Are this authentic?

[BonVivant]

I am trying to find out about this RyJ Fabulosos from 1995-96. Are this custom rolled? Are this fakes?

I would just like to get to the bottom of what the hell are those? Thanks in advance. Leo.

[BonVivant]

cigars:

[BonVivant]

more:

[BonVivant]

And more:

[BonVivant]

And yet more:

[BonVivant]

box codes:

[Trevor2118]

I am trying to find out about this RyJ Fabulosos from 1995-96. Are this custom rolled? Are this fakes?

I would just like to get to the bottom of what the hell are those? Thanks in advance. Leo.

Please measure & advise the ring & length of these cigars.

Please advise the origin of these cigars.....ie who is offering them (GENERALLY ONLY.....online store, eBay etc)

[BonVivant]

And more box codes:

[BonVivant]

Please measure & advise the ring & length of these cigars.

Please advise the origin of these cigars.....ie who is offering them (GENERALLY ONLY.....online store, eBay etc)

Hi Trevor,

The cigars measure are 47" X 9"+ and are not for sale, trade, etc... (and no online stores, Ebay, etc...)

The cigars have been acquired from a prominent Russian vendor, but you know all of this already. I have been writing to you for more than two months already.

Thanks, Leo

[El Presidente]

Leo I have never seen any so I am of little use upfront. If no one has a definitive answer over the coming days I will dig a little deeper.

[shrink]

Just out of curiosity, I did a brief web search. Trevor's website indicates that this cigar was offered in both a 10 ct. varnished box and a 25 ct. dress box, and claims that it was discontinued in the 1980's. Both Christie's and Mitchell Orchant have offered the 10 ct. boxes for sale, but not the 25er. Here is a pic of the 10 ct. box.

Wilkey, do you have any input?

[Ryan]

I may be wrong but I thought that the round "Vendido En Cuba - Comintur" stamp on the bottom always means a fake box.

Anybody else heard this?

[n2advnture]

All the info I could find was the sames as Trevor & Shrinks

Only came in 10 ct

Discontinued in the 80s

Measure 9 1/4" x 47

I hope this helps

~Mark

[Ginseng]

Wilkey, do you have any input?

I may be wrong but I thought that the round "Vendido En Cuba - Comintur" stamp on the bottom always means a fake box.

I'm afraid I don't have a good feeling about this. Inconsistent or troubling circumstantial (procurement), documentary (no prior record of such item from auction houses), and forensic (the Comintur stamp) evidence in isolation would be cause for skepticism. The confluence of all three constitute more than a little reason for concern.

That said, of course there is the possibility that this was a one-off, special, or favor...but the provenance would have to be air-tight. Absent that, the conservative outlook would be to consider these to be something than what they are purported to be.

Wilkey

[shortsqueeze]

I may be wrong but I thought that the round "Vendido En Cuba - Comintur" stamp on the bottom always means a fake box.

Anybody else heard this?

Yes

[Tampa1257]

I'm afraid I don't have a good feeling about this. Inconsistent or troubling circumstantial (procurement), documentary (no prior record of such item from auction houses), and forensic (the Comintur stamp) evidence in isolation would be cause for skepticism. The confluence of all three constitute more than a little reason for concern.

That said, of course there is the possibility that this was a one-off, special, or favor...but the provenance would have to be air-tight. Absent that, the conservative outlook would be to consider these to be something than what they are purported to be.

Wilkey

I agree with Wilkey on this matter, I do not have a good feeling about these being authentic. My initial concern was when I saw the Comintur stamp, as I have never seen an authentic box of Cuban cigar have this stamp on it.

Tampa

[Trevor2118]

Hi Trevor,

The cigars measure are 47" X 9"+ and are not for sale, trade, etc... (and no online stores, Ebay, etc...)

The cigars have been acquired from a prominent Russian vendor, but you know all of this already. I have been writing to you for more than two months already.

Thanks, Leo

Sorry....did not immediately realise they were the same cigars.

