Help! Beetle Damage in a Box of Hoyo DC

[Grimlock]

I received a box of Hoyo DC from a respected vendor today (not FOH). Upon opening the box I noticed a lot of tobacco dust. I inspected the sticks and found 7 with visible beetle damage and one beetle. I reached out to the vendor for a resolution and am waiting to hear back. The box is currently in the freezer at 0 degrees F. The box was in transit for roughly 7 days and was inspected before it was shipped. It arrived opened with additional padding. My questions for the group: With almost 1/3 of the box having visible damage, what are the chances the remaining sticks have internal damage from beetles that have not yet emerged? How long should the box stay frozen to be 100% sure any remaining are dead? Is it possible for a single beetle to hatch and do this damage in 7 days of transit? What would you do in this situation? Thanks in advance.

[Greenhorn2]

Now that will make a grown man cry!

[NSXCIGAR]

Vendor should handle that no questions asked. Accept box back for full refund or credit you for the damaged sticks if you want to keep the undamaged ones. 

If there aren't any visible holes freezing for 3 days will kill anything inside. You'll never know you're smoking a dead beetle or cracked egg. We've all done it and never known.

Your vendor is lazy and doesn't inspect anything. You can usually see the tell-tale fine brown powder pretty easily if you just open the lid. I can clearly see it on the lower lip of the box lid. I'd be pretty concerned with a vendor that lazy. 

[dominattorney]

9 hours ago, NSXCIGAR said:

Vendor should handle that no questions asked. Accept box back for full refund or credit you for the damaged sticks if you want to keep the undamaged ones. 

If there aren't any visible holes freezing for 3 days will kill anything inside. You'll never know you're smoking a dead beetle or cracked egg. We've all done it and never known.

Your vendor is lazy and doesn't inspect anything. You can usually see the tell-tale fine brown powder pretty easily if you just open the lid. I can clearly see it on the lower lip of the box lid. I'd be pretty concerned with a vendor that lazy. 

I agree with this. I would try to get a refund for the damaged sticks and freeze the rest. Is it possible for this to have occurred in transit though? I would think not. 

[Rhinoww]

Can you play a flute?

seriously the vendor should make this right. Is that a new box, hard these days. A pro rata credit well that works for a box you were definitely  going to smoke. It does remove your option of reselling later  I had a damaged cab of 50 Hoyo DC. About 10 sticks had damage to their feet. Seller gave me a partial credit on my next purchase (which has yet to happen for a host of shipping and supply issues. At the time It seemed fair, but shipping from that country became problematic. Oh well, just cigars but all still smokable for me.
 

regardless, deep freeze for three or so days should do wonders for the undamaged sticks. 

[SCgarman]

13 hours ago, NSXCIGAR said:

Vendor should handle that no questions asked. Accept box back for full refund or credit you for the damaged sticks if you want to keep the undamaged ones. 

If there aren't any visible holes freezing for 3 days will kill anything inside. You'll never know you're smoking a dead beetle or cracked egg. We've all done it and never known.

Your vendor is lazy and doesn't inspect anything. You can usually see the tell-tale fine brown powder pretty easily if you just open the lid. I can clearly see it on the lower lip of the box lid. I'd be pretty concerned with a vendor that lazy. 

FWIW some vendors ship sealed boxes by default, unless you specify they open and inspect the cigars. This may have been a sealed box

[Ford2112]

OP said it was inspected prior to shipping. If that's the case this should have never left the vendor.

[dms99]

I've ordered boxes from multiple online vendors (NOT FOH) that were opened & "inspected" and still sent with mold on them. I'm not sure if they bother to thoroughly inspect them or just don't care and send them anyways. I reached out to both of them and they gave me partial refunds. However beetles are a different story. Those suckers can ruin the rest of the cigars in your humidor if not careful.

And I've had an instance where I unknowingly brought back cigars from an LCDH with beetles in them. Once i noticed them I isolated the infected ones and froze them but put the ones that I thought were beetle free in my humidor. Within a few days I started getting beetle holes in the cigars I just bought and some of my old stock. I ended up having to scrub down my entire humidor and freeze everything. That was a frustrating situation. The lesson I learned is that even if you don't see holes in the other cigars they still may have beetles or a larva in them.

[Monterey]

On 4/21/2023 at 9:36 AM, Ford2112 said:

OP said it was inspected prior to shipping. If that's the case this should have never left the vendor.

No, the OP was questioning if the vendor really inspected them.  He asked if was reasonable that withing 7 days the vendor noticed nothing, but then a beetle emerged and did all that damage.  Else the vendor didn't inspect or care.  Good to get facts prior to accusing the vendor.

[SCgarman]

3 hours ago, dms99 said:

I've ordered boxes from multiple online vendors (NOT FOH) that were opened & "inspected" and still sent with mold on them. I'm not sure if they bother to thoroughly inspect them or just don't care and send them anyways. I reached out to both of them and they gave me partial refunds. However beetles are a different story. Those suckers can ruin the rest of the cigars in your humidor if not careful.

