Condensation in the bottom of my CC300

[WalterG]

I keep getting condensation on the bottom of my newair cc300. I have many 65% bovedas all around the cooler with two fans on the bottom facing up. My cooler is set to 60F. Can it be because 60F is too low and causing condensation? I've noticed all my sticks taste wet. My boveda butler reads the cooler at 69-70% and my Calibur IVs are reading at 61-63%. Any advice would be appreciated, thanks. 

[unclepauly25]

I would try to max out the temperature, I believe mine goes to 66 degrees Fahrenheit, I have my wineador set with 65% Bovedas and the temperature at 66. I haven’t had any problems with mine in the year and a half I’ve had it. Let me know if that works for you, might not see results immediately, give it a few days to acclimate 

[IanMcLean68]

In my experience I have found that large temperature swings between day and night causes this, especially in summer during hot dry spells during the day, when your cooling units are blowing to keep internal temps down and the air blowing in is dryer than the internal humidity of the humidor, a common issue in my neck of the woods. One of the joys of living at elevation in the mountains. However I only rarely have issues with condensation building up and pooling at the bottom, and I only need to keep a close eye on it if I am forced to use active humidification during hot dry summers to keep internal humidity levels up.

[CaptainQuintero]

  I'm not familiar with the system but generally, if you have any refrigeration unit type humidor turned on, you need to have a dedicated system to remove the excess humidity that having it turned on will introduce into the humidor. It's just part of having a unit that is a different temperature to it's surrounding area.

  With one turned on you essentially have a system that is creating excess moisture inside the humidor. 

[SansSin]

from what i understand, the condensation happens when the external and internal temp differences are too big. if u can get the external temp closer to the internal either by raising the inside temp or lowering the outside temp it should stop the condensation from forming. the company says to keep them within 20 degrees but i have had no condensation issues at all keeping it under a 10 degree difference.

[PigFish]

I will try and come back to answer this.

In short, you have bought a humidor that does not work based on your ambient conditions... I am sorry.

There is a case for every humidor, yours, mine and all others where the ambient will put it into a tail spin. Believing that I build the most robust controlled humidor in the world, mine work in more conditions than most. My humidors will function about down to 55F ambient, and up to 95F ambient, tested and proved.

True sealed humidors must have a means as rapid as their cooling and heating cycles to increase and decrease free water content. Without that control, you are headed for a meltdown anytime your system reaches it performance boundary. In short, you have exceeded this boundary.

You need to get all forms of water production out of your humidor. You should share your ambient conditions and I will try to get back to this when I have more time.

Cheers! -Piggy

[PigFish]

I have posted likely 100 data log test exhibits on this site... Here is one from 2017. I am too lazy to generate new pictures of what is, the same old thing to me!

This is a humidor working in my shop at 95F. The ambient rH does not matter, the unit is sealed. My cooling cycles are so well controlled that my dehydration is limited to a very brief time at 56rH at 95F.

I have done a lot of development since 2017. They even work better today!

This is a true, controlled humidor. A true controlled humidor must work in your ambient; hot, cold, wet or dry... If it does not do that, it is just another box you put cigars into.

-the Pig

[BJRPorter]

Check the external tray under the drain hole. If full, use something to absorb the moisture until all the water drains from inside of your unit. You’ll notice a moisture line from the cooling fan enclosure to the bottom of the NewAir.

Depending on where you live, turn off the temperature control. If it is not above 74 in your house, and your unit is not in direct sunlight or close to a heating vent, it will be fine with boveda, after keeping the door closed for a week or so.

Two things are causing the condensation, the temp control cycling all the time, and opening the door too often.

Now if you need temp control due to region or placement, the most effective way (with a NewAir) is to place cigars and boveda in tupperdors and stack them inside the NewAir. The tupperdors seal the humidity in and the temp swings out, while the NewAir cools.

[WalterG]

2 hours ago, PigFish said:

I will try and come back to answer this.

In short, you have bought a humidor that does not work based on your ambient conditions... I am sorry.