[Trevor2118]

Just out of curiosity, I did a brief web search. Trevor's website indicates that this cigar was offered in both a 10 ct. varnished box and a 25 ct. dress box, and claims that it was discontinued in the 1980's. Both Christie's and Mitchell Orchant have offered the 10 ct. boxes for sale, but not the 25er. Here is a pic of the 10 ct. box.

Wilkey, do you have any input?

The B25 pre-1960 to mid 1960s, was available as different handmade "unknown" 47 x 190 vitola.

The BN10 (shrinks picture) are Gran Coronas 47 x 235.

[Trevor2118]

I may be wrong but I thought that the round "Vendido En Cuba - Comintur" stamp on the bottom always means a fake box.

Anybody else heard this?

This is certainly accepted as true around the forums.....but Comintur appears to have no translation into English (that I can find).

Closest appears to be Cominto ....roughly meaning no value.

What we need to now is:

1. what exactly this stamp means

2. who is applying these stamps

3. in what circumstances are these stamps applied.

[BonVivant]

This is certainly accepted as true around the forums.....but Comintur appears to have no translation into English (that I can find).

Closest appears to be Cominto ....roughly meaning no value.

What we need to now is:

1. what exactly this stamp means

2. who is applying these stamps

3. in what circumstances are these stamps applied.

The boxes were procured in Moscow, Russia in September and December 1996 at the only official shop (at the time) for Cuban cigars called "Habana". I knew the owner and shopped there from 1995 to 1998 in person. Up until the sale of the shop in 2001, the owner would put aside many boxes for me of exceptional quality (HdM DC's, Punch DC's, Punch Churchills, RyJ Churchills, Partagas Lusitanias and SDN4, Montecristo A's no.2's, just to name a few).

I never paid much attention to any stamps or boxes for that matter (except box factory/date codes), but as I remember all the boxes had this stamp at the time.

My attention was always on cigars and as I remember, when I saw for the first time Fabulosos in front of me, my heart skipped a beat. The cigars were ooozing oil, and the aroma of the highest quality cuban tobacco came from the box.

It is an enigma so far...

[Ginseng]

This is certainly accepted as true around the forums.....but Comintur appears to have no translation into English (that I can find).

Closest appears to be Cominto ....roughly meaning no value.

What we need to now is:

1. what exactly this stamp means

2. who is applying these stamps

3. in what circumstances are these stamps applied.

The only folklore I've heard regarding this stamp is that it was applied to boxes sold in hotels on the island under particular circumstances. I can't recall what they were but as with almost every counterfeit artifact, there is some tiny shred of reality buried haphazardly amidst the lies. How this stamp came to appear on boxes sold in Moscow, and in such large quantities, I have no idea.

Wilkey

[Habanos2000]

This is certainly accepted as true around the forums.....but Comintur appears to have no translation into English (that I can find).

Closest appears to be Cominto ....roughly meaning no value.

What we need to now is:

1. what exactly this stamp means

2. who is applying these stamps

3. in what circumstances are these stamps applied.

Isn't there a special stamp applied to boxes that are sold IN Cuba? I recall hearing something about that but not sure if Comintur is the same thing.

[Ginseng]

I believe what you're thinking of is the hologram sticker applied to boxes sold in Cuba.

Wilkey

[BonVivant]

Thank you for all input.

Does anybody know of any service to establish the age of the tobacco in the cigars?

Thank you in advance.

Leo

[tugboat]

I may be wrong but I thought that the round "Vendido En Cuba - Comintur" stamp on the bottom always means a fake box.

Anybody else heard this?

I found this on the web. I have NO idea who this guy is.

“Tiendas Intur” boxes are usually intended for sale within the Cuban tourism industry so that box would’ve been sold in airport kiosks, tourist stops or cigar shops at club resorts and restaurants.

The ink stamp indicates that the box of cigars is for sale at the Tiendas Intur; Government-run shops/stores for the tourist industry in Cuba.

James-Yee