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Should just rename to "Pricehike"

… do I hear 500? Now six… For f’ing cigars! Perhaps cigars should be banned. Apparently they make you stupid! Food for thought.  

I have a single left from a box I bought 3 years ago.  Willing to trade it for a box of D4's if there are any takers.

Posted

Is it Cuba that has raised the prices, or Hong Kong? I haven't seen any evidence or even chatter that Tabacuba has raised their wholesale prices to HSA. I know they're typically viewed as one in the same, but they are run by two different groups of people. I asked around when I was down there a couple months ago and none of my friends in the industry where able to confirm one way or the other. 

Its clear that Tabacuba has matched prices on the island, but the timeframe between hikes is shorter than the time it takes Caracaol to get the new prices into their computers and get new price tags printed. 

Like I said, I dont know one way or the other but I would be very interested to know how much, if any, wholesale prices have increased. I can say one thing for sure, Tabacuba hasn't passed an extra dime down to anybody actually involved in producing the cigars. 

  • Like 1
Posted
31 minutes ago, Corylax18 said:

Like I said, I dont know one way or the other but I would be very interested to know how much, if any, wholesale prices have increased. I can say one thing for sure, Tabacuba hasn't passed an extra dime down to anybody actually involved in producing the cigars. 

Distributor prices have certainly shot through the roof. 

Tabacuba to HSA. Not sure to what extent. 

Not sure it really matters as Cubatabaco is 50% of HSA. The Cuban govt have their snouts firmly in the price rise trough. 

Posted

I don't recognise those prices in the Cigar Aficionado article. Good luck trying to find a box (or a single) of BHK52 for £110 - the cheapest I've seen them (without going into names) was £300 for a 52, £350 for a 54 and £400 for a 56. I'd love to know where they are pulling their prices from!

Posted
1 hour ago, Corylax18 said:

Is it Cuba that has raised the prices, or Hong Kong? I haven't seen any evidence or even chatter that Tabacuba has raised their wholesale prices to HSA. I know they're typically viewed as one in the same, but they are run by two different groups of people. I asked around when I was down there a couple months ago and none of my friends in the industry where able to confirm one way or the other. 

Its clear that Tabacuba has matched prices on the island, but the timeframe between hikes is shorter than the time it takes Caracaol to get the new prices into their computers and get new price tags printed. 

Like I said, I dont know one way or the other but I would be very interested to know how much, if any, wholesale prices have increased. I can say one thing for sure, Tabacuba hasn't passed an extra dime down to anybody actually involved in producing the cigars. 

Hong Kong increased tobacco taxes at the end of February, which would have been after the Jan. 1 price increase. 

Ever since the global pricing standard was announced, I've been fascinated by how Habanos S.A. would keep up the mirage if Hong Kong increased taxes. 

Hong Kong taxes cigars by weight, which makes it even more hilarious if the global price standard based on Hong Kong prices was actually what was happening.

  • Like 1
Posted
1 hour ago, El Presidente said:

Distributor prices have certainly shot through the roof. 

Tabacuba to HSA. Not sure to what extent. 

Not sure it really matters as Cubatabaco is 50% of HSA. The Cuban govt have their snouts firmly in the price rise trough. 

Hong Kong increased tobacco taxes again March 1. 31% increase. 

We are about to see what the commitment is for HSA to match HK pricing globally. To do that they will have to raise again this year. 

Posted
2 minutes ago, El Presidente said:

Hong Kong increased tobacco taxes again March 1. 31% increase. 

We are about to see what the commitment is for HSA to match HK pricing globally. To do that they will have to raise again this year. 

Interesting indeed. 

Posted
2 hours ago, El Presidente said:

We are about to see what the commitment is for HSA to match HK pricing globally. To do that they will have to raise again this year. 

 

Just to note, not saying you are Rob, but many people seem to be under the impression that all Habanos were to be pegged to the HK price. In the original press release from HSA it was only Cohiba and Trinidad that were pegged to HK. 

Quote

“Habanos, S.A. has decided to reinforce this positioning and to set Cohiba prices uniformly at a global level,” taking Hong Kong pricing as a reference, the company said in a press release issued today. “This decision applies similarly to the Trinidad brand, which consolidates its position among the elite of Habanos’ brands, becoming the boutique Habanos brand par excellence.”

https://www.cigaraficionado.com/article/100-cohibas-coming-as-cuban-cigar-prices-going-up

So an HK tax increase only means another increase for Cohiba.

I don't think anybody who was still in the market for Cohiba will really be forced out by another rise.

  • Like 1
Posted
I don't recognise those prices in the Cigar Aficionado article. Good luck trying to find a box (or a single) of BHK52 for £110 - the cheapest I've seen them (without going into names) was £300 for a 52, £350 for a 54 and £400 for a 56. I'd love to know where they are pulling their prices from!

I know where they are getting them from. They are pushing the envelope to whatever they want to make off a single cigar as there are many who don’t care and will pay it. Until people stop paying it will keep increasing.


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  • Like 2
Posted

After smoking BHK 54s all week, albeit ROTT, I can say that I might pay the pre-cigarmageddon Cuba price of $46 for them. I also might not. And yes, they are very good. But $46 is a lot of money for a cigar. 

Maybe I'm just a cheap bastard that's clearly not in their economic demographic. 

9 minutes ago, Islandboy said:

The box I bought just 3 years ago is now the best investment I’ve ever made 😆

Yeah, 300% return in 3 years. Like tulip fever. 