There is a case for every humidor, yours, mine and all others where the ambient will put it into a tail spin. Believing that I build the most robust controlled humidor in the world, mine work in more conditions than most. My humidors will function about down to 55F ambient, and up to 95F ambient, tested and proved.

True sealed humidors must have a means as rapid as their cooling and heating cycles to increase and decrease free water content. Without that control, you are headed for a meltdown anytime your system reaches it performance boundary. In short, you have exceeded this boundary.

You need to get all forms of water production out of your humidor. You should share your ambient conditions and I will try to get back to this when I have more time.

Cheers! -Piggy

Thanks for your advice. My ambient temps range from 60F to 75F. Should I try to completely seal the drain hole? 

[WalterG]

1 hour ago, BJRPorter said:

Check the external tray under the drain hole. If full, use something to absorb the moisture until all the water drains from inside of your unit. You’ll notice a moisture line from the cooling fan enclosure to the bottom of the NewAir.

Depending on where you live, turn off the temperature control. If it is not above 74 in your house, and your unit is not in direct sunlight or close to a heating vent, it will be fine with boveda, after keeping the door closed for a week or so.

Two things are causing the condensation, the temp control cycling all the time, and opening the door too often.

Now if you need temp control due to region or placement, the most effective way (with a NewAir) is to place cigars and boveda in tupperdors and stack them inside the NewAir. The tupperdors seal the humidity in and the temp swings out, while the NewAir cools.

I'd say that I open the unit for a smoke every 2 days or so. Is this considered too often? I don't let the door stay open for too long. 

[wine_junkie]

On 3/8/2020 at 11:50 AM, PigFish said:

I will try and come back to answer this.

In short, you have bought a humidor that does not work based on your ambient conditions... I am sorry.

There is a case for every humidor, yours, mine and all others where the ambient will put it into a tail spin. Believing that I build the most robust controlled humidor in the world, mine work in more conditions than most. My humidors will function about down to 55F ambient, and up to 95F ambient, tested and proved.

True sealed humidors must have a means as rapid as their cooling and heating cycles to increase and decrease free water content. Without that control, you are headed for a meltdown anytime your system reaches it performance boundary. In short, you have exceeded this boundary.

You need to get all forms of water production out of your humidor. You should share your ambient conditions and I will try to get back to this when I have more time.

Cheers! -Piggy

Would love to get one, Piggy!

[TBBCOLEAFLOVER]

I’ve had a wino for over 5 years now. I use to have the same issues you are currently having. When I started out I stored my sticks at 65/65%. At first everything was gravy for the first 6 months. After that I had condensation in the unit and my sticks were to moist. Some would swell while lit and crack the wrappers. tasted awful too! Anyways, i noticed my local B&M stored theirs at 70/70%. I tried that and after giving them a couple months.... Booom! No condensation and my sticks were bitch’n! This worked for me, might not work for you but it’s worth a shot. If you can’t get your unit to 70F in the winter consider an external temp controller.


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[KnightsAnole]

Until New air builds one with active humidification, dehumidification, circulating fans, cooling and heating, they are only good for wine- not cigars. Cedar trays in a refrigerator does not, a humidor, make. Until then, tupperware, passive humidification, a small circulating fan and a 24/7 air conditioned room works best for me.

[BuzzArd]

Everyone I know with a Newair has lost cigars to condensation. Those in the bottom soaked up the drippings and were ruined.  Maybe a short shelf to keep sticks off the bottom if you have to keep it?   I’ve gone away from cooled units and no longer have a condensation issue. Maybe one day I’ll have one of Ray’s fine units. God knows I’d love to, but right now i haven’t the space for an addition.  ?

[Maskas]

Just joining in with a question.  Should the drain hole be plugged or left open?  I got my CC300H for Xmas and plugged it with electrical tape.  I don’t have any condensation issues yet but I already notice it’s not as stable temp or humidity wise compared to my whynter unit.  I only had one run in with condensation in the whynter over the summer when the AC quit and the house got super hot and humid.  Boveda in each.  Hole is plugged in the whynter.  

