North Korea ?? Your thougjts

[rhcolbert]

10 hours ago, Smallclub said:

Sounds harsh I know, but what can you REALLY do to make a difference in dprk? Why are we focusing on certain countries and ignoring child armies and rape in Africa? All while most people aren't actually doing anything anyways.

if I knew as much about my neighbors and immediate community as I do about world events, I'd actually be adding more value.  I can help out my neighbors right now today.  I can't change n Korea. 

No tears for strangers doesn't mean be vindictive. It just means focus energy and emotion on things I can do something about. 

[Philc2001]

I think most people miss some of the most fundamental points when they think of North Korea. There is a lot of disinformation and misguided rhetoric on both sides of the DMZ. One of the key misunderstood issues is the lack of any kind of peace treaty or formal end to the Korean War that raged from 1950 to 1953. In effect, the North, which was occupied by Soviets, and the South, occupied by the USA, have never officially agreed to end the war. Though there was a ceasefire, there was no peace agreement, so in effect they are still at war - albeit a cold war for 60+ years.  As a result, the North has maintained war readiness and has been prepared to resume hostilities ever since. In their view, they are still very much at war with the South, which they perceive as a proxy for the USA. 

It is very, very important to understand the North's mindset in the context of this viewpoint, because the North Korean people have been expecting an attack for over 60 years, and they are not defenseless. Here are some sobering points:

1. Any so called "pre-emptive" strike on North Korea will signal the end of the ceasefire and resumption of hostilities, effectively reigniting full force war.
2. Although the North may not have the capability to deliver a nuclear payload via ballistic delivery vehicles, they are capable of multiple (maybe 8-10) nuclear yields from a stationary land point, or a mobile ground unit, or from a seagoing vehicle - and yes, they have submarines. That means they have the potential to kill hundreds of thousands of people nearly instantaneously. 
3. They have had over 60 years to prepare for war, and they have not been idle. They have a vast network of hardened underground tunnels, akin to an ant farm, that snake all over the country. They have weapons, a lot of them, and they have over 1-million trained, armed soldiers ready for combat.
4. They have a large arsenal of over 10,000 conventional missiles aimed and ready to fire at South Korea. Regardless if the South can shoot a number of these down, many would still reach their targets and would most certainly reduce Seoul to rubble and kill many thousands of civilians.  

It is easy to underestimate North Korea as a feeble, underpowered, outdated, pushover military because there is very little media coverage. But they would not be so easy to put down. The death tolls will be surprisingly high, not only in North Korea, but in South Korea and likely in Japan.

Most importantly, we must view the North in the context of the Korean war. They are convinced, and have been anticipating an American led attack for over 60 years. Any kind of pre-emptive strike on North Korea will be viewed as full force hot war and they will launch everything they have. You all know what kind of crazy chubby little man presides over North Korea in Pyongyang. He is even crazier than his predecessors, and he has already assassinated his own family members in cold blood, so there is no hope that he would think twice before going to full scale war. You don't provoke crazies like this, you let them wave their swords and run at the mouth and just let them rot on their thrones.

I can't stress enough how dangerous this situation is. Moving a US strike group into the region and making showy military strikes in Syria and Afghanistan are serious provocations. Add to it rhetoric from a big mouth CinC and you have a recipe for a very bloody disaster. A strike on North Korea, if it even takes that, would break the damn wide open. Escalation from there will be very hard to stop, with China and Russia bordering N. Korea, it could get very ugly, very fast. 

Let's hope this situation quiets down and peace prevails.   

[luvdunhill]

family chatting about assad, syria, north korea.

my niece asks whether north koreans are allowed to leave the country.

we tell her no.

There are study abroad programs DPRK students can participate in. It is mandatory to participate in twos. There are a number of universities that take part, in the UK for example.

[luvdunhill]

Sounds harsh I know, but what can you REALLY do to make a difference in dprk?

Travel and contribute to education system there. Many folks do this already, including teachers with US Passports.

[SCgarman]

On ‎4‎/‎13‎/‎2017 at 0:51 PM, skalls said:

Fat man will eventually get put down by one of his generals.

Don't see an invasion or the is firing on then unless nk does something stupid like invade SK or shell Seoul.

If things over there escalate, the Kim Jong will get taken out by one of our bombs attached to a laser guided missile. I hope his days are numbered.

[NSXCIGAR]

2 hours ago, Philc2001 said:

...Moving a US strike group into the region and making showy military strikes in Syria and Afghanistan are serious provocations. Add to it rhetoric from a big mouth CinC and you have a recipe for a very bloody disaster. A strike on North Korea, if it even takes that, would break the damn wide open. Escalation from there will be very hard to stop, with China and Russia bordering N. Korea, it could get very ugly, very fast. 

I agree, I don't think a preemptive strike or provoking NK to strike would result in a positive outcome for anyone. Without provocation, however, I don't think there is much chance of NK initiating an attack. Ideally, China, SK and Russia can all get on board to the point where it's clear to NK if they tried anything aggressive the entire region would obliterate them regardless of US involvement.

As I said, I think China holds all the cards here and they need to be persuaded to cut this lunatic and his regime off and let it die. Not sure if what I saw recently is true, but it seems some statements may have been made by China indicating they may be starting to get fed up with the situation. Let's hope that's true.

[rhcolbert]

2 hours ago, luvdunhill said:

 

Travel and contribute to education system there. Many folks do this already, including teachers with US Passports.

 

Totally agree and glad they are; many but very few out of the whole of those who feign concern. Most people with grand ideas about this and other topics aren't doing anything though. We know this. 

