Aged cigars?

[backbone]

I had my first aged cigar the other day. 

It was a '05 Dip #1.

It burned well, had a pleasant creamy coffee taste, but it didn't really blow me away.  It was consistent the entire smoke.

Don't get me wrong it was good, and I didn't know what to expect, but I was a little let down.  Maybe I'm a freshy lover.

What was your first experience with aged stock?

[Ethernut]

See my writeup on aged stock in the thread in my sig for my answer..

Specifically, the two sections titled, 1. "On Aging Your Cigars" followed by.. 2.  "Buying Aged Stock Versus Aging Your Own"

[btort910]

17 minutes ago, Ethernut said:

See my writeup on aged stock in the thread in my sig for my answer..

Specifically, the two sections titled, 1. "On Aging Your Cigars" followed by.. 2.  "Buying Aged Stock Versus Aging Your Own"

Relatively new here...how do I find the articles you refer to? Thanks.

[LordAnubis]

19 minutes ago, btort910 said:

Relatively new here...how do I find the articles you refer to? Thanks.

Click the link in his signature... under where he typed....

[Bohn007]

I have found that buying aged stock is like buying new production in that sometimes it's hit or miss. I have beautiful boxes of aged cigars and also ones that turned out to be duds. This is one of the beauties of buying from Rob, he will tell you what is smoking good, it is then just up to you to decide if the flavor profile is one that attracts you. Of course, when you are new, you want to try everything but over time, you will narrow down what you like and don't so your "bets" are safer. 

[SaintMickey®]

Good read even for non noob...confirms a lot of my suspicions/theories! LOL

 

[Smallclub]

You can't draw any conclusion after you've smoked ONE aged cigar for the first time in your life.

[Puros Y Vino]

Aged stock is always a gamble. There are no guarantees.  With that said, many of my most memorable smoking experiences have been with aged cigars, some as far back as 1926.  None of my aged purchases have been duds thus far.   What you described can happen with a fresh box too.  For instance, I have a 2010 box of Siglo VI.  Each time I pull one to smoke, it's either going to be glorious or just "ok".  And that was back in 2011 to now.

[backbone]

1 hour ago, Smallclub said:

You can't draw any conclusion after you've smoked ONE aged cigar for the first time in your life.

No conclusions made, just wanted to start a discussion about aged stock.

What was your best experience?

How did they vary from current late model stock?

These Dips were from Rob's aged stock and look great.  I may have expected too much and the other four may stunners!

-Cheers

[strikethebox7]

I agree it is a gamble buying aged stock. I haven't experienced the so called "sick period" that sometimes comes with aged stock just not being the right amount of time down for that Marca. Though I have had excellent experiences with aged cigars. So far they always seem to be very smooth and the nuanced flavors really pop. I would say don't be discouraged and keep trying.  

[Smallclub]

42 minutes ago, backbone said:

What was your best experience?

How did they vary from current late model stock?

When one starts trying aged cigars, one should always smoke a vitola or a marca with which one is familar to.

I suppose you've never smoked a Diplo #1 before. Then you have no idea if this cigar from '05 is already too old, has lost too much power, if the flavors are enhanced or have "melted", etc.

I have smoked 2 boxes of aged Diplo #1 ('01 and '02) and wasn't impressed. Actually I think I prefer the flavors of recent Diplomaticos, which are more "nutty" and much less "citrusy".

[BrightonCorgi]

How old is considered "aged"?  OP thought 11 years...  I guess that's aged, but seems weird to me as I was buying cigars long before '05. 

Buying old stock can be gamble if buying blind or from a vendor who's not on the level.  I like to see what I am getting or be assured I am getting top stuff if buying 15-20 year old cigars.  Habanos were less consistent (if such thing was possible) than they are now, but the strains used for filler back then had more flavor than now.

The best part of aged cigars for me is the cleaner aftertaste.