[CaptainQuintero]

  Plugging or unplugging a hole probably won't make any difference, the issue isn't that a hole is there or not, it's that when you turn a cooler on in a room that is warmer than the unit (ie every room, otherwise why need a cooler) then you're going to get condensation>pooling>mold

  You need to address the problem causing it. Piggy can go into pinpoint detail but essentially you'll have to do something along the lines of

-if you want to keep using the cooling system, then you need to install a system to remove the increased moisture content in the humidor. Either having a system where you constantly remove beads and dry them out while replacing them with pre-dried ones. Depending on how many beads you need and how big your fridge is you can end up a busy bee. Or install an electronic system with fans/dessicate etc to do it for you. Either way you need to plan it out and spend time/money or the issue won't go away

-stop using the cooling system and use a passive system to control humidity ie beads. If you're worried about beetles then freeze everything and you've got a relatively hassle free set up. 

It will come down to what your local area temp/humidity is, what your home is, what you're prepared to do in terms of time, energy and money, to what works best for you.

 

[Puro_Lover83]

1 hour ago, CaptainQuintero said:

  Plugging or unplugging a hole probably won't make any difference, the issue isn't that a hole is there or not, it's that when you turn a cooler on in a room that is warmer than the unit (ie every room, otherwise why need a cooler) then you're going to get condensation>pooling>mold

  You need to address the problem causing it. Piggy can go into pinpoint detail but essentially you'll have to do something along the lines of

-if you want to keep using the cooling system, then you need to install a system to remove the increased moisture content in the humidor. Either having a system where you constantly remove beads and dry them out while replacing them with pre-dried ones. Depending on how many beads you need and how big your fridge is you can end up a busy bee. Or install an electronic system with fans/dessicate etc to do it for you. Either way you need to plan it out and spend time/money or the issue won't go away

-stop using the cooling system and use a passive system to control humidity ie beads. If you're worried about beetles then freeze everything and you've got a relatively hassle free set up. 

It will come down to what your local area temp/humidity is, what your home is, what you're prepared to do in terms of time, energy and money, to what works best for you.

 

So if you’re fairly confident about your cigar source (ie there should be no beetle issue), then keeping them at a higher temp where ambient temp/humidity is high, and as long as you’re keeping them at a decent RH and acceptable temp within, that should be ok?

I know it’s trial and error depending on where you live etc, but just trying to understand the overall concept. Thanks!

[zyxwvu44]

You need to block off the drain hole with duct tape. Then you create a duct tape channel with ridges so that the moisture flows down into a Tupperware filled with beads. The duct tape goes from the back wall into the tupper. You now have a closed system which won't need refilling because it isn't leaking out the back, and the moisture gets put into the beads which then disburse it back out appropriately.

Also a fan on the back next to the beads pointing upwards really helps.

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[WalterG]

1 hour ago, zyxwvu44 said:

You need to block off the drain hole with duct tape. Then you create a duct tape channel with ridges so that the moisture flows down into a Tupperware filled with beads. The duct tape goes from the back wall into the tupper. You now have a closed system which won't need refilling because it isn't leaking out the back, and the moisture gets put into the beads which then disburse it back out appropriately.

Also a fan on the back next to the beads pointing upwards really helps.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
 

What kind of beads do I need? Will they cause the humidity to go up? 

[Joeysmoke]

17 hours ago, BuzzArd said:

Everyone I know with a Newair has lost cigars to condensation. Those in the bottom soaked up the drippings and were ruined.  Maybe a short shelf to keep sticks off the bottom if you have to keep it?   I’ve gone away from cooled units and no longer have a condensation issue. Maybe one day I’ll have one of Ray’s fine units. God knows I’d love to, but right now i haven’t the space for an addition.  ?

This thread and your post have likely just saved me a hundreds of dollars. Been super keen on "classing up" my humidor situation with a climate controlled unit but I've only got one anecdotal success story. Meanwhile my long term storage coolidors have had zero problems in 10+ years, aside from being ugly. 

