Discussion on RH & Dryboxing

[MasterYotti]

Currently I am still using a NewAir 300H, and I have been fairly dialed in at roughly 64F and 67RH. For some background, I am someone who will dry-box (old Cigar Box with a 58RH Boveda) roughly 24 hrs before smoking. The reason I dry-box is to ensure quality burn and draw issues, because I tend to store at a higher RH. 
 

Today I wanted to know if majority of FOHers store at ready-to-smoke 62RH? Or if it is better to store at a higher RH and dry-box? I was always under the guidance that higher RH creates a better environment for natural tobacco oils… could be wrong though.

What do you think?

[LizardGizmo]

As a disciple of the @PigFish school of humidification for the last 18 months or so, I now keep my stuff at 70º/60rh and it's really changed my smoking experience dramatically. Gone are the days of stressing if a cigar is ready to smoke, uneven burn and flavor inconsistencies. While I know a lot of smokers prefer higher humidity (a lot of folks on this forum included), these numbers end up working perfectly for my palette.

1 hour ago, MasterYotti said:

I was always under the guidance that higher RH creates a better environment for natural tobacco oils… could be wrong though.

I saw a clip of the Sahakians of Davidoff of London recently saying that of all the heritage collections of cigars they've seen and purchased, the ones kept closer to 60rh are in better condition and end up performing better than cigars stored at higher humidity. Not a scientific fact, but I imagine they've seen a lot of stuff through the years. EDIT, found it: https://youtu.be/Qr8Eb_wGdkI?t=1949

 

 

[MasterYotti]

36 minutes ago, LizardGizmo said:

As a disciple of the @PigFish school of humidification for the last 18 months or so, I now keep my stuff at 70º/60rh and it's really changed my smoking experience dramatically. Gone are the days of stressing if a cigar is ready to smoke, uneven burn and flavor inconsistencies. While I know a lot of smokers prefer higher humidity (a lot of folks on this forum included), these numbers end up working perfectly for my palette.

I saw a clip of the Sahakians of Davidoff of London recently saying that of all the heritage collections of cigars they've seen and purchased, the ones kept closer to 60rh are in better condition and end up performing better than cigars stored at higher humidity. Not a scientific fact, but I imagine they've seen a lot of stuff through the years. EDIT, found it: https://youtu.be/Qr8Eb_wGdkI?t=1949

 

 

I really appreciate the advice! Do you use Biveda to achieve this RH? And if so, is it 62RH bags?

Also are you ever worried at all about Tobacco Beetles hatching at the higher temperatures? That was one of my concerns, hence the wine-ador.

[LizardGizmo]

Just now, MasterYotti said:

I really appreciate the advice! Do you use Biveda to achieve this RH? And if so, is it 62RH bags?

I'd see what others say, consider it all and then decide what's best for your palette. I have some close friends who don't enjoy smoking cigars under 65rh. 
I have a tower running a Cigar Oasis Magna 3.0. When I used Boveda in air-tight tupperware prior to having my tower they were 58rh. They run a little 'hot' in closed environments. For example, a 62boveda in Tupperware will prob run closer to 65rh or so. A 58rh boveda will run closer to 61. Boveda's designed to compensate for leakage in desktop humidors and situations where a rubber gasket isn't present.

[BoliDan]

I'm ready to smoke at 62/65F. I think if you are keeping it moist to the point that you feel a need to dry box, you are at higher risk for mold as well.

[Cigarsmoker81]

I still consider myself a newbie and there are many more knowledgeable people in the form than I but I’ll share my experience anyway

I’ve experienced with many rh and what I found to be the best for me was 65rh and 20 degrees, 62 was more flavourful but I’ve found it to burn a bit too hot and irritate my throat. Fwiw I use 62 bovedas to get to 65 rh 

[Ford2112]

I keep my cigars at a pretty consistent 65-67 degrees and 63% humidity.  That's the best I can do with my Newair. I use heartfelt beads and 62 boveda packs. I find my cigars smoke just fine where I live in Central California. 

[MasterYotti]

Based off of this information gathered, I think I will potentially become a follower of the @PigFish method that most seem to adhere to (so far). I will aim to store my cigars at ready-to-smoke RH levels. Have others found Tobacco Beetles to be an issue at higher temperatures? I don't freeze my cigars received from FOH and I don't plan to anytime soon. Currently, I want to stay at around 65-67F if possible. May need to invest in 58RH or 62RH Bovedas now 😂

[BossHogg]

I've recently changed my thinking on this. I was at colder Temps and lower humidity. I have switched gradually to 68f and 68rh for storing. I have it regulated on an inkbird and a dehumidifier in there as well.

I do dry box for smoking though. One to two weeks in a desktop humi with 60rh beads.

Explore different settings to see what you like. No one here is wrong. Everyone's taste and preferences are completely subjective, and that's ok 👍 My taste buds aren't yours and vise versa. Have fun with it!

