Hoyo De Monterrey Epicure No. 2 or Bolivar Bélicoso Fino?

[mandoponcho]

Hey there everyone, 

I’m new to the Cuban game (not cigars though) and seeking a recommendation. I was eyeing a cab of HdM Epi 2 or a dress box of BBF. Which one do you recommend and why? I’ve also heard that cabs age much better than dress boxes. Is this myth or truth? Thank you all ahead of time. 

[JohnS]

@mandoponcho, this is the opportunity cost we now face due to changes in pricing. Years ago we would have recommended you to purchase both and find out what you favour for yourself.

To help with your query, what do you prefer? Milder, lighter-bodies cigars or stronger, fuller-bodied cigars? Do you prefer sweeter flavours or perhaps savoury ones? This will help with our responses.

[mandoponcho]

@JohnS I really am a fan of all types of flavors, but prefer mild to medium. Just smoked a Monte No. 4 the other day and absolutely loved it. 

[BrightonCorgi]

I'd go for the Hoyos. BBF's aren't what they used to be. I like Campanas better and would pick R&J Belicoso over the BBF.  

If you are buying them online, ask the vendor which ones are smoking better out of the two. If you are open to it, ask the vendor which is the best smoking cigar in that general size they have at moment and go for those. That's what I used to do when I was so pick over one marca or another. I just wanted a good box of cigars.

Always ask for them to be inspected before being shipped.

[Çnote]

HdM all the way. 

But considering the market, 'best box' as recommended by @BrightonCorgi is extremely savvy

[Habanoschris]

* Cabs may age better but dress boxes age just fine.  

[BrightonCorgi]

2 hours ago, Habanoschris said:

* Cabs may age better but dress boxes age just fine.  

Has there been any real studies on which age better?  Anyone actually did the same or similar box code of the same cigars (in both dress box & cab) 10 years in to see which one was better. I am not so convinced one ages better than the other.

[JohnS]

I'd go HdM Epicure No.2 also in this case, but that's just my preference.

As for aging, cigar enthusiasts have traditionally gauged it by smoking from their boxes periodically (say every 6 to 12 months) and then determining when the cigars have entered their 'peak' period (when they are at their optimum for smoking).

[Mike Mecklenburg]

I like cabs because they are packaged in a circle which leaves more room for expansion. Sometimes with the dress box the cigars can get box pressed. As an example, a month ago I purchased a dress box of RASS and took each one out of the box for inspection. If I didn't put each one back into the exact position that I took them out, they would not have all fit. I would have to force them back and you know what that means. Regarding picking one, I would go with the Hoyo Epi 2 for the cab and my palate.  

[Chas.Alpha]

On 4/19/2025 at 12:54 PM, BrightonCorgi said:

I'd go for the Hoyos. BBF's aren't what they used to be. I like Campanas better and would pick R&J Belicoso over the BBF.  

I’m going to lean in this way on that; true, the old (pre-2000) Boli was an Arabian Stallion, with nicotine as part if not half of the DNA. Modern Boli are just over-medium to me. Epi2 is just another one I don’t get. Light, cream I suppose, flat. The newer Boli blends give me cocoa, medium/over, coffee with a smidge of cream. 

As to the original post, welcome to the rabbit hole that is cigar smoking! If you’re able, find a buddy and try both as a split. No one can tell you what your preferences are, or what your palate tastes from any given stick. What I find as licorice, you might associate with cream and cocoa. You are not wrong. I would not be wrong. It is subjective. I will give one irrefutable piece of advice: KNOW YOUR VENDOR! The warning label that floats around here isn’t just a bunch of grumpy old people. People are selling fake RASCC these days…

CAH👿

[Cayman17]

21 hours ago, Chas.Alpha said:

I’m going to lean in this way on that; true, the old (pre-2000) Boli was an Arabian Stallion, with nicotine as part if not half of the DNA. Modern Boli are just over-medium to me. Epi2 is just another one I don’t get. Light, cream I suppose, flat. The newer Boli blends give me cocoa, medium/over, coffee with a smidge of cream. 

As to the original post, welcome to the rabbit hole that is cigar smoking! If you’re able, find a buddy and try both as a split. No one can tell you what your preferences are, or what your palate tastes from any given stick. What I find as licorice, you might associate with cream and cocoa. You are not wrong. I would not be wrong. It is subjective. I will give one irrefutable piece of advice: KNOW YOUR VENDOR! The warning label that floats around here isn’t just a bunch of grumpy old people. People are selling fake RASCC these days…

CAH👿

I’m with @Chas.Alpha  on this one. Every Epi 2 I’ve ever smoked tasted like cardboard to me. I’m actually smoking a current production BBF as I type this and it is cocoa and coffee. The pre-light aroma is literally chocolate bars. I love Bolivar in general, though. Good luck with whatever you choose. 