[Chibearsv]

1 hour ago, Joeysmoke said:

This thread and your post have likely just saved me a hundreds of dollars. Been super keen on "classing up" my humidor situation with a climate controlled unit but I've only got one anecdotal success story. Meanwhile my long term storage coolidors have had zero problems in 10+ years, aside from being ugly. 

I've spent the money on a Whynter unit (over 2 years) and a Newair unit (6 months) in my basement.  60-75 degrees year round down there and not much ambient humidity.  Both units are performing great at 60F and using 62 Bovedas keeps the cigars at 60-61 RH, and never had any condensation.  However, the Whynter unit kept rising in humidity.  It got to about 69-70 and I couldn't figure out how to bring it down.  Finally, I opened a couple 62 Bovedas, and just set them out in the open and let them get half dried out.  Once I put them in the Whynter, the RH came down and normalized at 60-61, no problems since.  

I've also got 2 large water tight plastic containers with only Boveda 62s in them and they've worked just fine down there forever.  If you've got a relatively dry basement like I do, I think any of my options would work well but I like the little fridges just for the nearly perfect consistency in temperature.  I don't know how they'd perform upstairs but I do know that both temperature and humidity have bigger fluctuations in our "living" areas so I don't even bother trying.

[T.52]

@Big Al How often are your fans running and for how long?  I have a CC300h with fans installed, use 65% boveda's, and am also on the West Coast.  I run my fans for 5 minutes every 60 minutes.  I keep my temp set at 62F.  As others have mentioned, try raising the temp a few degrees. As FYI, my drain hole is plugged with some saran wrap. 

Seems unusual that you would be having issues this time of year.  I definitely have to baby sit the unit more often in the summer as ambient temp gets warmer. But this time of year is pretty simple.

I have a boveda butler, sensor push, and 4 standard digital hygrometers in the unit.  I can tell you from years of use that you should not trust what the boveda butler says! Put it in a sealed bag or tupperwear and look at the readings from different boveda RH packets and you'll see what I mean!

[The Squiggler]

As others have suggested, raising the temp setting might help with this problem.  It's likely the condensation is occurring when the unit kicks on to cool itself, thus causing moisture to precipitate from the humid air inside (which can hold less water as the temperature drops).  In my experience, fluctuations in temperature are far more likely to cause problems than a consistent temp of few degrees higher or lower than what you deem ideal.  I will leave it to the seasoned experts on this forum to explain this in more scientific terms, but basically, as stated by @PigFish above, if your ambient conditions are causing your unit to endure big spikes and dips in temperature, condensation may be unavoidable with this unit (at least at your current temperature setting).  If the ambient temp is 60-75F, though, there may be hope for improvement if you adjust the temp setting into the upper threshold. 

[WalterG]

41 minutes ago, T.52 said:

@Big Al How often are your fans running and for how long?  I have a CC300h with fans installed, use 65% boveda's, and am also on the West Coast.  I run my fans for 5 minutes every 60 minutes.  I keep my temp set at 62F.  As others have mentioned, try raising the temp a few degrees. As FYI, my drain hole is plugged with some saran wrap. 

Seems unusual that you would be having issues this time of year.  I definitely have to baby sit the unit more often in the summer as ambient temp gets warmer. But this time of year is pretty simple.

I have a boveda butler, sensor push, and 4 standard digital hygrometers in the unit.  I can tell you from years of use that you should not trust what the boveda butler says! Put it in a sealed bag or tupperwear and look at the readings from different boveda RH packets and you'll see what I mean!

I have them running 24/7. Should I set them on a schedule instead of leaving them on all the time? I put my butler and other hygrometers in a air tight container with a 65% and they all read 64-65%. This condensation is making me nuts. 

[jackupster]

49 minutes ago, Big Al said:

I have them running 24/7. Should I set them on a schedule instead of leaving them on all the time? I put my butler and other hygrometers in a air tight container with a 65% and they all read 64-65%. This condensation is making me nuts. 

The unit is designed to lower the temp about 10F max lower than ambient temp.  Raise the temp and you should be better off. When I had this model I left it unplugged and had no issues. I did have it in a room that only gets to the low 70s in the summer. AC controlled basement level room.