Large215 Posted October 18, 2014 Share Posted October 18, 2014 As my knowledge of cigars is expanded extremely from being a part of FOH which is a great place to learn and meet great people but I was wondering if smoking vintage cigars from the 70s 80s and so on is there still favor and complexity or is it just a smooth tobacco flavor .aka hot air is it worth the hunt and the money for them please common with your thoughts and experiences Thanks dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Rye Posted October 18, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted October 18, 2014 I've been very fortunate to have great friends who have shared some incredible vintage cigars with me. The 1980's Monte I smoked recently was anything but bland and weak. Ultra smooth, but still bursting with layered flavours from the first draw. Buying can be tricky, as you have no control over storage conditions or provenance, but when they're good, it's a treat. I am happy I waited until I was more experienced in getting to know my palate before venturing into really well aged stuff, and I can't justify spending fortunes on aged stock while I'm still "young" and able to age my own. Whenever I do get a gift of something great, I am truly grateful for the experiences it brings. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotusguy Posted October 18, 2014 Share Posted October 18, 2014 Well stored, cigars can last almost indefinitely. Flavors evolve and generally smoothe out but I've had 1930s Clear Havanas that still showed evolution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradbrennan Posted October 18, 2014 Share Posted October 18, 2014 I know everybody thinks Cigar Aficionado is highly distorted but their connoisseur corner has a nice description! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dvickery Posted October 18, 2014 Share Posted October 18, 2014 i have never bought or chased vintage cigars much ... if they fall into your lap for about the same price as a similar young cigar being the exception . always aged my own cigars and pretty much all pedestrian (single banded or no band ) smokes at that ... pretty happy with what i have 20 years into my journey . large ... i would highly recommend aging your own and not chasing vintage ... but thats just me . derrek 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
earthson Posted October 18, 2014 Share Posted October 18, 2014 I've never spent the coin on seriously old smokes because of the chance they might have passed their prime. The oldest I've bought (lately) have been from the late 90s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StingMeadery Posted October 18, 2014 Share Posted October 18, 2014 In my experience Vintage stock must come from sources where they have been guaranteed as having been correctly stored. ...otherwise you can easily end up with expensive "ghosts" ...transparent dimensionless examples of their former selves Vintage cigars can be the very best...or the very worst ! ...You rolls the dice and you takes your chances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habana Mike Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 I'll reiterate the above in that aged/vintage cigars can possess great qualities and be quite enjoyable (and perhaps worth the coin based on someone's particular circumstances). For this to be true though they need to have been good/great cigars to start with as has been said many times, a bad stick (i.e. poor blend/flavors or lack of) will still be a bad stick with age. They need to have been properly cared for and they need to be monitored so one knows when they've peaked. Poorly kept cigars and cigars without the necessary 'legs' will lose whatever key characteristics they possessed initially. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duxnutz Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 I love well aged and vintage (10+) smokes but usually only purchase when I stumble (or a friend does) and get a chance to examine the box. Bought some of the well circulated Magnum 46s (2005) and they're just warm, bland air to smoke. I've been lucky enough to get hold of some cigars (898s, lusi etc) that recent examples seem to be blended differently. Definitely chase down some of those should they come up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Large215 Posted October 19, 2014 Author Share Posted October 19, 2014 I've been very fortunate to have great friends who have shared some incredible vintage cigars with me. The 1980's Monte I smoked recently was anything but bland and weak. Ultra smooth, but still bursting with layered flavours from the first draw. Buying can be tricky, as you have no control over storage conditions or provenance, but when they're good, it's a treat. I am happy I waited until I was more experienced in getting to know my palate before venturing into really well aged stuff, and I can't justify spending fortunes on aged stock while I'm still "young" and able to age my own. Whenever I do get a gift of something great, I am truly grateful for the experiences it brings. rye respect your opinion a lot seen you on Instagram and also on the form thanks for your insight there's just a lot of cigar sizes they don't make anymore that I'm on the hunt for and also I've only been smoking Cuban cigars for about two years so curious about age cigars it's ripping me up inside lol thanks again brother 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mk05 Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 Highly recommend understanding the hobby throughout and your palate first before diving into the unknown. Unknown because you don't know the provenance if you didn't do it yourself, regardless of what is told to you. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Large215 Posted October 19, 2014 Author Share Posted October 19, 2014 here my two wineadors and there 5 Desktop humidors some where floating around lol I been aged cigars for about 5yr-nc's it's only about 2yrs on the cc side of things I been smoking on and off since my 20s it's the pass 5yrs I been taking it seriously Thanks for every one insight on it please more comments I love reading other peoples opinions on all sides 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habano Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 large ... i would highly recommend aging your own and not chasing vintage ... but thats just me . Excellent and sound advice here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybermadhatter Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 Some of the best cigars I have sampled have been cigars from the 70's 80's and 90's, but they were all classics, and kept pristine by trusted botl's. Cohiba corona OR coro 80's monte 2 96 hu Connie 1 94 RASS 70's boli pc 60's hdm dc Dunhill varaderos 1985 monte Especiales Diplo 7's Green box sir Winnies...to name a few. All produced before I started the cuban cigar journey. The generosity of brothers either handed them out or ppp'd them. There were some others that were musty or dry or muted, but overall many winners, even some of the mm smokes from the 70's and 80's. Provenance and storage is everything. Hard to believe that 04 is ten years ago. To me, vintage is pre 1995. There are still some vendors with old stock, or ones that come into old stock, but I would not buy unless I sampled the cigars and trust the vendor. I enjoy my 2013's and my 1998-on cigars too much to bankrupt myself on cigars that may or may not be to my liking. I do not chase anything but appreciate the sharing of others, and will share mine in a heartbeat. I am herfing as I write this, and someone gave me a 97 slr lonsdale and a 1984 RASS. I already had old sticks ready to give him even before his gesture. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordAnubis Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 I've smoked some aged (28 years old is the oldest) and lots of recent. My opinion is its a matter of preference. Some people like a milder and smoother cigar. For them, an aged cigar is great. I personally prefer the rough and hairyness of a young cigar. I bought a few box of old cigars at a good price so i bought them. I wouldn't hunt and pay 1000 dollars for an aged box either. At the end of the day the enjoyment all also depends on what everyone else has said before... good cigar to begin with and stored in good conditions. Just like they do today, Cuba could and would make a **** box of cigars back in the 80s.... maybe that's why the box of cigars is still around and hasn't been sold/smoked yet !?!?!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hash Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 Not all cigars age well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainQuintero Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 I guess there is something in what you said about trying to find boxes before they vanish completely. Some of the classics that were deleted after the millennium really are worth (Imo) chasing. Partagas Astorias, Coronas, Lonsdale, seleccion privada #1 Diplomatico 1345 Quai d'Orsay Panetela, Gran Corona Sancho Panza Molinos, Corona H.Upmann #1, Lonsdale ERDM coronas, pc, gde, elegantes, gran corona LGC #1 Partagas sdc 123 It's a risk when buying cigars always but if you do your research, find out good retailers etc then you can still get these classics. If you don't enjoy them your going to have zero worry moving them on too Imo unless money is no issue, and you can't simply walk into a London or Geneva store and pick up something and pick up a safe bet for storage and provenance, it's far more of a safe bet to chase the dwindling classics than true vintage cigars Unless that's what you want to do, how you enjoy the hobby is completely down to you! If you enjoy the chase off vintages then go for it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeypots Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 I love well aged and vintage (10+) smokes but usually only purchase when I stumble (or a friend does) and get a chance to examine the box. Bought some of the well circulated Magnum 46s (2005) and they're just warm, bland air to smoke. I've been lucky enough to get hold of some cigars (898s, lusi etc) that recent examples seem to be blended differently. Definitely chase down some of those should they come up. The '05 Mag 46 were notorious for being dogs. A good example of a cigar that should age well that didn't because it was not a good cigar to begin with. '08s another story. I have been given a few tremendous old smokes. An '86 Sir Winston comes to mind. Potent tobacco with a smooth depth, it was a real treat. Bolivar, Cohiba, Monte Cristo, and Partagas make up the lions share of my humidor and they all benefit from some age. But like the '05 Mag 46, a **** Monte 2 is a **** Monte 2, even at 6 years. Buying old stock is a poor gamble unless you are dealing with the big guys in the business who have long histories of cigar experience. Like the places in London. Watch your wallet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbibby Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 I had some wonderful 05 Mag 46, but I have had some terrible ones as well. That said, like others, I would not buy vintage unless I got to sample or trusted my vendors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post PigFish Posted October 19, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted October 19, 2014 I think every cigar you purchase is a risk. You are the only one that can assess that risk and correlate it to a budget. I suppose if I had unlimited resources I would likely toss more money towards lost cigars. Cigars are a passion and a major interest