[Gubbins]

They are totally different cigars. I much prefer the BBF, but that’s just me.

[GaryK 54]

IF you are new to CC, but have been accustomed to smoking New World, I suggest BBF as a bolder cigar with more flavour transitions than the HdM. It is every bit the equal to what you have been smoking…and so much more. IMHO, the HdM may be too mild for someone accustomed to New World flavours and strength.  

IF you are new to cigar smoking, it’s hard to go wrong with HdM Epi 2. It was a gateway cigar for me and for many others. 

Regardless of your choice, welcome to the ‘rabbit hole’. Cuban cigars are an entirely different experience than New World. Not necessarily better in all cases (there are many very good New World cigars), but very different. 

[WestCoastSmokin]

Personally I would choose the 50cab every time. More bang for your buck, and nowadays that matters a lot. 

[MagicalBikeRide]

Enjoy both at different times but when I get a great Epi 2, it can be outstanding. 

[mandoponcho]

Thank you all for the recommendations. Right now I think I’m leaning towards the Bolivar Belicosos Finos. Hoping I can get a box sometime very soon. Really appreciate all of your expertise and advice. I’m excited to be a part of the Cuban cigar community. I had a Monte No. 4 and it truly made me a believer. 

[WestCoastSmokin]

22 hours ago, mandoponcho said:

Thank you all for the recommendations. Right now I think I’m leaning towards the Bolivar Belicosos Finos. Hoping I can get a box sometime very soon. Really appreciate all of your expertise and advice. I’m excited to be a part of the Cuban cigar community. I had a Monte No. 4 and it truly made me a believer.

You won’t regret a BBF, that’s Forsure. 

[BlueWS]

BBF all day (I had one yesterday). I have 2023 BBFs and they are bready and kind of a single note cigar, but really nice and consistent all the way through (I don't personally get chocolate or coffee notes out of cigars). Hoyos are more nutty and a little salty. I prefer the Hoyo Petit Robustos over the #2s (I had my last #2 4 days ago).

[Cigarsmoker81]

Given your preference for mild to mid body I would go for Hoyo. BBF is fantastic cigar as well and if you get a chance to purchase it in the future either a stick or a box then I would do that as well.

Enjoy your journey.

[bmac]

I’d say Hoyo. I have each in my collection and have smoked through countless 50 cab Epi 2s.They were my daily when they were $9 a stick. BBF is okay but seem to have more construction issues (draw) and delicate wrappers - less frequently though than tight draw. I will add that I’m down to my last 50 cab of Epis and don’t know if I’ll purchase more. Buy a box of each if you can and see what you prefer. Hope you enjoy the ride.

[Chas.Alpha]

On 4/20/2025 at 6:17 PM, WestCoastSmokin said:

Personally I would choose the 50cab every time. More bang for your buck, and nowadays that matters a lot. 

The 50 cab of what? I’m not sure I can add to this. 🤔
<edit> I wasn’t even aware that they sold HdM Epi in 50 cabs. They barely had me interested in 25.

[WestCoastSmokin]

1 hour ago, Chas.Alpha said:

The 50 cab of what? I’m not sure I can add to this. 🤔
<edit> I wasn’t even aware that they sold HdM Epi in 50 cabs. They barely had me interested in 25.

I thought the Epicure No.2 comes in a 25 and 50 cab? 

[Hammer Smokin']

Based on your interests I'd go Hoyo.

[JohnS]

2 hours ago, WestCoastSmokin said:

I thought the Epicure No.2 comes in a 25 and 50 cab? 

It does, alongside the Hoyo de Monterrey Double Coronas, Partagas Lusitanias, Partagas Shorts, Por Larranaga Petit Coronas and Ramon Allones Specially Selected in regular production. All the cigars in the Linea Retro (i.e. the H.Upmann Regalias, Hoyo de Monterrey Souvenir de Luxe, Partagas Capitols, Punch Triunfos and Romeo y Julieta Club Kings) come in 50 cabs also, but sectioned into 10 aluminum cans of 5 cigars each, which retailers periodically make available for sale in their 5-cigar tin denominations.

There has been more Regional Editions released in 50 cabs in the last 5 years than there are 50 cabs currently available in regular production. But, that's a story for another thread.

[yuppie]

What are the differences in flavor between Epi 1, Epi 2, Epi 3 and Especials?

Hoyo is known for it's smoothness, creamy smoke texture and mild manners.

I've heard BBF's are Bolivar's most approachable vitola, but still to that Bolivar DNA.