[El Presidente]

1 hour ago, mosesbotbol said:

Buying old stock can be gamble if buying blind or from a vendor who's not on the level.  I like to see what I am getting or be assured I am getting top stuff if buying 15-20 year old cigars.  Habanos were less consistent (if such thing was possible) than they are now, but the strains used for filler back then had more flavor than now.

The best part of aged cigars for me is the cleaner aftertaste.

I have had some cracking aged and vintage cigars. I have had some disappointing ones. 

As Frank said, it is a better gauge if you have some experience with the aged cigar you are trying.  I have been rarely disappointed with a Dipl 1 ....but I have. A cracking box of Monte 1 from 16 will give a poor Dip 1 from 03 a towelling. 

Provenance/storage/quality are the keys for me.  

 

 

[Troels]

Dont like old ladies' hand bags

[canadianbeaver]

I had similar thought to brother above and a member here, Dan from NY State is the one I trust. 

If we want to describe our smoke as vintage or aged. We should be starting at 15 -20 years then going decades after that.

Have lots of 2003-2008, but consider them great years, like in a wine or whatever. But not fancy aged. 

 

[El Presidente]

6 hours ago, canadianbeaver said:

I had similar thought to brother above and a member here, Dan from NY State is the one I trust. 

If we want to describe our smoke as vintage or aged. We should be starting at 15 -20 years then going decades after that.

Have lots of 2003-2008, but consider them great years, like in a wine or whatever. But not fancy aged. 

 

personally big difference between vintage and aged. 

Aged is the hard work is done...if you like that thing. 8 years thereabouts. 

Vintage has no real definition. For me, 15 years does it. 

Others have a different idea and I am not about to correct it. 

[NSXCIGAR]

I personally would never shell out the money for something aged that I smoke regularly, or even most reg production. If I were to buy aged, it would have to be something I thought was interesting or something rare or something that I couldn't get at the time.

Anything I would spend money on aged, I'd be buying surplus of what I smoke or like now and aging myself unless as stated above. 

I would never rule out vintage, but buyer beware with that. Most of my vintage experiences have been negative. I'd have to be 100% sure of what I was buying--both provenance and the marca/vitola itself.

[canadianbeaver]

7 hours ago, El Presidente said:

personally big difference between vintage and aged. 

Aged is the hard work is done...if you like that thing. 8 years thereabouts. 

Vintage has no real definition. For me, 15 years does it. 

Others have a different idea and I am not about to correct it. 

Did not know there was a difference between vintage and aged. Sounds like marketing to me. But as long as the smoker is happy? Terrific!

[Puros Y Vino]

Vintage just means "from a certain year".  It comes from the wine world. "Vin" = vino/wine "age" = uh.. age/era/year.  The "t" , not sure.

"That Cab we enjoyed was a 1998 "vintage".  Vintage/aged are pretty much the same. It's the year it's from that matters.

[Zigatoh]

Cambridge dictionary -

“

of high quality and lasting value, or showing the best and most typical characteristics of a particular type of thing, especially from the past:

a vintage plane

a vintage comic book

This film is vintage (= has the bestcharacteristics typical of films made by)Disney.

She loves buying vintage clothing."

 

Vintage in relation to wine seems to have a specific meaning which is very different from its general definition above. 

 

Origin -

late Middle English: alteration (influenced by vintner) of earlier vendage, from Old French vendange, from Latin vindemia (from vinum ‘wine’ + demere ‘remove’).

[Fugu]

2 hours ago, bundwallah said:

Vintage just means "from a certain year".  It comes from the wine world. "Vin" = vino/wine "age" = uh.. age/era/year.  The "t" , not sure.

Right, but in the cigar world, the usual use of the term is a bit different, where "vintage" has been the adopted "convention", so to speak, as an expression for older cigars. More along the lines of "vintage car". That may be because there is no such thing like a pure and plain vintage year in cigars, rather than a production year. Whereas the tobacco used for the blend will stem from different vintages (= growing seasons), like in non-vintage wines.