[Jester316]

For the past 32 years of smoking cigars I've always been at 70%/70F. I try to keep all my hydrometers accurate and calibrated. I always find 70% to be good, but who knows so I just bought some small tupperware containers and some Bovedas 62%, 65%, 69%, 70% and 72%. I'm going to keep the cigars outside of the humidor for a couple hours and then put them back in with a recently calibrated Calibre IV hygrometer and give it a couple weeks if not more. I'm going to use a cigar I'm most familiar with probably Epicure #2 or Partagas Serie D Numero Quatro and maybe a non cuban as well. Possibly AF Hemingway and something from La Aurora. I'll update when I go to smoke. Will not be dry boxing. Never done that anyway.

[Michael303]

I started with 69% Bovedas like a lot of people but kept trying the next step dryer just to see how I liked it.   I'm using 58% packs currently and I can't see going back up.  Heck, I'd try dryer but I think the next step down is 49% and I don't know if that comes in a 60g pack. 

[MasterYotti]

11 hours ago, Jester316 said:

For the past 32 years of smoking cigars I've always been at 70%/70F. I try to keep all my hydrometers accurate and calibrated. I always find 70% to be good, but who knows so I just bought some small tupperware containers and some Bovedas 62%, 65%, 69%, 70% and 72%. I'm going to keep the cigars outside of the humidor for a couple hours and then put them back in with a recently calibrated Calibre IV hygrometer and give it a couple weeks if not more. I'm going to use a cigar I'm most familiar with probably Epicure #2 or Partagas Serie D Numero Quatro and maybe a non cuban as well. Possibly AF Hemingway and something from La Aurora. I'll update when I go to smoke. Will not be dry boxing. Never done that anyway.

I absolutely would love to hear the results of your testing!

 

8 hours ago, Michael303 said:

I started with 69% Bovedas like a lot of people but kept trying the next step dryer just to see how I liked it.   I'm using 58% packs currently and I can't see going back up.  Heck, I'd try dryer but I think the next step down is 49% and I don't know if that comes in a 60g pack. 

This is what I think I will end up doing, slowly walking it down to lower RH. Definitely an interesting topic.

 

It sounds like, as with most aspects of this hobby, it is personal preference! I just don’t ever want to jeopardize the humidor with potential of beetles infecting the cigars. So that is why I have went the dry box route. Does anyone know if you could have a temperature of 65F with 60RH? Not sure if the temperature will be able to go that low and remain low for RH.

[Monterey]

Dry boxing is one of the oddest things people do.  Storing cigars at some high RH, then dry box it to get it back down?  Then you have to know a day or two, or three in advanced what you will be smoking?   Then life gets in the way and you can't smoke that day, so you put back the cigar just to take a different cigar out so that it would be ready in a day or two because the other cigar would be to dry if it went another day? Such a goofy thing.  There is no need for this practice.  Store your cigars at the rh that you enjoy smoking them at.  There is no advantage of storing them long term at a higher rh.  Oils in cigars do not dissipate in a 62 rh environment.   In fact, most businesses that store and sell aged cigars store their cigars at a lower rh and temp.

I'm in the camp of storing your cigars at 62, and plucking from your humidor the cigar you want to enjoy that day. Straight from the humidor to my lips.

 

11 hours ago, MasterYotti said:

I just don’t ever want to jeopardize the humidor with potential of beetles infecting the cigars. So that is why I have went the dry box route. Does anyone know if you could have a temperature of 65F with 60RH? Not sure if the temperature will be able to go that low and remain low for RH.

How does dry boxing reduce beetles?  It would only increase them by storing your cigars at a higher RH.  If you kept your cigars at a solid 62, the chance of beetles (which honeslty is already low) would only DECREASE.  I store my cigars at 60F and 62RH.

[MasterYotti]

9 hours ago, Monterey said:

How does dry boxing reduce beetles?  It would only increase them by storing your cigars at a higher RH.  If you kept your cigars at a solid 62, the chance of beetles (which honeslty is already low) would only DECREASE.  I store my cigars at 60F and 62RH.

I thought beetles were an issue due to high temperatures, not high RH, am I mistaken? If so that changes a lot for me.

 

9 hours ago, Monterey said:

Dry boxing is one of the oddest things people do.  Storing cigars at some high RH, then dry box it to get it back down?  Then you have to know a day or two, or three in advanced what you will be smoking?   Then life gets in the way and you can't smoke that day, so you put back the cigar just to take a different cigar out so that it would be ready in a day or two because the other cigar would be to dry if it went another day? Such a goofy thing.  There is no need for this practice.  Store your cigars at the rh that you enjoy smoking them at.  There is no advantage of storing them long term at a higher rh.  Oils in cigars do not dissipate in a 62 rh environment.   In fact, most businesses that store and sell aged cigars store their cigars at a lower rh and temp.

I'm in the camp of storing your cigars at 62, and plucking from your humidor the cigar you want to enjoy that day. Straight from the humidor to my lips.

Do you use 58RH Bovedas to achieve this?

[Monterey]

6 hours ago, MasterYotti said:

I thought beetles were an issue due to high temperatures, not high RH, am I mistaken? If so that changes a lot for me.

 

Do you use 58RH Bovedas to achieve this?

do I use 58rh to achieve 62?  No.  I use 62.

