U.K. Generational Tobacco Ban Resurrected by New Labour Government

[JohnS]

The recent UK general election put a pause to put this bill into effect, but now it looks certain to go ahead. Read on...

U.K. Generational Tobacco Ban Resurrected by New Labour Government

July 12, 2024 - Charlie Minato

On Tuesday, King Charles will deliver the king’s speech, which will outline the plans of the U.K.’s newly-elected government. As expected, those plans include bringing back a proposal that would ban the sale of tobacco products to anyone born after 2008.

According to a report from The Guardian, the generational tobacco ban will be included in the remarks, which are written by the majority but delivered by King Charles. This speech is likely to be quite different than the one King Charles delivered in November. In the July 4 election, the Labour Party won 412 of the 650 seats, ending 14 years of rule by the Conservative Party.

The generational tobacco ban was proposed by the last government. Former Prime Minister Rishi Sunak championed the cause for the last couple of years. In April, the bill cleared a key vote, though more work was needed to make it a law. All of that came to a halt once Sunak called for the July 4 elections.

If anything, the bill should have a much easier time passing now that Labour is in control. Of the 67 votes against the bill in April, 59 were by Conservative members. If passed, the bill would ban the sale of tobacco products to anyone born after Jan. 1, 2009. In addition, it would make it illegal to sell or give anyone under the age of 18 any vaping products and allow for the Secretary of State to enact new vaping regulations. Furthermore, it would increase the penalties for those caught violating tobacco age restriction rules to include a maximum penalty of a one-year ban on selling tobacco and/or vaping products for businesses caught repeatedly violating the rules.

New Zealand was the first country to introduce a generational tobacco ban, though less than a year after it passed, the country’s new government announced and followed through with plans to reverse course on the policy.

Source: https://halfwheel.com/u-k-generational-tobacco-ban-resurrected-by-new-labour-government/440752/

[ha_banos]

Yeah labour promised to honour this pre-election. I guess H&F and others will lobby the gov. But I expect to no avail. 

Lumping all tobacco and smoking related products together is the simplest thing. Let's see what they do with weed...

I expect a lot of problems for the common man in our future here. We are planning an escape route personally. 

I have very very low expectations. We needed change. The previous lot clearly did not have the nation's interests at heart. But we need a miracle..

[SonicStag]

Just don’t see how policing this generational ban would work when the they can’t even get to grips with knife crime. Doubt it will be priority though with the mess they’ve got to clear up from the Tory’s. 

[ha_banos]

7 minutes ago, SonicStag said:

Just don’t see how policing this generational ban would work when the they can’t even get to grips with knife crime. Doubt it will be priority though with the mess they’ve got to clear up from Tory’s. 

We expect to hear about it in the king's speech on Wednesday...

[cnov]

Even as a cigar smoker I don't see the issue with this. I'd be happy to see a reprieve for cigars but it's not hard to see the damage that cigarettes do, it's not something I'd want my kids doing.

I hope they do the same for vaping, seems bonkers that they've been allowed, everywhere you turn you can see people clinging onto them for dear life! The lungs are too delicate to be messed about with.

Is there clinical study on the effects of cigar smoking? We obviously know how terrible cigarettes or any inhalation of smoke is, but have there been studies on those that don't inhale? I'd be interested regardless, but you'd think that any cigar merchant facing these bans would look to prove something clinically rather than just plain old lobbying.

This bill also represented something that British politics doesn't seem to see too often, even when it comes to feeding the very poorest kids, cross party agreement.

[99call]

14 hours ago, cnov said:

cross party agreement.

Yep, thankfully adults back in the room. The policy is the only bit of clear thinking that came out of the Tory party in 14yrs, and should be supported. Those who wish to smoke will find a way, just like those who want to smoke weed. It's massively unlikely to be strongly enforced and largely impossible to regulate. But if we can stop kids smoking cigarettes and vaping then it's a massive positive.

[Li Bai]

Fwiw and as it has already been discussed before, I strongly disagree. If that happens then what's next?

I'm not advocating for cigarettes but rather for free will. And above all a ban won't work anyway, it's only a sleight of hand.

If we want to get rid of cigarettes, only education will be effective and it will take another generation at least.

 

[El Presidente]

9 hours ago, Li Bai said:

Fwiw and as it has already been discussed before I strongly disagree. If that happens then what's next?

Agreed. Bureaucrats only become emboldened with populace control. Pasty government middle age men and women on endless Microsoft Team calls plotting plans to protect those members of the public perceived too stupid to make decisions for themselves (that would be everybody outside of their circle). The image of ideological perfection is themselves. At the end of the day they all head home on the tube/bus/Prius where they pop a frozen meal in the microwave, eat alone on the couch, watch a titilating bit of ABC/Vox, before retiring with their pet cat and delving into the delights of a camomile tea. 

[JohnS]

U.K. Generational Tobacco Ban Resurrected by New Labour Government (Update)

July 17, 2024 - Charlie Minato

On Tuesday, King Charles will deliver the king’s speech, which will outline the plans of the U.K.’s newly-elected government. As expected, those plans include bringing back a proposal that would ban the sale of tobacco products to anyone born after 2008.

