Buying Boxes Blind

[Smoker]

I get the jist, but the analogy isn't quite apt. It's more like we're all vegetarians and some of us dislike broccoli. I've seen cases where one's dislike comes from exposure from sub-par product, which was so scarring that one wrote off the product entirely. Once one tries the good stuff, opinions can change! That may not be the common case, but it does happen with some frequency, and I've even experienced it myself.

I agree with this to some extent - definitely the part about being put off by a poor example. But I think that across 27 brands and so many vitolas (and we're only talking Cubans here), there is enough variation for one to have a preference of a particular kind, and if not to dislike a whole brand, at least to dislike a particular shape/size/blend. To be honest, I envy those people who will get pleasure from any cigar in the world, as long as it was well made! They must surely be in the minority.

I'd go as far as 'we're all vegetarians, but some don't like canned veg'. Your broccoli was too small a percentage of all the available veg lol.

[eswary]

Wish things in the were more like this in the US. I work in a cigar shop and always have box purchasers request sealed boxes to be sure they get 'fresh' cigars! On the odd occasion where only a previously opened but full box is the only option, I've actually had clients become upset and even reject the purchase. Go figure!

Before discovering this site, I bought blind and was about 50-50 in terms of being pleased with what I received. Now, I buy from here and have been 100% pleased with everything. IMHO, just not worth trying to save a few dollars. I appreciate the information that comes with every offering. That's just a bonus on the 24/24!

This is because NC's are so consistent, you don't need to check them. They a scary consistent actually. Padron, MF, Opus, Ashton: all these brands don't change there blends are they are the same, year after year. Cubans...never the same. The largest downside to Cuban cigars IMO.

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[Smallclub]

Ok, so even if we can't have a list that says one particular cigar is less reliable than another, at the very least we could have a list that says 'In 2012 this cigar was very consistent, and in 2009 that cigar seemed to be very reliable' etc.

No. For each item in the list you will have 10 guys posting "WTF? I purchased this cigar from this year and it's excellent".

Learning habanos is largely a trial and error process; a collection of tables, charts, stats, excel files will not help you.

[Smallclub]

The largest downside to Cuban cigars IMO.

It's not a downside, it's the difference between an industrial product and an agricultural product (basically).

[planetary]

It's not a downside, it's the difference between an industrial product and an agricultural product (basically).

Can you expand on that? To my mind, the main advantage of the Cuban cigar is its terroir, and the main advantages of NC are its superior farming & processing tech, assembly (not universally, but in many cases), and quality control. Astonishing that Cuba can compete at all, really.

All cigars are agricultural products, and both CC and NC are hand-made agricultural products, surely?

[TonyAccardo]

I'm of the view that Cubans taste similar enough to each other that I would rather have a spot on box of Don Alejandro's than a below-PE level box of Punch DC's even though Punch is a favorite brand of mine. My biggest lesson in Cuban cigars was when I went on a Hoyo Epi 2 buying kick. Out of the 6 boxes , each one was different enough in appearance,taste, construction, quality that if there were nothing on the box or the cigars separating themselves from each other, you'd swear that each box was a different cigar entirely . In reality they are all completely different cigars but according to branding they are all the same cigar.

I've learned to buy only cigars that Rob puts up on 24:24 and I've only been disappointed once out of maybe 30 boxes so far and that was the PL Picadores but then you see many more people say they're great than say they're bad. And this is coming from a guy who bought nothing but grey market Cubans at first. Then after getting tired of getting poor quality for the most part, switched to buying nothing but LCDH cigars and paying the enormous premium associated with them and in the end, not getting any better of quality than when I bought from grey market vendors. Now after switching to buying only from the 24:24 my hit rate has been much, much higher.

[The Privateer]

I've long been a "budget smoker", but have since learnt my lesson the hard way after spending $$$ on deals just to be disappointed in the quality.

I now make the vast majority of my purchases from our hosts. For me, it is less about "buying blind" than about trusting the vendor and their wholesale source.

No offense to Rob, but I have (very rarely) received boxes from him that look decent but smoked terribly. There's nothing any tobacconist can do to eliminate this, no matter how established or professional. Some B&M establishments replace such boxes for regular customers, but at rob's prices, I doubt that is a sustainable proposition. Part and parcel of buying Cuban.

[forgop]

Living in the UK you have the option of seeing the box before buying,you should have a real chance of picking a winning box.

There is no masterlist of more reliable brands/vitola cigars,marcas hit peaks and valleys.

The best you can hope for is if you find a really good box to try that vendor/code again.

Not necessarily. You can get a wide spectrum in the same case.

[ElPuro]

This is because NC's are so consistent, you don't need to check them. They a scary consistent actually. Padron, MF, Opus, Ashton: all these brands don't change there blends are they are the same, year after year. Cubans...never the same. The largest downside to Cuban cigars IMO.

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The blends do change. Rolls are consistent, but in my experience they can change in taste over time.

I think a list of smokes NOT to buy blind might have staying power.

[PigFish]

Rules for buying Cuban cigars:

Know and trust your vendor.

Buyer beware, this is Cuba.

You cannot insure a better cigar by paying more.

You cannot insure a better cigar by buying a certain brand.

You cannot insure you get a better cigar by adding bands to it.

You cannot insure you get a better cigar by advice on the net.

You cannot insure you get a better cigar by searching a box code.

If you want to smoke the worlds best cigars, you take the risk.

Risk can be reduced, the rules are different for everyone!

...and most importantly!

No one can make rules for another smoker, take what is offered at your own risk! He/she likely knows less than you do!!! -LOL (maybe that is just a general internet rule!)