To answer your beetle question.  It is more temp than humidity.  But beetles are so rare it is really a pointless discussion.

[Jester316]

I just wonder, not trying to start an argument, but how accurate most people's hydrometers are at that low of an RH, but if they're using Boveda I'm assuming accurate enough for what we're doing. I personally like them at higher RH. Over the years when I get cigars from a shop to smoke that day or ones in the mail and smoke that day they always disappoint. Wetter is better for me, wet as in 70%, otherwise they are bitter. But I'm willing to try anything for a better smoke.

[MasterYotti]

12 hours ago, Jester316 said:

I just wonder, not trying to start an argument, but how accurate most people's hydrometers are at that low of an RH, but if they're using Boveda I'm assuming accurate enough for what we're doing. I personally like them at higher RH. Over the years when I get cigars from a shop to smoke that day or ones in the mail and smoke that day they always disappoint. Wetter is better for me, wet as in 70%, otherwise they are bitter. But I'm willing to try anything for a better smoke.

My main issue with higher RH is that the draw is inconsistent and often too constricted.

 

12 hours ago, Monterey said:

do I use 58rh to achieve 62?  No.  I use 62.

To answer your beetle question.  It is more temp than humidity.  But beetles are so rare it is really a pointless discussion.

That makes sense. And the reason I worry about beetles is because I had issues with cigars bought outside of FOH and I guess I am still traumatized 😂

Now I only buy FOH 👌

[Bords]

I never got into dry boxing but keep my on-deck humidor at 62%. I do occasionally pull out a stick from my aging stock (at 65%) to smoke and find I sometimes get wrappers cracking, like the wrapper is a bit dryer than the inside of the cigar. Wouldn’t dry boxing cause this as the cigar loses moisture from the outside first? I usually dunk cigars before smoking but don’t with the ones I pull from 65%, probably should since this seems to help with splitting wrappers.


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[MasterYotti]

7 hours ago, Bords said:

I never got into dry boxing but keep my on-deck humidor at 62%. I do occasionally pull out a stick from my aging stock (at 65%) to smoke and find I sometimes get wrappers cracking, like the wrapper is a bit dryer than the inside of the cigar. Wouldn’t dry boxing cause this as the cigar loses moisture from the outside first? I usually dunk cigars before smoking but don’t with the ones I pull from 65%, probably should since this seems to help with splitting wrappers.


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I am not sure to be honest as this isn’t something I experience too often

[Jester316]

Ok so I've revised my plan, sort of. I hope I'm not hijacking this thread, if I am let me know and I'll start my own. I got all the supplies today to start my experiment, but I figured I'm only one person and although this will be my 3rd post ever here I'm sure you all trust me LOL. Well I'm willing to split up a box of Partagas Serie D No.4 into the 5 containers and sell a pack of 5 with it's own humidity pack for anyone who wants to try this experiment with me. I'm not charging any profit just what I paid for the cigars, the Boveda and shipping. I can figure that out later today and post what that amount would be. I'd like to see if there's any interest first.

Here's what I propose. First off if the Partagas is a good choice for everyone? I picked it because it's a pretty well known entity and I've smoked thousands of them. It's my go to besides HDM Epicure #2 which I don't have but a couple right now. I think, I have many large humidors.

1. Bought Partagas from Puroexpress Box Code...to come I have to pull them out and see. I'll also include box shots and serial number shots.
2. Will put my 4 hydrometers, again, in a new Boveda calibration pack, also new, and make sure they all read the same. I did all this a month ago when I got my new large humidor, but don't mind doing it again. I'll let it sit for 3 solid days before doing any offsets if they need them.
3. Currently washing the containers I got from Amazon in the dishwasher all by themselves. Just cleaned the dishwasher filter and used a very small amount of detergent, about half a thumbs worth. Will close the containers up for an evening and smell them. If all is good I'll close them up with the humidity packs inside with the cigars and then add the hygrometers when they're calibrated.
4. Wait 3 weeks for all cigars to stabilize and if people want to test out as well then I'll get some Boveda bags or something similar that won't let any moisture through and send the cigars out with Boveda packs inside.

If the people who want to experiment with me can go ahead and let me know here, I only have 4 spots as I have 25 cigars with 5 cigars per RH. The RH I'll use is 62%, 65%, 69%, 70% (this is the one from an Arturo Fuente Box not Boveda, the others are brand new Boveda.) and 72%.

If you want to participate let me know if you agree with everything. Suggestions welcome, to an extent.

1. RH levels.
2. Cigar Model.
3. Length of time, 3 weeks.
4. Testing Method.
5. Packing and Shipping Method.
6. Container Type.

Oh all will be kept in my house which stays steady between 68-70F.

If there's a ton of interest I can open another box of Partagas.

Then we smoke. No dry boxing just taking the cigar out and start to smoke it within 1/2 hour of removing it from the bag. Then everyone report back in 2 weeks? Or maybe light them all up at once and smoke side by side? Let me know. Side by side would be best, but a waster of good cigars. And with COVID and such no one wants to share a stick with friends like that. I don't know where my friends have been LOL.