And I've had an instance where I unknowingly brought back cigars from an LCDH with beetles in them. Once i noticed them I isolated the infected ones and froze them but put the ones that I thought were beetle free in my humidor. Within a few days I started getting beetle holes in the cigars I just bought and some of my old stock. I ended up having to scrub down my entire humidor and freeze everything. That was a frustrating situation. The lesson I learned is that even if you don't see holes in the other cigars they still may have beetles or a larva in them.

The lesson should be play it safe. FREEZE all incoming boxes. Does no harm to taste or cigars, and can prevent disaster. 

[KCCubano]

Given all of the blackouts going on right now I am freezing all sticks originating in Cuba. 

[Grimlock]

Thanks for all of the feedback. The box is resting in the freezer for a few more days. I'll keep them isolated from everything else once they come out, just to be on the safe side. The vendor believes the staff didn't inspect as thoroughly as they should and he spoke with them about it. He is providing a refund equivalent to the value of 10 sticks. Hopefully there are no issues with the rest of the box.

[Ford2112]

9 hours ago, Monterey said:

No, the OP was questioning if the vendor really inspected them.  He asked if was reasonable that withing 7 days the vendor noticed nothing, but then a beetle emerged and did all that damage.  Else the vendor didn't inspect or care.  Good to get facts prior to accusing the vendor.

I read it wrong I thought it said inspected it was respected . I'm blind as a bat. 😎🦇

[NSXCIGAR]

7 hours ago, KCCubano said:

Given all of the blackouts going on right now I am freezing all sticks originating in Cuba. 

Had one today 2:00-2:30pm. Not being in an elevator when it hits is like Russian roulette, or should I say Cuban roulette.

[Rhinoww]

18 hours ago, Grimlock said:

Thanks for all of the feedback. The box is resting in the freezer for a few more days. I'll keep them isolated from everything else once they come out, just to be on the safe side. The vendor believes the staff didn't inspect as thoroughly as they should and he spoke with them about it. He is providing a refund equivalent to the value of 10 sticks. Hopefully there are no issues with the rest of the box.

Glad you got a fair compromise.
 

Depending on the hole pattern, I’ll go out on a limb and suggest you consider smoking the damaged sticks. A strategically placed post it while smoking can aid in draw issues if you don’t have any cigar glue handy (I’m sure there are other tricks perhaps w wax but I’m not familiar). Beyond a possible pop, I’m betting you want notice a thing beyond an enjoyable stick. 
 

I had a custom roll last year that arrived with a telltale hole. No other sticks in that shipment showed wrapper issues and all were immediately frozen for several days. I have checked on that batch several times since and no damage, although I did segregate and seal that shipment with a boveda. The seller replaced the damaged stick  immediately. My exit hole was in the first half inch of a larger vitola, so I simply cut that portion off and enjoyed the cigar. It tasted just as expected. No pops, just the cigar I had ordered. 
A bit of effort and you might enjoy those sticks. Would I pass them out at a HERF, that’s a no. But a random Tuesday on my porch, they would be enjoyed. 

[ATGroom]

Freezing for three days is a bit excessive - at typical domestic freezer temperatures of -18°C (0°F) you would have killed the beetle in all its lifecycle stages in four hours or sooner. Not that there is any harm in freezing for longer. https://www.cubancigarwebsite.com/cigar-pests.pdf

The beetle in the picture looks dead. If that is the case, then the most likely place that the damage would have happened is in Cuba, as that is where there is the most chance of it sitting somewhere unrefrigerated for a long period due to power outages, fuel shortages for transport etc etc. If so there is every chance that it happened before the box was frozen.

At proper storage temps, everything including eggs should be dead in six weeks, so in the event that the box was never frozen in Cuba then one would hope that the time it spent in the distributor and retailer warehouses would have killed off everything.

If the beetle pictured was alive then the damage would have happened in transit and points to a serious failure in storage at both the retailer and distributor.

Although either way it's not a great look for them as if the damage did happen in Cuba then they still failed to inspect, which you would hope they would do especially on a high end box like DCs.

[BrightonCorgi]

On 4/23/2023 at 12:09 AM, NSXCIGAR said:

Had one today 2:00-2:30pm. Not being in an elevator when it hits is like Russian roulette, or should I say Cuban roulette.

Stick the stairs and try to get rear facing room towards the ends of the hotel.

[alex1126]

Do the beetle remains affect the flavor in any way?

[Chibearsv]

3 hours ago, alex1126 said:

Do the beetle remains affect the flavor in any way?

Tastes like chicken 

[NSXCIGAR]

8 hours ago, BrightonCorgi said:

Stick the stairs and try to get rear facing room towards the ends of the hotel.

7 floors, easier said than done. Especially with bags...

[NSXCIGAR]

5 hours ago, alex1126 said:

Do the beetle remains affect the flavor in any way?

Don't you know that's the secret ingredient in Behike? 

[El Presidente]

That's  a refund (full) and an apology. 

[BrightonCorgi]

8 hours ago, NSXCIGAR said:

7 floors, easier said than done. Especially with bags...

Never go higher than a fire truck ladder.