Cigar freezing technique

[jazzboypro]

Hello all,

So yesterday was my annual cigar inspection. All went fine until i inspected an open box of R&J short churchils. The box is from 2016 and is about 60% full. Most of the remaining cigars had holes in them but i did not see any beetles. All the other boxes were ok. I find it strange to see this problem on 2016 box. At any rate, i wrapped the remaining boxes in saran wrap and i put them in the fridge. I am going to freeze all the boxes.

As of this writing, the cigars have been in the fridge for almost 24 hours. I am thinking of putting them in the freezer this evening for 48 hours, than back in the fridge for another 24 hours and then back in the coolidor.

Does any of you use a better technique for freezing your cigars ?

Thanks

[The Squiggler]

There seem to be differences of opinion on exact technique, but I ran across the following and found it to be informative (basically, you want to find the exact temp of your freezer and proceed from there):

Quote

Cigar Beetle eggs can be killed by exposure to temperatures easily obtainable by home refrigerators/freezers. An industrial deep freeze is not required, as rumor has indicated.

There is a direct correlation between the time it takes to kill and temperature. The colder the temp, the shorter it takes to kill eggs.

The figures below are time to kill 95% (abbreviated LT95) of eggs exposed to the environment. Keep this in mind when applying these figures to cigars because 1) we want to kill 100% of eggs and 2) any eggs inside our cigars have a thick layer of insulating tobacco that must be cooled before the eggs will reach that temperature.

5c (41f) requires ~12 days (275 hours)
0c (32f) requires ~9 days (220 hours)
-5c (23f) requires ~4 days (100 hours)
-10c (14f) requires less than 24 hours
-15c (5f) requires less than 24 hours
-20c (-4f) requires less than 24 hours


The length of time you should freeze your cigars depends on the temperature your freezer is at. I highly recommend that everyone using their freezer to treat cigars keeps a fridge/freezer thermometer in there so they know roughly what temp range their freezer runs at. These are available at most grocery stores, usually with baking supplies. From experience I have seen home freezers that run anywhere from 1 degree below freezing to as low as -25c.
Right now I am trying to get data on how long it takes a cigar to go from room temp to 5c, and from 5c to -20c. Based on data from other consumables I estimate it would take a cigar at least 24 hours to reach the same temperature as the freezer (equilibrium) when it is moved into the freezer from the refrigerator. Based on this alone one should add 24 hours to amount of time cigars are kept in the freezer.
The times given above are to kill 95% of eggs. I have not found times required to kill 99.9% of eggs but doubling the LT95 for that temperature should be more than sufficient.

IN SUMMARY

Double bag your cigars and let them spend 24 hours in the refrigerator. I think everyone agrees that this gives the cigars a safe transition from room temp to near freezing. Move the cigars into the freezer. How long they should stay there depends on your freezer temp. If it is below -10c 72 hours in the freezer should be sufficient. That's 24 hours to get the cigars to -10c, 24 hours to kill 95% of eggs, and an extra 24 hours for good measure. When coming out of the freezer it is a good idea to let the cigars spend 24 hours in the fridge, and another 24 hours at room temp STILL SEALED IN THE BAGS. This protects the cigars from rapid changes in temp/humidity.

I know there are some out there who prefer to avoid freezing because of potential damage to cigars and the rest period required afterwards. The time required will vary greatly based upon the temp of your fridge. Keep in mind the temp will also fluctuate based on door opening/closing etc. (Although this occurs in the freezer, it is less of an issue due to the comparatively short time required) With an LT95 of 12 days at 5c I would personally keep cigars in there for at least 3 weeks.

This information should be applied to uninfested cigars for prevention of a beetle outbreak. If you have cigars that are infested or you know have been exposed to beetles they should be subjected to more lengthy treatment because they will presumably have far more eggs present than any uninfested cigars that picked up some eggs during manufacture.

[zappaFREAK]

Wow! Awesome post Squiggler!  I personally just throw them in my freezer for about 3 days +/- , I don’t do the refrigerator step but might adjust my approach. I have not noticed any problems without the refrigerator step.

[havanaclub]

Skip the fridge and right into the freezer. Don’t want them acclimating to the cold. 24 hrs may be negligible but I don’t risk it.
That same data posted talked about “acclimated larvae” at a lower temperature that needed much longer time in the freezer to kill.


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[jazzboypro]

Thanks for the info. I'll put the cigars in the freezer tonight and tomorrow i will buy a thermometer. Since i use a dedicated freezer (not a fridge/freezer combo) i am pretty sure it is well below the freezing point. The affected box will stay in the freezer much longer

[Fuzz]

Just remember, you need to get the core chilled down below freezing. If you pile all the boxes in the freezer for 24hrs, the outer boxes may be below freezing, but the core could be above freezing.

 

[Mikeltee]

This is the sole reason that I use 236oz Tupperware and 2 Bovedas. It holds about 50 singles or 3 dress boxes, or 2 cabs. If there is a bad box, it will be quarantined to only its tupperdor...

