Does any credibility remain in Boxing?

[El Presidente]

it was a an excellent bout yesterday between local lad Horn V Pacquiao.

Beautiful blue sky Sunday, perfect weather. 50,000 people at Suncorp Stadium.  Pay Per View blockbuster 

The fight stats. 

 

 

From the above you get a unanimous decision to Horn  (115-113 x 2, 117-111)

Now it could be said that Pacquiao threw all his punches in the final 5 rounds. He didn't. 

Beautifully set up for the rematch in front of 50,000 again.  One can assume "set up" being the operative words. 

[Fuzz]

Yeah, well, they had to do something to draw in the crowd. Can't have just one match where Pacquiao walks all over Horn.

[JohnS]

I found a great website that answers this question! 

http://www.oxymoronlist.com

[anacostiakat]

Yea.  That was a horrendous decision. 

[Ken Gargett]

didn't see it but had a few mates there. one thought it should have probably gone Pac's way but was not much fussed either way. looking forward to hearing thoughts from others.

but boxing has been seriously dodgy for a very long time. that said, didn't need a dodgy decision to get the crowd. think they could have sold it several times over.

people have claimed home town decision but the judges were two americans and an argentinian so no idea how that works. which does not mean that it was not a dodgy call by the refs.

and stats can be deceiving. i'll bet if you pull up the stats for the rumble in the jungle, one would assume foreman thrashed ali.

but it did seem odd.

 

[wabashcr]

In the US, the decision was met with ridicule, disbelief, and of course the usual dose of parochialism that accompanies any questionable boxing decision that occurs outside the US.  Of course, two of the three judges, including the one with the preposterous 117-111 card, were Americans.  The third was an Argentine.  The thinking is that fighters can't get a fair shake when traveling outside the US to another fighter's home nation.  But it's ridiculous to think this was some kind of Aussie conspiracy to screw Pacquiao.  If anyone set up Pacquiao, it was his own promoter, Bob Arum.  He's one of the few people in the sport with the power to fix a decision in such a high-profile fight.  And he's the only one who truly had anything to gain by doing it.  

The fight itself was good.  It was a lot more fun than anyone expected.  Huge credit to Horn for continuing to come forward for 12 rounds, eating Pac's counters, and forcing the action.  He clearly made Pac uncomfortable, and did what the bigger man should do in boxing.  Of course the other side of that is that was by far the worst version of Pacquiao we've ever seen.  He didn't seem to be able to move laterally the way he used to, which meant he got caught with more big shots than usual.  5 years ago Pac probably stops a guy like Horn without breaking a sweat, much like he did Hatton.  He clearly doesn't have the power to finish a true welterweight.  He probably belongs at 135, maybe 140, but 147 is a stretch for him these days.  Made Horn look like a middleweight.

I thought Pacquiao's countering and defense were enough to win the fight.  The Compubox stats certainly back that up.  I felt Horn won 4 rounds, possibly 5, but no more.  And you could have scored the 9th as a 10-8 for Pac, although I did not.  I didn't think the rounds I gave Pacquiao were particularly close, either.  I had it 116-112, but 115-113 seems fair.  I honestly don't see how anyone could score it for Horn, but that's boxing.  117-111 is a complete farce, but it wasn't even the worst card of the weekend (that would go to the three judges who gave Robert Easter Jr a shutout 120-108 hometown win over Denis Shafikov Friday night, in a fight Shafikov probably won, or at least drew).  

So as to the title question of this thread, no, of course there's no credibility in boxing.  It's run by greedy crooks, gangsters, and incompetent officials who can't even fake the appearance of propriety.  The biggest PPV of the year is about to be a guy who's been retired for 2 years fighting a guy from another sport.  But on the other hand, we just had Ward/Kovalev 2, and in a couple months we'll have Golovkin/Canelo.  It's not much, but it's something for boxing fans like me to cling to in dark times.

[Ken Gargett]

just had a note from a good mate who was in the 2nd row for the fight - "great fight. fair result".

for whatever that is worth.

[Duxnutz]

I really just find boxing dumb. 

[MahDooRow]

Doesn't Mayweather vs. McGregor scream "credibility"?  

 

[dominattorney]

In my opinion (which comes from fighting a few amateur bouts), boxing is only a sport when it is decided by TKO or knockout.  When you get to a decision, then it becomes something like figure skating, gymnastics, or interpretive dance where it comes down to the individual biases of the judges (one of them scored a complete outlier in favor of Horn by like 10 points, what a joke).  I can't really call "robbery" on the 113-115 scores, but to be honest, they did surprise me when I heard them. 

