Aging at High Temps

[PapaDisco]

As near as I can tell, the only reason we all store cigars below 70F is to avoid beetle hatches.  That, and perhaps a legacy of wine aging at lower temperatures.  But is there any evidence that 60F is better than 80F for maturing cigars (absent the beetle thing of course)?

KaVaLan whisky (Taiwan) accidentally demonstrated that whiskeys age better at higher temperatures rather than low.  https://www.winemag.com/2018/04/27/taiwan-indian-whisky/

So, does anyone know for sure?  Empirically ?  

[Smallclub]

I don't think one can compare distilled spirits with tobacco leaves. I would say that high temperatures increase the risk of further, unwanted fermentation?

[cfc1016]

Paging @Ethernut

[UpInSmoak]

I don’t have enough experience to know either way, but I did a quick internet search on average temps in Havana.  It seems that for most of the year Havana temps range on the higher side of what many would recommend for storage.  For people that have stumbled on a well aged cigar/box in Havana....do they not keep or smoke as well as one stored “properly”?

[PapaDisco]

3 hours ago, Smallclub said:

I don't think one can compare distilled spirits with tobacco leaves. I would say that high temperatures increase the risk of further, unwanted fermentation?

I'm not really comparing the two, merely pointing out that whiskey was traditionally aged like wine: at low temperatures.  This wasn't possible in Taiwan without refrigeration, and they accidentally discovered that the warmer temps (average of 85F) accelerated the 'aging' process.  

Higher temps should accelerate most chemical reactions.  That could be good, or not.  I think we all use the "cold, dark, still" formula for aging out of habit rather than out of proof it is best.  We have personal experience that, to some extent, informs us as to rH, but not so much when it comes to temperature (other than avoiding the dreaded beetle hatch).

[cigarsandcoffee]

@PigFish told me there is no reason to store below 70F, and he is the resident expert here.

[Fugu]

It depends on what you want to achieve. Example: While a maderisation under high oxygen levels will be desired in a madeira or certain stiles of sherry, it would be a severe wine fault in other wines.

I for one do prefer my cigars not to to exposed to heat...

[BrightonCorgi]

20 hours ago, Smallclub said:

I would say that high temperatures increase the risk of further, unwanted fermentation?

I could see this happening.  Could mold start easier in a warmer conditions as well?

[Canoli]

Seeing that the cigar has been around much longer than modern AC I would tend to believe that RH is more important to aging than temps. 

[Optic101]

Great Topic PD.
Looking at that since about 2014 and have my daily humidors and some of my boxes at "normal" SG temperature (80-85f) the rest fridge (65f) sleeping.

3-4 years in (below comments are mine and my experience)

For me there is a difference which is speed.
At 80-85F (RH58-60) over time (minimum 1 year) my cigars feel more rounder and flavour melt together ( most call it aged) compared to the one Fridge resting.
I would even say at Higher Temp some of my cigars develop more oil at the wrapper.

Some of you may ask how much faster, which I would guess in the area of 10-20% during the above time frame and my conditions.
For sure a concern is that they could go past their peak before I can smoke them. We shall see.

As a summary, I am happy with my High/Low mix and will continue to keep a bunch at "Cuba" conditions.

[ayepatz]

With wine, it seems to be that temperature fluctuations are the main enemy.

As long as your temperature is stable, there is a generally accepted range for wine storage from 10°C to 15°C (13°C is pretty much ideal), with aging occurring more slowly at lower temperatures, and more quickly at high ones.

I store my cigars in tupperdors in an understairs cupboard, without refrigeration, at 65%rh. The temperature is on the higher side, around 17/18°C, but pretty stable all year round. All appear to be aging well.

[cigaraholic]

I worry about drying out the oils in cigars at higher temps, especially long term aging. I like to age cool and on the damp side, then dry them out for smoking....but I do have a few cigars?

[Philc2001]

53 minutes ago, cigaraholic said:

I worry about drying out the oils in cigars at higher temps, especially long term aging. I like to age cool and on the damp side, then dry them out for smoking....but I do have a few cigars?

Assuming the RH is the consistent in both warm and cold storage scenarios, would there be any more drying in the warm conditions than the cold conditions? The drying out would be more of an RH concern wouldn't it?

[Optic101]

3 hours ago, Philc2001 said:

Assuming the RH is the consistent in both warm and cold storage scenarios, would there be any more drying in the warm conditions than the cold conditions? The drying out would be more of an RH concern wouldn't it?

Key is the right and stable RH matching actual temp. 

[PigFish]

@Mr. Piggy considers himself an expert on controlled storage and on the relationship of temperature and rH on the water content of the cigar. Mr. Piggy never claimed to be an expert on aging! Just for the record!!!

My comments regarding a preferred temperature has everything to do with running and maintaining the heuristic humidor; the empirical knowledge of the use of known, verifiable, controlled space, and how those conditions can affect the anecdotal here and now of the smoking experience. In other words, how water content affects the smoking of a cigar. This has nothing to do with the whimsical, mythical and incalculable world of aging a cigar for effect.

I chimed in here because my name was mentioned and from what it looks like, in a complementary fashion. It is flattering to be respected by one's peers. To be honest, my knowledge is based on science and my interest in water content, and what water does to the taste of a cigar. If I have lead anyone to believe that I am some form of guru on the topic of 'aging for effect,' let me clear the air of that here and now. I don't believe that guru exists, and to say the very least, I am not that guru !

The cigar is only as good at the roller and host of farmers, processors and producers make it. The only control that the end user has over it is how he/she keeps it (temperature and rH), and when he/she takes a match to it.

I am about the here and now of cigar keeping and cigar smoking. I am about what can be proven and quantified, and correlating "precision storage" to decades of anecdotal smoking experience. If that makes me an expert on aging cigars, then my friends you are in big trouble, becasue I consider the practice no more than a coincidental occurrence relating to having more cigars than I can smoke in a day, while storing them around 70F and 60rH for very long periods of time.

Welcome to the world of being an expert. You all know as much as I do about 'aging' cigars!

Cheers! -the Pig