Sole reason my ars... I'd rather spend the funds on cigars than a fancy humidor that I know will fill up in a heartbeat. The boss wouldnt let me put a humidor in a public area anyways.

[The Squiggler]

2 hours ago, zappaFREAK said:

Wow! Awesome post Squiggler!  I personally just throw them in my freezer for about 3 days +/- , I don’t do the refrigerator step but might adjust my approach. I have not noticed any problems without the refrigerator step.

Thanks!  I was especially impressed with this because of the level of specificity and attention to scientific detail, so I thought I'd share.  I think it's always nice to gather some conception of specifically what's happening when you undertake a process like this (and then you can decide for yourself which steps are somewhat trivial and which ones are most indispensable).  This write-up (despite the fact that I can't personally confirm the minutia it presents) seems well thought out and thoroughly investigated, so I'm inclined to take it to heart. 

[Mikeltee]

1 hour ago, havanaclub said:

Skip the fridge and right into the freezer. Don’t want them acclimating to the cold. 24 hrs may be negligible but I don’t risk it.
That same data posted talked about “acclimated larvae” at a lower temperature that needed much longer time in the freezer to kill.


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24 hours in the fridge is going to get the box cold. It would take several days before the center of the cigars were the same as the temp of the fridge. I highly doubt that an egg acclimating to the cold would occur at anything less than a month. I agree with you that the fridge is a waste of time. Freezing anything is going to effect the taste and quality of ANYTHING including fermented tobacco leaves. I know my pallet isnt going to notice a difference, but my decades of experience as a chef and connoisseur of all things that can be smoked knows for a fact that the freezer is for ice cream. I would avoid freezing my whole stash at all costs. It's bad enough that Havana freezes them and Rob as well. 

[The Squiggler]

39 minutes ago, Mikeltee said:

24 hours in the fridge is going to get the box cold. It would take several days before the center of the cigars were the same as the temp of the fridge. I highly doubt that an egg acclimating to the cold would occur at anything less than a month. I agree with you that the fridge is a waste of time. Freezing anything is going to effect the taste and quality of ANYTHING including fermented tobacco leaves. I know my pallet isnt going to notice a difference, but my decades of experience as a chef and connoisseur of all things that can be smoked knows for a fact that the freezer is for ice cream. I would avoid freezing my whole stash at all costs. It's bad enough that Havana freezes them and Rob as well. 

It has been posited that 3 weeks at ~35-40 degrees F (0-5 degrees C) will also kill larvae.  I'm not sure about the 'acclimatized' larvae factor, but this could possibly be a viable option to freezing.  Then again, it seems to me that freezing may not have as drastic of an effect on cigars as one might imagine.  Cell structure will determine how any particular item/substance will be affected by freezing, after all, and the cells of a fermented tobacco leaf should be more far more resilient to freezing temperatures than, say, those of a bell pepper (which would be completely destroyed due to the rupturing of the cell walls as the water content turns to ice and swells).  I am by no means attempting to imply that freezing will have no negative effect, but I think it might be far less extreme than the contrast between certain fresh foods and their frozen counterparts.

[Homer]

I keep all my new cigars 3 days in freezer and after that 1 day in fridge. Then into my humidor but I keep cigars in plastic bags (ziplock) for couple of weeks.

[SCgarman]

16 hours ago, jazzboypro said:

Thanks for the info. I'll put the cigars in the freezer tonight and tomorrow i will buy a thermometer. Since i use a dedicated freezer (not a fridge/freezer combo) i am pretty sure it is well below the freezing point. The affected box will stay in the freezer much longer

I have a commercial grade chest freezer. Box goes into a Ziploc bag, suck the air out and seal. Into freezer at -5 to -10 F for 48 hours. Take box out of freezer, box out of Ziploc and rest at room temperature for 30 minutes then back into humidor cabinet. No issues with wrappers nor taste whatsoever. The refrigerator step is really unnecessary, but if it makes you feel better go for it. It did nothing for me.

[CaptainQuintero]

19 hours ago, jazzboypro said:

Hello all,

So yesterday was my annual cigar inspection. All went fine until i inspected an open box of R&J short churchils. The box is from 2016 and is about 60% full. Most of the remaining cigars had holes in them but i did not see any beetles. All the other boxes were ok. I find it strange to see this problem on 2016 box. At any rate, i wrapped the remaining boxes in saran wrap and i put them in the fridge. I am going to freeze all the boxes.

As of this writing, the cigars have been in the fridge for almost 24 hours. I am thinking of putting them in the freezer this evening for 48 hours, than back in the fridge for another 24 hours and then back in the coolidor.

Does any of you use a better technique for freezing your cigars ?

Thanks

 I've been doing this for over a decade:

Double bag

Freezer for 4+days 

Fridge for 24 hours 

On the side for 24 hours

Then into the humidor

  The idea behind the fridge after is to slow to warming up of the leaf to prevent splitting. I don't know if it's backed by science but I've never experienced and wrapper splits from it.

