

[cfc1016]

@El Hoze you got it. It’s all relative. If you have experience/knowledge to share with someone who’s yet to be privy to it - you’re a resource to them. The strong likelihood is that *everyone*, regardless of how much quantifiable experience or knowledge they have, has something they can share with someone else. That’s the fundament of community. We all share what we’re able. ??

[...]

I fear asking such a question is a symptom of being unavailable for a journey like cigar smoking...

[Jeremy Festa]

3 years

 

[Buck14]

My advice,

There are 27 Habanos Marcas (with at least one hand rolled vitola). Go wide and shallow. Get your hands on as many different MARCAS as you can. Try each cigar at least twice. Identify the ones you like. Search for reviews of those cigars and inevitably that will lead you to other similar cigars. There is no substittue for personal experience.  

[KRunch61]

Cut

Light

Smoke

Enjoy

Repeat

Anything else ya wanna know??

[Habana Mike]

I've been at it over twenty years with 'dozens' of smokes behind me. Lots of books, forums and discussions with fellow lovers of the leaf.

A few trips to tobacco country and a couple stints as a 'professional' reviewer.

I've met a couple of individuals throughout which I would say are very knowledgeable on the subject.

Still wouldn't claim I am knowledgable though I have a pretty good background. Looking forward to continuing my education...

[NSXCIGAR]

To me, the question is how long does it take to become knowledgeable--not an expert or even very knowledgeable. I, like others, hesitate to use the term expert in the area of cigars as things are always in flux and someone's palate is always more sensitive than mine, and taste is a truly subjective thing. I do think a true mark of being knowledgeable is appreciating and extracting the most out of cigars one doesn't prefer. My least favorite marca is probably Fonseca, but I can appreciate a good one any day of the week. 

To become knowledgeable I think it's necessary to smoke most models from every marca over several years and also to compare notes and opinions with someone who is knowledgeable on a regular basis. At the very least, MRN provides a good general opinion on flavor profiles for most marcas and models. So I think it's possible to become knowledgeable after 3 or 4 years of dedicated smoking, reading and discussion. I had been smoking CCs steadily for about 6 years before MRN and forums came about and I felt knowledgeable just before that time with no resources. With resources, I think I could have gotten there a few years earlier.  

[dicko]

1 hour ago, NSXCIGAR said:

To me, the question is how long does it take to become knowledgeable--not an expert or even very knowledgeable. I, like others, hesitate to use the term expert in the area of cigars as things are always in flux and someone's palate is always more sensitive than mine, and taste is a truly subjective thing. I do think a true mark of being knowledgeable is appreciating and extracting the most out of cigars one doesn't prefer. My least favorite marca is probably Fonseca, but I can appreciate a good one any day of the week. 

To become knowledgeable I think it's necessary to smoke most models from every marca over several years and also to compare notes and opinions with someone who is knowledgeable on a regular basis. At the very least, MRN provides a good general opinion on flavor profiles for most marcas and models. So I think it's possible to become knowledgeable after 3 or 4 years of dedicated smoking, reading and discussion. I had been smoking CCs steadily for about 6 years before MRN and forums came about and I felt knowledgeable just before that time with no resources. With resources, I think I could have gotten there a few years earlier.  

I like this answer. I reckon with reading the forum every couple of days, reading reviews, reading MRN and smoking 2-3 cigars a week I obtained a BASIC knowledge of cuban cigars after about  2 years.

 

For those into martial arts I reckon its like someone getting their blue belt in jiu jitsu. Far far far from an expert but a good coverage of the basics after a couple of years of training 2-3 times a week plus a bit of extra study.

[Piligrim]

learning all the tome. smoke 1-3 cigars a day, read a lot (MRN book as well), doing blind tasting, visited factories and plantations, etc etc. there was a moment when I thought I know enough. but I was mistaken. but it also depends on how high your knowledge level really needed to be. if you want to know all marcas and those profile, you don't need a lot of time. if you're in business and especially if you meet customers and talk to them, discussing cigars you should know much more. because it's the way your customers will believe your advices. 

[Smallclub]

How long? About $15000…

[Ethernut]

27 minutes ago, Smallclub said:

How long? About $15000…

Very true!!

