Cigar thirds and bitterness

[TheDonTX]

Happy Sunday BOTL’s. I smoked a Esmeralda TLU MAR 20 last night. Fantastic smoke. Gingerbread, wood, almond coffee creamer and a hint of cinnamon. It was a hit for sure in that 92 ish range. But it got bitter and sour right at the band. I got to thinking…why does this happen? Do I need to drybox longer? It was stored at 69/65 and drybox 24 hours. I nubbed a Lusi 4 weeks ago but nubbs dont happen to me often. Well then my second question came up about what is the normal expected smoking range of a cigar? Where does the final 3rd end? Have I been thinking incorrectly the final 3rd ends at the end of the cigar? Is there no issue with a cigar starting to be terrible around the area where the band is? In the pic is A or B correct to use when talking 3rds? 

[SCgarman]

B would be more correct. And there is no science with a cigar. It is finished when you no longer enjoy it, or when it starts to become warm and bitter. They will usually go down hill at the band area due to moisture buildup and the fact that the combustion zone is so close to the head of the cigar. The nub will usually start to feel warm and get soft and pliable. The cigar did it's job, time to let it die a dignified death and set it down. If you require a longer smoking duration, then a larger gauge or larger length vitola would be preferable. My cigar sweet spot is 60 minutes, give or take.

[Ford2112]

Some cigars get nubbed,very few in my case. Some meet their early demise, Most get smoked below the band,and I smoke slowly so perhaps slowing down your smoking will improve that final third. If the cigar seems to get hot I back off and let it cool down. Makes a big difference IMO

[NSXCIGAR]

If you start dividing into thirds before the nub it's entirely subjective. Unless you stick the nub in a pipe or something to finish it off the final third never ends, it only begins.

As far as the late-stage unpleasantness usually age helps with that. Sub-optimal construction and smoking technique can also contribute. 

[TheDonTX]

1 hour ago, NSXCIGAR said:

If you start dividing into thirds before the nub it's entirely subjective. Unless you stick the nub in a pipe or something to finish it off the final third never ends, it only begins.

As far as the late-stage unpleasantness usually age helps with that. Sub-optimal construction and smoking technique can also contribute. 

Is a cigar obtaining a 94+ score dependent on nubbing or not? Is that calculated into it? 

 

4 hours ago, SCgarman said:

B would be more correct. And there is no science with a cigar. It is finished when you no longer enjoy it, or when it starts to become warm and bitter. They will usually go down hill at the band area due to moisture buildup and the fact that the combustion zone is so close to the head of the cigar. The nub will usually start to feel warm and get soft and pliable. The cigar did it's job, time to let it die a dignified death and set it down. If you require a longer smoking duration, then a larger gauge or larger length vitola would be preferable. My cigar sweet spot is 60 minutes, give or take.

I never considered myself a fast smoker but also have never timed myself and compared it to others. I am going to try and see how fast I am. Thanks. 

[NSXCIGAR]

6 minutes ago, TheDonTX said:

Is a cigar obtaining a 94+ score dependent on nubbing or not? Is that calculated into it? 

Backwards. A 94+ is getting nubbed. 

[El Presidente]

46 minutes ago, NSXCIGAR said:

Backwards. A 94+ is getting nubbed. 

bingo 

[Wookie]

Sometimes tar buildup contributes to acrid flavors….you can try to cut the end off to create a clean end and enjoy more of the finish. 

[Nevrknow]

9 minutes ago, Wookie said:

Sometimes tar buildup contributes to acrid flavors….you can try to cut the end off to create a clean end and enjoy more of the finish. 

I do this also. 👍🏻

[TheDonTX]

8 hours ago, Nevrknow said:

I do this also. 👍🏻

How much of the end and when? So you cut it twice? 

 

9 hours ago, El Presidente said:

bingo 

El Pres what is the nub vs no nub cut off as far rating goes? If it cant be nubbed whats the highest score it can earn? 

[Nevrknow]

5 minutes ago, TheDonTX said:

How much of the end and when? So you cut it twice? 

When it starts to get to wet. How much depends entirely on the above statement. If it keeps me enjoying it until the end, I’ll sacrifice what ever it takes. Usually there several inches left so if I have to let some go to continue a great cigar so be it. Beats just pitching it. 
 

Just like anything else with this hobby. You figure YOU out and then do YOU. 👍🏻
 

I have yet to find anyone I agree with 100% of the time with on everything. 

[El Presidente]

3 hours ago, TheDonTX said:

El Pres what is the nub vs no nub cut off as far rating goes? If it cant be nubbed whats the highest score it can earn? 

....I can honestly tell you that I have never given this one a moments  thought 

We are getting deep into OCD territory here. Now there is nothing wrong with that (Hi Bijan!) but I am just not wired in that manner. 

I keep smoking a cigar until I don't enjoy it any longer. 

[TheDonTX]

34 minutes ago, El Presidente said:

....I can honestly tell you that I have never given this one moments  thought 

We are getting deep into OCD territory here. Now there is nothing wrong with that (Hi Bijan!) but I am just not wired in that manner. 

I keep smoking a cigar until I don't enjoy it any longer. 

His reviews might be a lil ocd but they are on point lol. Would love to hear his opinion here…

[NSXCIGAR]

2 hours ago, TheDonTX said:

El Pres what is the nub vs no nub cut off as far rating goes? If it cant be nubbed whats the highest score it can earn? 

I think we're at about 93-94 for a cigar good enough for me to be burning the fingers or breaking out the forceps for. Then again there are considerations like is it a larger RG, is it getting soft, etc. Just because I don't nub one doesn't mean it wasn't a 94+.

