"Dutch Roll"

[JohnnyO]

Nope, not talking about cigars made in Holland. It's a recent phenomenon that I experienced on a couple of AA flights. The Dutch Roll sensation feels like a carnival ride in that it seems that plane is sliding to one side then to the other. It also feels like you are lifting out of your seat. This is at full speed and the plane has leveled off. This happened on a 737, can't remember the version. From what little info is available it is happening on various airlines and its very hush-hush. In one case, Southwest reported it months later once they were investigated for one of those dropping out of the sky incidents. Anybody experience this or have any further info? John

[Cigar Surgeon]

Exclusive to the Boeing 737 MAX 8/9 aircraft which were already notorious for two fatal crashes, door plug blowout, and now 'Dutch Rolls'.  I think we're rapidly approaching the point where the aircraft needs to be permanently grounded due to safety concerns.

[SCgarman]

My advice is to avoid Boeing aircraft at all costs...if you value your life. Which is more dysfunctional? Boeing or HSA? They seem tied for first place!

[Fuzz AI]

26 minutes ago, Cigar Surgeon said:

Exclusive to the Boeing 737 MAX 8/9 aircraft which were already notorious for two fatal crashes, door plug blowout, and now 'Dutch Rolls'.  I think we're rapidly approaching the point where the aircraft needs to be permanently grounded due to safety concerns.

Whilst a fairly rare event, any plane can suffer from a dutch roll, be it from wind conditions, airplane stability, or pilot input. Saying that this event is exclusive to the Max8/9 is a little false. Unless you know what it is when it happens, most people would just put it down to turbulence. In most cases, the plane should stabilise itself. The issue here is that there is unusual damage. Whether this is resulting from the incident or possibly the cause of it, remains to be seen.

[Cigar Surgeon]

3 minutes ago, Fuzz said:

Whilst a fairly rare event, any plane can suffer from a dutch roll, be it from wind conditions, airplane stability, or pilot input. Saying that this event is exclusive to the Max8/9 is a little false. Unless you know what it is when it happens, most people would just put it down to turbulence. In most cases, the plane should stabilise itself. The issue here is that there is unusual damage. Whether this is resulting from the incident or possibly the cause of it, remains to be seen.

You're absolutely right Fuzz. I should have phrased it that the latest Dutch Roll events are on a list of growing incidents with the MAX series aircraft.

[Chitmo]

I came here expecting to learn something new to try on the wife over the weekend, imagine my surprise 🤣 

[BrightonCorgi]

I thought this would be about dutch rolls at the Dampkring 😉

[NSXCIGAR]

10 hours ago, Chitmo said:

I came here expecting to learn something new to try on the wife over the weekend, imagine my surprise 🤣 

Nope, the only maneuver of that kind I'm aware of is the Dutch Oven but in both cases I would definitely recommend protective gear before attempting. 

10 hours ago, Cigar Surgeon said:

You're absolutely right Fuzz. I should have phrased it that the latest Dutch Roll events are on a list of growing incidents with the MAX series aircraft.

Has there been more than one of these events? I only read about the one Southwest flight.

[Fuzz AI]

1 hour ago, NSXCIGAR said:

Has there been more than one of these events? I only read about the one Southwest flight.

That has caused an incident? Yes. The last 2 reported incidents (2013 and 2015) caused fatalities.

That goes on without causing an incident? Probably. Just because it doesn't get reported in the media, doesn't mean it never occurs.

[NSXCIGAR]

20 minutes ago, Fuzz said:

That has caused an incident? Yes. The last 2 reported incidents (2013 and 2015) caused fatalities.

With other Boeings? The MAX wasn't in service until 2017. 

[Fuzz AI]

1 hour ago, NSXCIGAR said:

With other Boeings? The MAX wasn't in service until 2017. 

A reported incident with a Boeing 737? Not that I'm aware.

[Duxnutz]

Inherent in the design of swept wing aircraft. Most aircraft have a yaw damper that helps alleviate. May be inop and allowed to be deferred maintenance for a while. 
 

Were you down the back John? It’s significantly worse down the back. 

[teamrandr]

Sounds awful.

[helix]

On 6/22/2024 at 2:21 AM, SCgarman said:

My advice is to avoid Boeing aircraft at all costs...if you value your life. Which is more dysfunctional? Boeing or HSA? They seem tied for first place!

Almost impossible to avoid flying in a Boeing AC.

[Chas.Alpha]

Quote

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_roll

This is a pretty good article.

[Nevrknow]

After today, I'd yell just nose dive the damn thing. If I limp away I'm going to be mad as hell!

[Miguel Gracias]

https://youtu.be/9Gt-IcCBiQ4?si=0RIPiOauMc9DcYRz

This explains about dutch roll and so far best video about it IMO.

My flight instructor was talking about it when I was under training for commercial pilot. If yaw damper is INOP, I heard it’s pain in the ass to control the aircraft. 

[gormag38]

Yeah this all seems terrifying. We need to start holding these companies to a higher standard; hell start trying to prosecute if at all possible. May be the only way to get these companies to think about safety over the dollar.  

[NeoGeo]

I travel at least 2 weeks every month, typically more, and have never experienced one. I've been doing that type of travel for years now, and just find that it's much easier not to go into the different forums and talk about the problems with aircrafts. As someone mentioned, it's almost impossible to avoid flying in Boeing jets, particularly if you have to be on a strict schedule and pattern. I find the old faithful combo of Advil PM followed by a couple cocktails on the flight, typically helps not give it one thought (or any thoughts) while in the air!

[El Presidente]

1 hour ago, NeoGeo said:

 I find the old faithful combo of Advil PM followed by a couple cocktails on the flight, typically helps not give it one thought (or any thoughts) while in the air!

....we obviously  go to the same doctor  

[Chitmo]

12 hours ago, NeoGeo said:

I travel at least 2 weeks every month, typically more, and have never experienced one. I've been doing that type of travel for years now, and just find that it's much easier not to go into the different forums and talk about the problems with aircrafts. As someone mentioned, it's almost impossible to avoid flying in Boeing jets, particularly if you have to be on a strict schedule and pattern. I find the old faithful combo of Advil PM followed by a couple cocktails on the flight, typically helps not give it one thought (or any thoughts) while in the air!

Or if you fly through Canada you can smoke a big blunt and eat a 200mg chocolate bar. 😜