[BrightonCorgi]

Bill Gates says it takes 10,000 hours to learn something.

[madandana]

13 hours ago, Habana Mike said:

I've been at it over twenty years with 'dozens' of smokes behind me. Lots of books, forums and discussions with fellow lovers of the leaf.

A few trips to tobacco country and a couple stints as a 'professional' reviewer.

I've met a couple of individuals throughout which I would say are very knowledgeable on the subject.

Still wouldn't claim I am knowledgable though I have a pretty good background. Looking forward to continuing my education...

I guess this proves it's subjective. To me H Mike is a cigar god and mentor. If I have a question, I usually call on him.

[cigaraholic]

If I could only smoke 2 cigars a week I would have died from the torture long before I knew much

[mk05]

The ultimate goal of discretionary sectors isn't knowledge, but self-discovery. Rob mentioned the MRN book. I'm not sure that the book "teaches" much, but anyone can read the words and recite them (I would suggest Todesco instead, to learn something). Nevertheless, does that make you an expert, when you don't know personally of what you preach? It takes experience (time) to internalize those words, to compare/contrast in order to decide what is true for you. Discretionary sectors such as wine, cigars, and fashion are very much subjective, so one must understand that not everyone will agree with your assessments. Therefore, depending on your level of curiosity, you must first understand all the available material/information, then take the time to make it yours - this will take as long as it must.

That said, I believe that once you have become proficient in discretionary sectors as described above, there is another level. And for this, you need more than just knowledge and/or experience. I have known traders or analysts with 30 years of experience, but have no talent for the business. Yet, I know kids younger than me, who show extreme intuition for the space. I'm sure everyone has stories like that. This is where it gets unpopular, because in my opinion, for the level of mastery, you need to have good taste, and furthermore, excellent taste memory. Tom Ford, Karl Lagerfeld, Broadbent, Jancis, and a handful of guys that I've met in the cigar world - they all have excellent taste (this part subjective), and they also exhibit excellent taste recall (this part objective). Not everyone will like/agree with Tom Ford, Jancis, etc. That is fine, that is MY truth, people that I identify with. Once you achieve mastery, you will find your own group that you find commonalities with. And at that moment, you can understand why people say the things they say, instead of thinking, "that's wrong."

[ChefBoyRG54]

The ultimate goal of discretionary sectors isn't knowledge, but self-discovery. Rob mentioned the MRN book. I'm not sure that the book "teaches" much, but anyone can read the words and recite them (I would suggest Todesco instead, to learn something). Nevertheless, does that make you an expert, when you don't know personally of what you preach? It takes experience (time) to internalize those words, to compare/contrast in order to decide what is true for you. Discretionary sectors such as wine, cigars, and fashion are very much subjective, so one must understand that not everyone will agree with your assessments. Therefore, depending on your level of curiosity, you must first understand all the available material/information, then take the time to make it yours - this will take as long as it must.
That said, I believe that once you have become proficient in discretionary sectors as described above, there is another level. And for this, you need more than just knowledge and/or experience. I have known traders or analysts with 30 years of experience, but have no talent for the business. Yet, I know kids younger than me, who show extreme intuition for the space. I'm sure everyone has stories like that. This is where it gets unpopular, because in my opinion, for the level of mastery, you need to have good taste, and furthermore, excellent taste memory. Tom Ford, Karl Lagerfeld, Broadbent, Jancis, and a handful of guys that I've met in the cigar world - they all have excellent taste (this part subjective), and they also exhibit excellent taste recall (this part objective). Not everyone will like/agree with Tom Ford, Jancis, etc. That is fine, that is MY truth, people that I identify with. Once you achieve mastery, you will find your own group that you find commonalities with. And at that moment, you can understand why people say the things they say, instead of thinking, "that's wrong."

I find that reading the works of the aforementioned Mr N and DJ Tiesto(usually via audio cassette) much more difficult and time consuming than it is to just enter an 'mk05 diatribe' query into any random internet forum search bar to get my information.

PS - tl;dr

[Colt45]

21 minutes ago, ChefBoyRG54 said:

PS - tl;dr

I did read, and some interesting concepts. One can read all the texts they care to, and surely knowledge is power. But there is no substitute for for personal experience.