Cigars for the long haul

[BMWBen]

Prez's thread from the other day had me thinking, you regularly see posts on here about cigars from the 80's and 90's that people are still finding to be incredible smokes. What being produced today has the legs to age for the next 10, 20, 30 years and still retain a favorable flavor profile? Given that I've gotten into this hobby at a young age has me wanting to take advantage of the extra time I have on my side and put some stuff away for the long haul.

[dominattorney]

I'd say Montecristo Especial, Cohiba Lancero, Trinidad Fundadores, Punch Double Corona, Bolivar Corona Gigante, Partagas Lusitania....

 

I'd say anything with full body, or of larger profile. 

However, I've thoroughly enjoyed Monte #1-4 with 5-8 years on them as well. 

I've had a few 06 Lusis that have been out of this world good.  However, my favorite box at the moment is an 03 Punch Petite Corona del Punch. 
 

All things considered, if you're thinking about your collection long term, and trying to stash away a couple of really stellar boxes for the 5-15 year term, you would be most happy with something larger.  I'm waiting for a 2013 cab of Punch Double Coronas to turn 5 years old.  It will be the start of a lovely ten years of smoking.

[rhcolbert]

Parti lusi, punch D.C. Seconded!

 

[NSXCIGAR]

I don't think there's a cigar that ages poorly, per se. But in my experience Cohiba, Monte and PL seem to really benefit from extended rest since 2000. I must admit, so many cigars are so smokeable young, it's much harder for me to really get that motivated to age anything these days. Although there's no excuse for anyone not to have some aged PLPC in their humi.

[1LegLance]

I am going to go crotchty old man here (even though I am only 47, but been smoking seriously since 18)....

Nothing today will age the way the stuff from even the mid 90's will...plain and simple the genetics have changed. Different plants made much much stronger cigars back then.

I remember how a RyJ Cazadores was brutal fresh, almost unsmokable strong. How a PSD4 was so much black pepper I couldn't stand it. How you could really taste the difference between a Monte 2, Upman 2 & Diplo 2. How Bolivars could be traced on a curve as you put 1,2, 5, 10 yrs of age on them.

Oh and just in case you think I was a wuss then and burnt taste buds now....I have a good size circle of guys from then that I still smoke with and we all agree. I have always been a fan of Saint Luis Rey, Sancho Panza, Rafeal Gonzales, Bolivar, La Gloria Cubana....and oh how I miss so many great cigars from those lines.

Granted I love that so much of what I buy now is smokable within a year, but I miss taking newbies along for the journey of aging a stash of sticks.

[NSXCIGAR]

58 minutes ago, 1LegLance said:

I am going to go crotchty old man here (even though I am only 47, but been smoking seriously since 18)....

Nothing today will age the way the stuff from even the mid 90's will...plain and simple the genetics have changed. Different plants made much much stronger cigars back then.

I remember how a RyJ Cazadores was brutal fresh, almost unsmokable strong. How a PSD4 was so much black pepper I couldn't stand it. How you could really taste the difference between a Monte 2, Upman 2 & Diplo 2. How Bolivars could be traced on a curve as you put 1,2, 5, 10 yrs of age on them.

Oh and just in case you think I was a wuss then and burnt taste buds now....I have a good size circle of guys from then that I still smoke with and we all agree. I have always been a fan of Saint Luis Rey, Sancho Panza, Rafeal Gonzales, Bolivar, La Gloria Cubana....and oh how I miss so many great cigars from those lines.

Granted I love that so much of what I buy now is smokable within a year, but I miss taking newbies along for the journey of aging a stash of sticks.

Some good points. I alluded to it mentioning how much better cigars smoke fresh since 2000. Cigars prior really needed many years to reach the mellow smokeability they have ROTT today. There's no trace of harshness, ammonia or tannins in today's cigars. Some, like the Punch SS1/SS2 and RyJ Cazadores were near unsmokeably bitter and tannic for at least 3-4 years. I also recall those face-blasting PSD4s, harsh dark espresso Monte 2s, and the unbelievably strong, earthy Boli CEs. It wasn't a matter of improving with age. They simply weren't that enjoyable without that age. But after mellowing a bit, they were just so rich and tasty. So much character and flavor pouring out of those cigars. They  would take you on a wild ride, and you were left with no doubt that Cuban cigars were very special. I'm glad I got to experience them for a few years.

We also still don't really know how post-2000 cigars will hold up long term. It seems that much post-2000 production might be peaking around 7-10 years, particularly many of the ELs. Will there be another trough and a higher peak in 15-20 years? No one knows yet as the strains and processing methods have undergone so many changes in recent years.

[gmoney]

So as an example I have a 10 count box that I bought from our host never opened of partagas series D no. 4 box date 2008. Is it worth continuing to age them?  Or are they getting close to the point of diminishing returns???

[garbandz]

only one way to find out, and you know what that means...........

[canadianbeaver]

Great topic to start and must be others on the forum from 5 years ago, 7, 9, you get my drift.