  • Like 4
Posted

I mean they last about 10 seconds on shelves. Now they might last a minute. They should be atleast 5x more than the latest price. 

  • Like 1
Posted
9 hours ago, NSXCIGAR said:

After smoking BHK 54s all week, albeit ROTT, I can say that I might pay the pre-cigarmageddon Cuba price of $46 for them. I also might not. And yes, they are very good. But $46 is a lot of money for a cigar. 

Maybe I'm just a cheap bastard that's clearly not in their economic demographic. 

$46 is pre-pre cigarmageddon. I never saw them sub $100, 2020 to now (also really low availability even at $100+).

This is while Esplendidos and Siglo VI were $35-$40 and CPE was $50.

Posted
16 minutes ago, Bijan said:

$46 is pre-pre cigarmageddon. I never saw them sub $100, 2020 to now (also really low availability even at $100+).

This is while Esplendidos and Siglo VI were $35-$40 and CPE was $50.

Now, they were in the 20's pre-pre cigarmageddon.  23/29/33 if I recall correctly.   Price moved from that onwards starting in May 2021 I believe.

Posted
5 minutes ago, Monterey said:

Now, they were in the 20's pre-pre cigarmageddon.  23/29/33 if I recall correctly. 

Oh yeah so to be clear, I'm saying that around mid/summer 2020, Espies, Siglo VI, and CPE were at the prices I quoted, and BHK were $100+.

Yes, when BHK were $50 the prices you give for those 3 sound right.

My main point is that 2020 prices weren't the same as 2003-2018/2019 prices. But that current prices are more of an increase since 2020, than 2020 was vs 2003.

Posted
On 4/28/2023 at 7:42 AM, El Presidente said:

Distributor prices have certainly shot through the roof. 

Tabacuba to HSA. Not sure to what extent. 

Not sure it really matters as Cubatabaco is 50% of HSA. The Cuban govt have their snouts firmly in the price rise trough. 

Oh yeah, no disagreement on the first point.

But the 50/50 split has never made much sense to me, beyond avoiding financial sanctions. Technically, Tabacuba should never be able to get their hands on their half of HSA's yearly revenues, hence the wholesaler/retailer split. We've seen Tabacuba and HSA far more in lock step since the purchase than ever before, but they still aren't actually the same. I could see that becoming a potential fracture point in the future. Tabacuba(and the military officials that leach off them) get sick of seeing cigars stack up in Havana and they say "screw it" and reset the on island prices to whatever they feel like. I'm being optimistic, but it is a potential crack in the current system. 

23 hours ago, charlieminato said:

Hong Kong increased tobacco taxes at the end of February, which would have been after the Jan. 1 price increase. 

Ever since the global pricing standard was announced, I've been fascinated by how Habanos S.A. would keep up the mirage if Hong Kong increased taxes. 

Hong Kong taxes cigars by weight, which makes it even more hilarious if the global price standard based on Hong Kong prices was actually what was happening.

I should have been more specific. When is said "Hong Kong" I was referring to the new 50% owners of HSA. Not the whole territory. Its not a coincidence that the new ownership group is based there and they choose to peg world wide prices to that market. They were clearly sick of the mainlanders sucking up massive volumes of cigars in Havana before they could ever get to the ultra high tax markets. It didn't work, even at the new prices it appears to be the same as it ever was down there. 

Posted
23 minutes ago, Bijan said:

 

Yes, when BHK were $50 the prices you give for those 3 sound right.

 

The prices I gave were for BHK.  In late 2020 they went to 35/47/51

  • Like 1
Posted
29 minutes ago, Monterey said:

The prices I gave were for BHK.  In late 2020 they went to 35/47/51

Oh ok, maybe I'm thinking of what they ended up costing on secondary market and some vendors. I definitely saw $1,000 a box retail before 2022.

Edit: I didn't go to Cuba 2020 onwards, but I would have paid $50 for a single if that was possible outside of Cuba. I remember that was not the case. But maybe I'm remembering a later time.

Edit 2: yeah, those look like Cuba prices. Siglo VI and CPE were also $29 and $31 vs Espies at $33 in Cuba then, but wasn't so much the case outside Cuba.

Posted
59 minutes ago, KnightsAnole said:

If I saw someone smoking those cigars today, I wouldn’t think, wow, that guy must be rich or wow, that guy must have connections, I would think wow that guy’s a sucker. That’s what these price increases have done, in general, to a once loyal patronage, they’ve made suckers out of customers. Well- some of us at least.

I concur. When they were less than 100 a stick, I wouldn't necessarily think that. Maybe a guy celebrating a mile stone, lucky enough to have sourced a box. Now, it's like the people who buy the rainbow diamond flavored rolexes. I think sucker. 

  • Like 2
Posted
35 minutes ago, dominattorney said:

I concur. When they were less than 100 a stick, I wouldn't necessarily think that. Maybe a guy celebrating a mile stone, lucky enough to have sourced a box. Now, it's like the people who buy the rainbow diamond flavored rolexes. I think sucker. 

Those who are able to procure a Rolex Rainbow Daytona for msrp 100K, can instantly flip it for 450K or more. I would tend to say "sucker", but there will ALWAYS be people who have unlimited amounts of money to "burn". I surely am not one. These types will always buy into the FOMO mentality whether a Behike is $300, $500 or $1000 per stick. 

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