[Philc2001]

1 hour ago, NSXCIGAR said:

As I said, I think China holds all the cards here and they need to be persuaded to cut this lunatic and his regime off and let it die. Not sure if what I saw recently is true, but it seems some statements may have been made by China indicating they may be starting to get fed up with the situation. Let's hope that's true.

I read that China is going to, or already has refused coal shipments from NK, which would be a very damaging for them. As I recall, NK relies on coal exports to China for about 40% of their revenue. 

I don't expect a first strike from NK. but US is talking tough about pre-emptive strikes. If US takes matters into their own hands and decides to pre-empt another nuke test, then it will be a bloody conflict. No way NK is going to just ignore it like Syria did.  

[TheFullMontecristo]

  that Massive Ordnance Air Blast (MOAB) strike weapon they used on some Taliban in Afghanistan the other day looks interesting. Perhaps air mail a half dozen of those strategically placed. 

[El Presidente]

I would send Kim Jong -un a fine selection of Easter eggs and a message to "relax and catch up with you later in the year". 

Putin should get a similar basket of eggs. 

Unless you know the outcome of any action, action is never an intelligent option. Rule 101. 

 

[Winchester21]

Kill this piece  of garbage before he gets far enough along to start selling off his nukes

[Ken Gargett]

1 minute ago, Winchester21 said:

Kill this piece  of garbage before he gets far enough along to start selling off his nukes

i take it we are still talking kim...

[LordAnubis]

Good 5th post...

So is the person selling weapons bad or is the person buying them bad? You can prevent anyone from selling anything by undercuttting their product in a market.... but then how will weapons manufacturers make money?

[Jeremy Festa]

Chocolate is coming!


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[Islandboy]

I hear we’re ground zero here in Hawaii. Just hope I get enough warning to smoke the 9 Behikes I have left.

[Ken Gargett]

Just now, Islandboy said:

I hear we’re ground zero here in Hawaii. Just hope I get enough warning to smoke the 9 Behikes I have left.

i think you can rest assured that if the worst happens, they will all be 'smoked'!

[Islandboy]

13 minutes ago, Ken Gargett said:

i think you can rest assured that if the worst happens, they will all be 'smoked'!

Thanks Ken. I feel better now. 

[losttrailer]

On 13.4.2017 at 1:52 PM, ggaspar said:

And bavarian beer missile to Moscow pls

you prefer white or dark beer missiles ?

3 hours ago, El Presidente said:

I would send Kim Jong -un a fine selection of Easter eggs and a message to "relax and catch up with you later in the year". 

Putin should get a similar basket of eggs.

Following this thread i get the impression to better ship them out by thousands ( just to make sure everyone in need gets one ).

[canadianbeaver]

This is politics, war and shit. Waiting for a fight with popcorn.

But hey, enjoy brothers.

 

 

[ErikB]

A lot of saber rattling. Nothing new. The only difference is instead of one crazy crazy MoFo we now have two. Wouldn't put it past either one to push past the brink.


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Exactly


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[Fuzz]

12 hours ago, canadianbeaver said:

This is politics, war and shit. Waiting for a fight with popcorn.

But hey, enjoy brothers.

 

 

Water pistols at ten paces?

[...]

I always find it interesting when a political newcomer claims to know how to fix one of these international complex issues through a simplistic (read naïve) solution. Logic would dictate that if such a simple solution existed, someone else would probably have figured it out already.

International politics are often quite entangled and it is often not intuitive how many negative impacts can arise out of any direct action.

It's easy to claim to have a solution. However, until I see an actual fully comprehensive plan with global long term impact analysis from a political leader, I remain convinced no ethical solution exists...

[cigcars]

       From what I've always understood was that both North and South Korea would like their country to be re-unified again, but that would be very hard what with the South enjoying reasonable accommodations of food, open news about the rest of the world coming in, and having freedom of elections; and the North being forced into god-like worship of the "big dear leader", and ALL outside news being cut off from coming in and giving people their own capacity for making their own decisions.  I never like hearing about how North Korea's population pretty much stays hungry with all food sources going to the military and the small number of leadership enjoying plenty...having plenty of resources for parades, military stage shows, and other pretty much useless fluff and fanfare, while the whole populace suffers deprivation.  There are practically NO small animals and other little living things in North Korea due to the desperate citizens having to eat ANYTHING they can find. It's really scandalous. In the military (at least here in the U.S.)  you're taught that you take care of your people under you and make sure they eat and have enough before the "big wigs" enjoy necessary food and supplies first. So one can just uncomfortably imagine the REAL deprivation that the numbers of North Korea's people languishing in their over-stocked prisons are dealing with. I'd heard about how some poor six year old little girl there (in the prisons with her family) was deliberately beaten to DEATH by the prison staff because she managed to steal a little food...

   

[rhcolbert]

On 4/15/2017 at 3:59 AM, El Presidente said:

I would send Kim Jong -un a fine selection of Easter eggs and a message to "relax and catch up with you later in the year". 

Putin should get a similar basket of eggs. 

Unless you know the outcome of any action, action is never an intelligent option. Rule 101. 

 

Start with the end in mind.  Define what winning is. Something sorely needed where lives and things that go boom are on the line. 

[MahDooRow]

On April 14, 2017 at 2:59 PM, NSXCIGAR said:

As I said, I think China holds all the cards here and they need to be persuaded to cut this lunatic and his regime off and let it die. Not sure if what I saw recently is true, but it seems some statements may have been made by China indicating they may be starting to get fed up with the situation. Let's hope that's true.

I remain optimistic that China will use its influence to keep N. Korea in check.  Reports of China's actions following the meeting between Xi and Trump seem positive.  Following the failed N. Korea missile test I'm glad to see that Trump is showing some restraint by refraining from provocative statements and impulsive tweets.