[Danimalia]

I used to be a boxing fan. A casual fan to be sure, but I bought the big fights on PPV and watched the cable shows. I very much prefer watching boxing to MMA. But MMA has a lot of advantages, namely that they make the fights people want to see. How many years were people clamoring for Mayweather/Pac, only for them to find excuses not to do it until they had aged past the point where it would have been truly compelling? 

The Canelo/GGG fight should be interesting.

[cigaraholic]

NO

[luv2fly]

No and I don't think there ever was any to begin with...

Don King comes to mind.

[westg]

Horn was way ahead on the head butt count...I thought it was an ugly fight.

[Chuckmejia]

The funniest part was Horn trying to call out Mayweather for a fight. Poor guy, he must have suffered some serious head trauma. 

Pacquiao won that fight tho.

[Ken Gargett]

i will say that boxing has far more credibility than our current tennis players. i see scumbag suddenly picked up some dreadful injury (or rather is now claiming he had to suffer it for ages) and withdraws. again. i'm sure being down 2 sets was immaterial. of course, the injury was not too bad to risk playing in some exhibition games last week but that was for big dosh.

when will they simply ban this grub?

checked out all the comments on one of the sites - every single one was anti-him. seems people are finally getting utterly sick of him. previously, there were all manner of people defending him. no longer.

[vladdraq]

8 hours ago, MahDooRow said:

Doesn't Mayweather vs. McGregor scream "credibility"?  

 

Of Course! I just hope McGregor lose his temper and knocks Mayweather out with a leg kick. 

[havanaclub]

Of Course! I just hope McGregor lose his temper and knocks Mayweather out with a leg kick. 

Now that would be hilarious.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[vladdraq]

38 minutes ago, havanaclub said:

 

Now that would be hilarious.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

well, just remember Mayweather vs Ortiz fight. 

[wabashcr]

Horn was way ahead on the head butt count...I thought it was an ugly fight.

I didn't think the head butts were egregious. Any time you have a southpaw against an orthodox fighter trading in close quarters, you're going to have head clashes. Didn't think Horn led with his head on purpose. Also didn't have a problem with Horn punching on the break. Thought Pacquiao was quick to look for the break, when the referee wanted them to fight out of it.

Watched it again without the sound of the very pro-Pacquiao commentary, and I still don't have Horn winning. I could understand judges favoring Horn's style of pressing the action, but I don't see how that wins him rounds when he's being outlanded 2-1, and quite frankly, outboxed.

All that said, Horn was impressive. Showed great heart and will, and he earned the respect of the boxing community around the world. He should definitely have a say in the welterweight division moving forward. I hope he'll travel, because there are some nice fights for him, including but not limited to a Pacquiao rematch. Would be surprised if it happens in Oz again, just because Top Rank probably has other ideas. Aussie boxers haven't had much success lately coming to the US, but Horn definitely could be different. He's a bit awkward, but in a good way that makes him difficult to solve. I wouldn't want to fight him, but hopefully he gets more big fights to prove himself.

[Munts]

Personally i dont really see the point in boxing. If this happened in a pub carpark at 2am im pretty sure there would be no ticker tape parade or keys to the city given out.

In regards to the debate around who should have won. It presents a strong case for bringing back a fight-to-the-death rule - at least there can be no disputing the outcome.

Make it fight to the death. Triple the Pay-per-view fee. Would rake in the money!!

[David88]

I didn't think horn won but these things happen, it wasn't totally one sided in my opinion and I thought Pacquiao could have done more. 

As for the credibility of boxing... As others have said too, I think any credibility boxing had went flying out the window when the Mayweather Mcgregor fight was announced! 

[Sean3]

I all but gave up on boxing when Holyfield and Lewis fought.  Lewis won decisively, haven't order a PPV boxing event since.  I do watch MMA however, it hasn't devolved to the point of boxing...yet!

[dicko]

I think the "10 point must" and the "round by round" scoring system has a lot to answer for. Often means unfair results. I hate how conservative judges are with 10-8 rounds. I would rather see some other type of scale with more room to move for the judges. 

Regarding round by round, I also do not like how someone can 'kind of' win 7 out of 12 rounds and get thrashed for 5 rounds and still win. This ties back into the 10-9 system. A global scoring system with some various criteria being looked at would be better. I will admit that boxing in particular (12 rounds that is) would be harder to judge than a 3 or 4 round mma or muay thai fight. 

The problem is that that system is completely ingrained anyway that's my little rant just a pet peeve of mine.

Joe Rogan has some interesting views on this.

[Winchester21]

I went to a bar to watch it. I lost interest early on and spent the rest of the evening laughing and joking with a nice group of young ladies. Does not sound like I missed much. Barring a knockout the decision was made well in advance. Would like to know how much money changed hands on the betting. I lost all faith in professional boxing years ago. Would rather watch the up and coming guys trying for a chance at a big fight. At least some of those are judged honestly