-the Pig

[TonyAccardo]

This should be the sticky outta this thread.^^^^^^^^^

[NSXCIGAR]

I just think there's too much variation to be able to say a particular code or cigar is reliable enough to buy blind for any reasonable amount of time. That description might hold up for a month or two, but then all bets are off again. I can recall Rob only remarking maybe a handful of times this year that a particular cigar is OK to buy blind out of the hundreds he put up.

That being said, there are some cigars that do seem to be pretty resilient over the last few years and that I've received from multiple vendors and multiple codes that have never failed. The El Principe comes to mind. PLPC is another. I honestly can't think of any others I'd feel OK with buying blind, if I really cared about that.

There are certainly cigars that I feel can never, ever be bought blind. Monte 2 and most Trinidad fit that bill. But all that may change in a month or two. CC quality is just too transient.

[eswary]

It's not a downside, it's the difference between an industrial product and an agricultural product (basically).

It's solely my opinion, but it's a downside for me to not know every time if the cigars I'm buying are as good or even close to the last time I purchased the exact same cigar. To me that's a downside or a negative.

That being said, I love Cuban tobacco and know how to and not how to buy. I also accept that some years are great, some are ok, and some not so desirable. That's the Cuban cigar game we all play.

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[mikemerry]

I can't stress enough how much things change in Cuban cigars..... when I first ordered from Rob, I wasn't a 100% sure until the cigars showed up. But now I wouldn't buy blind in Cuba or even buy regular production honestly.

I purchased a beautiful box of Monty 2's in Cuba... the same box code and quality from Rob not even a month later.... Robs cigars are exact if not better.

Bought two boxes of Ep2 in Cuba. Paid then inspected them... both had the same box codes... both look completely different... both smoke really good..

There is no master cheat sheet.... it is a matter of keeping up on whats good at the moment production wise...... which means smoke a lot of cigars!!! tough life I know.

You don't walk around with your eyes closed so why buy your cigars that way.... seems foolish to me

[Smallclub]

Every box I have has been bought blind. ... Each box was inspected before purchasing. They were also felt for construction issues. ... Some boxes were openly rejected, by the vendor, due to construction issues.

This is not buying blind. To me a blind purchase is when you order from a vendor who will send you the box at the top of the pile, without checking anything.

[MrGTO]

Can you expand on that? To my mind, the main advantage of the Cuban cigar is its terroir, and the main advantages of NC are its superior farming & processing tech, assembly (not universally, but in many cases), and quality control. Astonishing that Cuba can compete at all, really.

All cigars are agricultural products, and both CC and NC are hand-made agricultural products, surely?

It's in the dirt man! To my taste nobody else produced tobacco of the quality(taste/flavor) of Cuba. You might disagree and that's fine but for me I'll never look back!

[LLC]

This is not buying blind. To me a blind purchase is when you order from a vendor who will send you the box at the top of the pile, without checking anything.

Correct, buying my blind means nobody looked at it before selecting or shipping.

[MrGTO]

Correct, buying my blind means nobody looked at it before selecting or shipping.

Or did look at it and doesn't give a ****...

[planetary]

It's in the dirt man! To my taste nobody else produced tobacco of the quality(taste/flavor) of Cuba. You might disagree and that's fine but for me I'll never look back!

On the contrary, that's (largely) what I mean by the term terroir, ref: wikipedia. We agree.

[Easttide]

My cigar smoking had been fairly pedestrian since the late 90's until one of my neighbors handed me a divine PLPC last spring and told me the popular online spot to buy them. Since then I purchased a decent collection of bread and butter cigars, primarily from one source, though occasionally from two others. I would say 85 % of what I ordered would be considered PE or HQ by FOH standards, 5% PSP, 9 % economy and 1 % poor.

[El Presidente]

Codes can be a good guide in some lines.

If you see PSP listed of recent stock, say a Box of ARG JUN 15 Esplendido. If my commentary states that quality from the mastercase was overall high, then you could do worse than tracking down a vendor with that specific code. It will take out some of the risk.

Most vendors will check stock for you. Ideally find one who will go the extra mile.

[Akela3rd]

Always looking for good wuality me, in cigars and life in general.

[Easttide]

I forgot to mention that having found this site I don't see myself buying anywhere else. Total transparency is most important to me and you get it here. You have to be more patient, but what you want will eventually surface, and some! I might add that I'm not one seeking LE cigars though, just quality bread and butter stuff.

[cigarbigboy]

Codes can be a good guide in some lines.

If you see PSP listed of recent stock, say a Box of ARG JUN 15 Esplendido. If my commentary states that wuality from the mastercase was overall high, then you could do worse than tracking down a vendor with that specific code. It will take out some of the risk.

Most vendors will check stock for you. Ideally find one who will go the extra mile.

Actually I have found one who will go the extra mile and more. He's from the land down under...... You guys are all very much appreciated by us....

[shortsqueeze]

Wish things in the were more like this in the US. I work in a cigar shop and always have box purchasers request sealed boxes to be sure they get 'fresh' cigars! On the odd occasion where only a previously opened but full box is the only option, I've actually had clients become upset and even reject the purchase.

For the most part, the educated ritual of buying boxes of cigars in the US has gone the way of the Dodo, unlike in Europe. I don't work in a tobacco shop, but I've been into enough of them over the last 20+ years to know that the cigars within a box of Non-Cuban cigars are vastly uniform, from box to box, comparatively to Cuban cigars which can vary widely.

In Cuba, I've found when shopping that those stores where I don't have a personal relationship, opening boxes is for the most part discouraged. I will absolutely, positively NEVER buy a box of cigars in Cuba without inspection and usually without examining multiple additional boxes of the same cigar to select my preference in wrapper and overall uniformity within a box or cabinet. This is part of the fun of buying in Cuba, the search and hunt and then the kill of finding that perfect box.