[DaBoot]

I smoke cigars to relax and enjoy them, this is too much thinking for me….

[Edicion]

Would be interesting to see a poll with where most finish their cigars, and if the price increase has had any affect on smoking habits like these.

In the past, some friends would ditch the cigar halfway and pick up another one, while these days they smoke it until the end or as long as they still enjoy it.

I'm probably A) but only smoke the final 1/3 if it's still good so it's depends on the smoking experience of the individual cigar.

[TobaccoRoad]

Most habanos are "A" while others are almost always "B". For some reason non-cuban cigars almost always turn on me about the band line. Cubans I enjoy the intense flavors as I nub it. I don't usually smoke them till I'm burning my fingers or using a tool to hold it. But I almost always smoke them past the band.

[Greenhorn2]

9 hours ago, TobaccoRoad said:

Most habanos are "A" while others are almost always "B". For some reason non-cuban cigars almost always turn on me about the band line. Cubans I enjoy the intense flavors as I nub it. I don't usually smoke them till I'm burning my fingers or using a tool to hold it. But I almost always smoke them past the band.

Yeah, if I can't peel the band and keep smoking then it is disappointing to me. If I have to trash more than an inch it makes me sad.

[Bijan]

As to thirds, I think I first heard it from @Habana Mike but there's this traditional division of cigars into thirds, described as: 1st, hay, 2nd, heaven, 3rd, dirt.

So that the 1st third is light and a glimpse of what is to come, the 2nd third is perfect and the last third is muddled and not that great.

In my experience the first few puffs after lighting a cigar are very clean and representative but after that the 1st third can indeed be a bit light at times. And the 2nd third the most flavoursome in general. The final third tends to be the most inconsistent, and also tends to have weird flavours come out. There are some unusual flavours like mint and other herbs that I tend to get just in the final third, possibly due to weird burn or moisture build up, etc.

Recently I have been nubbing fewer cigars due to a combination of the summer heat and humidity and my tendency to gut tight cigars at the head (drilling out more at the head tends to be more effective than pushing the perfecdraw deeper into the cigar, but it means you can't nub the cigar as there's a lot of tobacco missing at the head).

All that being said it is necessary to puff much more lightly when at the last third, as there is a lot less resistance due to the much shorter length of the cigar at that point.

Edit: I really notice the lightness of the first third on longer cigars, DCs and Churchills, but not so much on PCs or smaller.

[SMELTZ]

If you are taking more puffs in a shorter amount of time, you could be overheating the tobacco which will certainly change what you are tasting.

[joeypots]

I find it can take a while to get a cigar fully acclimated to a desireable level of humidity. And the foot of the cigar, last third, is the last part to reach the intended RH. Take a cigar that’s not quite acclimated to your preferred RH and smoke it in a humid climate and it’ll go bitter pretty quick, imho. I smoked a BPC last night in the car and first half was lovely. Second half turned to bitter mush when I got home. Of course it is the muggy, hot, height of summer here. Blinking your eyes can make me work up a sweat this time of the year. The weather had a lot to do with that little cigar’s performance. 

[targa88]

All depends on how enjoyable the stick is ... prefer to smoke them slowly...

[TheDonTX]

7 hours ago, joeypots said:

I find it can take a while to get a cigar fully acclimated to a desireable level of humidity. And the foot of the cigar, last third, is the last part to reach the intended RH. Take a cigar that’s not quite acclimated to your preferred RH and smoke it in a humid climate and it’ll go bitter pretty quick, imho. I smoked a BPC last night in the car and first half was lovely. Second half turned to bitter mush when I got home. Of course it is the muggy, hot, height of summer here. Blinking your eyes can make me work up a sweat this time of the year. The weather had a lot to do with that little cigar’s performance. 

Blinking your eyes 😂😂

[Greenhorn2]

5 minutes ago, TheDonTX said:

Blinking your eyes 😂😂

Hell, just open the door here in North Carolina and the sweat will pour. Haven't been smoking many sticks lately due to humidity.  It was 92% at 7AM Monday morning. 

[TheDonTX]

Thanks all who answered

11 hours ago, Bijan said:

As to thirds, I think I first heard it from @Habana Mike but there's this traditional division of cigars into thirds, described as: 1st, hay, 2nd, heaven, 3rd, dirt.

So that the 1st third is light and a glimpse of what is to come, the 2nd third is perfect and the last third is muddled and not that great.

In my experience the first few puffs after lighting a cigar are very clean and representative but after that the 1st third can indeed be a bit light at times. And the 2nd third the most flavoursome in general. The final third tends to be the most inconsistent, and also tends to have weird flavours come out. There are some unusual flavours like mint and other herbs that I tend to get just in the final third, possibly due to weird burn or moisture build up, etc.

Recently I have been nubbing fewer cigars due to a combination of the summer heat and humidity and my tendency to gut tight cigars at the head (drilling out more at the head tends to be more effective than pushing the perfecdraw deeper into the cigar, but it means you can't nub the cigar as there's a lot of tobacco missing at the head).

All that being said it is necessary to puff much more lightly when at the last third, as there is a lot less resistance due to the much shorter length of the cigar at that point.

Edit: I really notice the lightness of the first third on longer cigars, DCs and Churchills, but not so much on PCs or smaller.

Thank you sir. I appreciate the depth and the time you put into your posts. Regardless if its OCD or not I appreciate it lol. 
 

I never considered myself a fast smoker but I might be. I have never timed myself or even thought about slowing down before. 
 

Weird question: can being too slow of a smoker ruin a cigar? Re lighting 3 times?