of mine. I am a 'proletariat' cigar smoker and have always been. My niche, has been in finding the best cigars for the least money, so that I can gander the greatest amount of "great" smoking time. I have had my share of aged and vintage cigars. When contrasted to some (collectors) I am a rank amateur. In comparison to many others, I may be way ahead. So I have to ask, is it the comparisons, the experience, the fine taste, or the image that one pushes vintage cigars? They are certainly not all good! In some cases, a single can cost the same as an entire box of current production. Are they worth that to you? Frankly, not to me! If the cost of one cigar rivals the cost of a box and you are budgeted for a box a month, is it then a wise choice? That is a question that only you can answer. Why would I say that smoking experience is ever a bad thing? I suppose only when I have assessed that hype and undue influence has an effect on the decision to experience. I think that pursuing aged cigars is overrated. I have found that through experience. There are plenty of good cigars being made, not as many in the sizes that I prefer, but again, that is a matter of taste. I like the cigars of past years, but it is not the years that I covet, but the cigars themselves. The age is meaningless to me! For me, I bought them and smoked them fresh. I have them now because I hoarded some! Ultimately, there are no cigars that are worth over a certain amount to me. Again, that level would likely change with the value I place on money itself. But in a broad sense, I still see a cigar as a bunch of rolled leaves. As their market cost exceeds that of staples in my life, my interest in them will wane. Cigars are not worth 'any' price! The experience of smoking one then is also not worth 'any' price. As in all things cigars, you will have to make the 'any price' determination for yourself. Rest assured however, that in my opinion, you will not get 5 or 10 or 20 times the smoking experience by paying 5 or 10 or 20 times what an average cigar costs. You will maybe get a great cigar for your money. Yet again you may get a lousy one! You will get to check the box and say, "I have smoked one of those," if that is important to you. Is that important to you? Like many of us, if you honestly evaluate the taste to the cost, you will likely be happier buying cigars that you like today and buying a few extra to keep until tomorrow! I could be wrong. I have known 1 or 2 cigar a month smokers that smoked only the very rare. They were smoking collectors. We all have our niche. I am a cigar smoker. I want a great cigar every time I choose to smoke. Who made it, when it was made, what color box it comes in, etc., etc., etcetera… means precious little to me. What matters is that I can afford to burn it up and I like the way it tastes while I am burring it up! Cheers! -Piggy 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGC Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 I was going to post some points, but Ray said everything I would say. I won't reiterate what's been said over and over already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PigFish Posted October 20, 2014 Share Posted October 20, 2014 I was going to post some points, but Ray said everything I would say. I won't reiterate what's been said over and over already. Considering the turnover in membership, a comment from someone like you Brandon is never trite! -Ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dimmers Posted October 20, 2014 Share Posted October 20, 2014 great post Ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PapaDisco Posted October 20, 2014 Share Posted October 20, 2014 I've had generally good experiences with buying from the PCC aged program. That's typically stuff that's 10-15 years old and sometimes less. It's about double the price of the same box of current production, so from a time-value-of-money point of view a doubling in 10 years is not so bad. I'm newish to the hobby to, so I buy multiple boxes of current stuff, one to enjoy and one or two to lay down, and then add a few of the aged program boxes. I haven't' traded for any aged nor have I bought any from private sources; just the goodies that Rob inspects. I'm different from Lord A, in that I like very few fresh-off-the-boat cigars. While there are quite a few that I do enjoy (Punch DC's 2012, Punch Punch 2013, Sir Winstons 2014, etc.), in general I fall in with the camp that says let them all sit 3-5 years and call that a 'current' cigar. IMHO, that 3-5 year rest smooths out just about everything, not absolutely everything, but nearly so. Gone are those final thirds that get too harsh to smoke, or the odd jab to the palate. Flavors are still intense and complexity is not lost. With the 10-15 year old aged stuff from PCC/Rob, the palette of flavors remain equally broad and complex, but the smoking experience tends to be even gentler on the palate, and the undercurrent of tobacco flavor that is the backbone carrying all the others in a new smoke, is quite diminished. So I've been very happy with the smaller part of my collection that I've bought already old: HdM Churchills, Punch Churchills, Punch DC's, Punch Punch and a few others. I would recommend the PCC aged program as a way to plump up a relatively new humidor with a few golden oldies, but spend the majority of my coin on new production stuff that I hold for 20 years. Buy everything 3 boxes at a time or more! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dvickery Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 Somehow or 'nother I ended up reading this thread again . Some really good info here that should not be lost and old enough that there is probably a ton of people now that haven't read it . Derrek 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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