Friends here enjoy 2002's so that's 15 years, a good length of time without being outrageous. Some smoke 2007's. Ten years ago, quite regularly. I love them.

As for twenty, thirty... time will tell. Might not have the leaves of the past but our technology to keep them is better.

Only obstacles are price, and choice.

CB

 

[BrightonCorgi]

Upmann Connoisseur is the first one to come to mind.  The last few were quite tannic I smoked which is a good sign for the long haul. 

[NSXCIGAR]

5 hours ago, gmoney said:

So as an example I have a 10 count box that I bought from our host never opened of partagas series D no. 4 box date 2008. Is it worth continuing to age them?  Or are they getting close to the point of diminishing returns???

It's time to try one. 9 years for a post-2000 cigar is plenty of time. If they're great, smoke one or two a year. If not, wait and try one again every two years. It'll be 20+ years by the time you get to the last one, and if they're not good by then, they never will be.

[joeypots]

Ten years? Just about everything.

20? Thats a long time and, as others have said, the change around '06 has yet to be tested long term.

30? I haven't got the funds and I'm too old to think about it. 

For my tastes, 5 years of box age well kept is a good starting point and I find  I smoke most cigars with between 5 and 10 years on them. There are always exceptions. I blew through a  box of PSD#4 last year that were 2013s. I sampled a box or 2013 MC#2 and was disappointed. I have a great looking cab of punch Punch, 13 I think. Smoking well now but have that thick smoke thing going on that warrants further ageing. I have found  good cigars at three years  can become great cigars at six years. This has been my expreience with Cohiba. Your experience may vary.

[cigaraholic]

I wish I could tell you buy this brand or that cigar for long term aging, those days are gone. Today it's down to boxes, they're not that many and hard to find. Today the amount of super high quality tobacco coming out of Cuba is down to a dribble and it can show up anywhere.

I'd either tell Rob what you like to smoke and have him look for a stunning box, or just let him pick out something he thinks has long legs. Otherwise hop on a plane to Spain and go digging around for yourself.

[Cep]

Can you expand on that?

You are saying that top quality tobacco is not used in all premium handmade cuban cigars? 

I've never understood the different quality levels of tobacco.  How is the top quality tobacco from Vuelta Abajo different from the tiers below it?  And how can u tell by looking at the leaves? 

 

 

[1LegLance]

So just as a background let me share how things work in the One Leg cigar world

Get in a box of something, smoke one  either that same day or if they feel/smell/seem too wet then wait a week or two (I run my humidors at 60-62% so things dry out quick and I often dry box if needed).

Based on that first cigar I make a note if I think I should keep smoking fresh, wait 2, 4 or 6 months. Based on the followup cigar I add more time or put them in the smoking rotation.

Every box of every marca has a life cycle of it's own. The days of just getting in a bundle of RyJ Cazadores and not touching them for a year are long gone.

Oh and please please know that NO ONE ELSE can tell you when YOUR cigars are ready. I have buddies that love a strong, young, tannic stick and others that want a smooth, mellow almost flavorish air cigar. That is fine, after all we have a hobby where we set what we love on fire

[BarryNY]

7 hours ago, gmoney said:

So as an example I have a 10 count box that I bought from our host never opened of partagas series D no. 4 box date 2008. Is it worth continuing to age them?  Or are they getting close to the point of diminishing returns???

I also got a cab of PSP 2008 PSD4 from Rob at an aged 24:24 sale in Oct.

I'd say smoke one right away to see if any more time will be worth it.

Comparing to the other 2008's I have (Monte #2 and RASS) I'd say the PSD4 is fully "ready to smoke"....

[Cep]

I have some 2010 d4s, id definitely be trying the 08s.  Mine are really lacking in strength / flavor.  But also very tight draw so that may be affecting them negatively.  

[gmoney]

First off thanks for all the info for everyone with experience in aged cigars. I have zero.  I should add some more info.  They are in the OLH and it's the oldest box of cigars I own.  It's it wierd that I feel some sort of sentimental value to them bc they are the oldest I have availabile?? On the other hand I've never smoked a cigar anywhere near that old so..... maybe it's time to try  ?

Cheers!

 

[BMWBen]

Thanks for the suggestions guys, I think all I have thats been mentioned so far is the Lusi's, RyJ Cazadores, and monte 2's but I have Montecristo Especial's, connie 1's, and PLPC on my list of what to look out for

[cigaraholic]

23 hours ago, Cep said:

Can you expand on that?

You are saying that top quality tobacco is not used in all premium handmade cuban cigars? 

I've never understood the different quality levels of tobacco.  How is the top quality tobacco from Vuelta Abajo different from the tiers below it?  And how can u tell by looking at the leaves? 

 

 

What I meant by "super high quality" is tobacco that produces cigars that can age beautifully for 15+ years. Back when dinosaurs roamed around and I started smoking CC's that was more the norm, now it's the exception. I know they can still do it because I have a few post 2000 boxes that will probably out live me, but not many.

 I wish you could tell by looking, but you have to put a match them. If I start a cigar and it's delicious and by halfway I'm wondering if I can finish it, I know I have something to lay down.