  Never experienced any negative issues with taste or construction from freezing in all this time. Never had a single beetle appear in over a decade since I started. 

  I can only comment what's worked for me 

[jazzboypro]

Finally bought the thermometer. The temperature is the freezer is -17 C (1.4 F). Took the boxes out of the freezer after 5 days (except the affected box) and they have been in the fridge for the past 48 hours.

I now have to plans, not sure about the one i should follow.

Plan A

1- Unwrapp each boxes and inspect the cigars to see if the freezing has damaged the cigars.

2- Wrap each boxes again and put them in the coolidor

 

Plan B

1- Unwrap each boxes and inspect the cigars to see if the freezing has damaged the cigars.

2- Put the the unwrapped boxes in the coolidor

3- Wait a few weeks and inspect the cigars again

4- Wrap each box again and leave in coolidor

 

What's your take ? Any other recommendations ?

 

Thanks

[Mikeltee]

I would be concerned about residual moisture from the process. You may want to "dry them out" in a dark closet for a couple days. If not put them in a humidor and keep a close eye on them which would involve unwrapping them and opening the boxes and verifying that the sticks arent wet which as I'm sure you are well aware that will soon turn to a green science project. As far as damage is concerned, the only noticable damage would be the taste but that's just some people's opinions. I'd let em rest 3+ months too before firing one up. You just shocked the crap out of them.

[Derboesekoenig]

5 hours ago, Mikeltee said:

I would be concerned about residual moisture from the process. You may want to "dry them out" in a dark closet for a couple days. If not put them in a humidor and keep a close eye on them which would involve unwrapping them and opening the boxes and verifying that the sticks arent wet which as I'm sure you are well aware that will soon turn to a green science project. As far as damage is concerned, the only noticable damage would be the taste but that's just some people's opinions. I'd let em rest 3+ months too before firing one up. You just shocked the crap out of them.

Cigars are more resilient than you think. Just throw them back in the coolidor, they'll be fine after 2-3 days in the fridge. 

[jazzboypro]

Thanks for your input guys. After unwrapping and inspecting all the boxes after 5 days in the freezer and 36 hour in the fridge, it looks like the freezing process did not damage the cigars from what i can tell. All boxes are now in the coolidor. The affected box is still in the freezer for a little while. I'll revesit and inspect the cigars again in a month or so. Some boxes will then be sealed again.

Hope te whole thing killed those PITA bugs

Cheers

[Bagman]

On 12/5/2019 at 4:05 PM, crking3 said:

I would recommend equal fridge and freeze times at least


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Complete opposite in my opinion.  Fridge is basically an unnecessary step.  All freezer.   Maybe 1 day after the freezer in the fridge if you must. 

[Monocle]

Newbie to freezing here but I want to do so as it makes sense. Do you take any different or extra preparatory precautions when freezing non full boxes? For example, three packs of individually cardboard packages singles (ala CoEs) or just 1/4 boxes arriving in a baggie. Just double bag it as-is in ziplock freezer bags?

[Bagman]

Just double bag it as-is in ziplock freezer bags

[Monocle]

35 minutes ago, Monterey said:

Just double bag it as-is in ziplock freezer bags

?. Figured as much.

[amberleaf]

I froze my entire collection after a beetle outbreak in a box I brought back from Cuba. I didn't bother with the fridge, just wrapped the boxes with film and put them into the freezer for 24 hours at -18C/0F. Leaving them in longer than that is unnecessary as everything should be dead in less than 8 hours at that temperature.

Cigars came out just as good as they went in. Just make sure they are back up to room temperature before unwrapping to prevent condensation.

[Ethernut]

Toss them in the freezer in a sealed baggie for a couple of days then toss them on the counter for a couple of days. That’s it. If they’re fresh custom rolls, they’re probably super wet anyway, I toss them on the counter for a day or two with the bag open. Then in the humi for a 30 day min sleep.

 

Keep in mind, unless there’s something wrong with the actual roll itself, the cigars are tougher than nails. You don’t have to fuss too much with them. Cheers!

[Puros Y Vino]

I use the following method. No issues ever.

Double ziploc bags, air squeezed out as much as possible.

24 hours in fridge.

5-7 days in freezer. (depending on the capabilities of your freezer, the can vary) as per what @The Squiggler posted.

24 hours back in fridge.

24 hours at room temp, away from the sun.

Into a humidor.  

I've found cigars to be somewhat tougher than expected.  They're elastic enough to survive the process and to my taste buds. there doesn't seem to be any ill effects on the enjoyment of the cigars either.

[Tonyontop]

I freeze everything I get as well.
Double bag in Ziplock freezer bags removing as much air as possible then straight into the freezer for 48hrs. Freezer temp is between -15c to -20c. Take out of freezer and leave at room temp for an hour or 2 then take out of ziplocks and into the wineador they go. Only been doing this for a little over a year - no issues thus far.

Just to clarify: Does Rob freeze all cigars sold on FOH?