I think Rob's definition

10 hours ago, El Presidente said:

Aged is the hard work is done...if you like that thing. 8 years thereabouts. 

Vintage has no real definition. For me, 15 years does it. 

Others have a different idea and I am not about to correct it. 

is a pretty good and useful orientation. But I also agree with Frank, since aging virtually starts immediately after production (and a vintage cigar will always be an aged one of course...). Therefore, for practical purposes and in order to put a name on it, I would usually call up to one year from boxing a "fresh cigar", up to three years a "young cigar". And from there one, an "aged" cigar - whether aged for three, five, ten years or more...doesn't matter. The expression "aged" without further specification for how long is rather useless I think. There is always the problem of disambiguation of the term "vintage" of course, but drawing the line for "vintage" at 15 years seems decent to me. At the moment, I would say anything pre-1998 certainly being vintage, as this will also roughly fall in line with major changes in production / tobacco strains. But this is all not strictly consistent and should not be taken too serious, I agree.

[BarryNY]

I'm seeing that online sellers are referring to any box codes over 4 years old as "aged".

So, a 2012 is considered "aged" right now.  My collection is young, so I've been scooping up some "aged" boxes here and there that are really not much more cost than the current vintage.  I don't want to touch my current (2015/16) inventory for 2 years.  I was able to get some boxes of 2012 RA Superiores for just $10/box more than the 2016.  And a 2011 code for both HDM E2 and HU Mag46 for only $2/more a piece than current pricing.

The 2008 PSD4 that I got from El Presidente on the last LFTH are smoking hot (pardon the pun)!  Can't wait for the next "aged" FOH sale...........

[PapaDisco]

1 hour ago, BarryNY said:

I'm seeing that online sellers are referring to any box codes over 4 years old as "aged".

So, a 2012 is considered "aged" right now.  My collection is young, so I've been scooping up some "aged" boxes here and there that are really not much more cost than the current vintage.  I don't want to touch my current (2015/16) inventory for 2 years.  I was able to get some boxes of 2012 RA Superiores for just $10/box more than the 2016.  And a 2011 code for both HDM E2 and HU Mag46 for only $2/more a piece than current pricing.

The 2008 PSD4 that I got from El Presidente on the last LFTH are smoking hot (pardon the pun)!  Can't wait for the next "aged" FOH sale...........

Yes, that first 5 years on seems to be consistently beneficial to nearly every stick.  At 10 years, the typical aging method (i.e. leave the box on a shelf with other boxes in a temp and humidity controlled room) seems to go hit or miss.  From the PCC aging program I've had tasty 10-15 year old sticks and ones that were bland.  In my own storage I've adopted the shrink wrap/plastic wrap method and hope that will support long term, concentrated flavors, but I'm only 5 years in at this point so who knows!  

I agree with Barry that aged sticks are not always that much more expensive.  I can find 5 year old boxes here and there and El Pres will have these for sale from time to time as well for a modest premium.  PCC aging program boxes tend to be double the price of a regular box at the 10 year mark, so that's 7%/year appreciation or so.  Fairly modest.  There's lots of exceptions to this and more expensive stuff on offer of course, but in general it's a sector that's priced fairly enough that it's worth considering for those who want to go adventuring.

[jeht]

Im not one for aged cigars. When i see people mention buying a box and not trying it for several years i just shake my head BUT know, to each his or her own. I like most of my smokes very fresh, and others within the first 3 years.  It would be interesting to see what people think of a cigar in a blind test that is aged

[kuma]

Not a Rob homer but the man is right.  The Monty. #1's  2016 are smoking at such a high level.  Started buying

them (PSP and Hq) since 2015 when I think they really started to shine.  Also bought the # 3's starting in 2015

  they are good but the #1 are better.  Smoother, nutty and loaded with hints of choc.  love them.  Keep

them coming Mr. Rob.