Update (July 17, 2024) — As expected, King Charles signaled the Labour government would reintroduce the proposal. In his speech, King Charles said, “A Bill will be introduced to progressively increase the age at which people can buy cigarettes and impose limits on the sale and marketing of vapes.” 

According to a report from The Guardian, the generational tobacco ban will be included in the remarks, which are written by the majority but delivered by King Charles. This speech is likely to be quite different than the one King Charles delivered in November. In the July 4 election, the Labour Party won 412 of the 650 seats, ending 14 years of rule by the Conservative Party.

The generational tobacco ban was proposed by the last government. Former Prime Minister Rishi Sunak championed the cause for the last couple of years. In April, the bill cleared a key vote, though more work was needed to make it a law. All of that came to a halt once Sunak called for the July 4 elections.

If anything, the bill should have a much easier time passing now that Labour is in control. Of the 67 votes against the bill in April, 59 were by Conservative members. If passed, the bill would ban the sale of tobacco products to anyone born after Jan. 1, 2009. In addition, it would make it illegal to sell or give anyone under the age of 18 any vaping products and allow for the Secretary of State to enact new vaping regulations. Furthermore, it would increase the penalties for those caught violating tobacco age restriction rules to include a maximum penalty of a one-year ban on selling tobacco and/or vaping products for businesses caught repeatedly violating the rules.

New Zealand was the first country to introduce a generational tobacco ban, though less than a year after it passed, the country’s new government announced and followed through with plans to reverse course on the policy.

Source: https://halfwheel.com/u-k-generational-tobacco-ban-resurrected-by-new-labour-government/440752/

[ha_banos]

The king didn't use the word tobacco. He referred to cigarettes and vapes! We're home free! 🕺💃

Edit: Maybe Jimmy got to him...Too much?

🎆🎉🎉🎉

[Chitmo]

I think this is a terrible idea, I think individual provincial governments in Canada are talking about this as well. Did we learn nothing from prohibition? 🤣 Smoking a pack of cigarettes a day isn’t ideal, but it’s not hurting anyone other than the person smoking them (normally at least). Being able to choose how to live is important, life is to short to have to follow a million stupid imposed regulations. 

[Ford2112]

Draconian 

[Pvalue83]

While on a personal level, I am no fan of cigarettes, I think this taking away of rights by stealth is a perfect example of our society's elites (e.g. politicians, health experts, bureaucrats etc.) opening themselves up to accusations of a short-term focus on good intentions irrespective of whether or not these good intentions actually deliver aggregate good outcomes (not to mention hypocrisy).

Call me simple-minded, but if you feel strongly that cigarettes should be banned, then you should propose a law banning cigarettes for all and take it to an election. Let the people decide whether the pros of this freedom are outweighed by the cons.

I think passing a divisive law (i.e. splitting our population into legal/illegal smokers) whose primary impact is on the very people who have no say in the matter is not a wise approach to building long-term consensus.

[99call]

3 hours ago, Pvalue83 said:

society's elites (e.g. politicians, health experts, bureaucrats etc.)

What about senior executives for British American tobacco earning vast salaries , are they also "society's elites"?. I must have things completely upside down in my head. People swanning around the world on private jets and super yachts, are actually salt of the earth diamond geezers, that are constantly concerning themselves with all of societies ills.

Whereas its the junior radiologist earning £45k a year, with £95k of student debt, who's dedicated their whole live to studying and working save other peoples lives, who gets spat on when they finish their shifts, by conspiracy theorist idiots...they're "the elites"? Makes total sense.

The word 'elites' has obviously been weaponised by the right, to toxify the public against specialists. We in the UK have been attacking specialist for the last 15yrs, and we ended up with a group of talentless, populist, moronic knuckle draggers, who would sell their gran for an envelope stuffed with cash. They attacked specialists, to attack oversight, or loosen regulations to make money for their benefactors, and those who lobbied them. Disgusting self-serving criminals, and I can ensure you there was nothing 'elite' about those politicians. 

I don't intend this as an attack on you. I'm just sick of people using the 'elites' to undermine people who actually have qualifications and knowledge and in turn embolden a group of people who are just interested in deregulation and self enrichment. I would also add that I'm not be in favour of using the word 'elites' in a negative context towards wealthy people.

3 hours ago, Pvalue83 said:

Let the people decide

For stuff like this I'm in favour of what I believe in the UK is referred to as a "citizens assembly". It's currently considering this as a mechanism to deal with such matters. A bit like jury duty, a sample group that is representative of the wider UK population would be called upon to verse themselves on the matter and vote. Calling the whole nation to vote on every matter is hugely costly on time and money, not to mention toxic (see Brexit). Citizens assembly's maybe seen as a way to deal with such issues.

[El Presidente]

1 hour ago, 99call said:

The word 'elites' has obviously been weaponised by the right,  to toxify the public against specialists.   

...it is nice to see the worm turn...the left has had it too good for too long  

[El Presidente]

1 hour ago, 99call said:

I'm just sick of people using the 'elites' to undermine people who actually have qualifications and knowledge

.....like George Clooney/ De Niro etal 

[99call]

1 minute ago, El Presidente said:

....it is nice to see the worm turn....the left has had it too good for too long  

I couldn't give a monkeys about it being a left or right thing, which I said at the end. I'm not in favour of people on the left called wealthy people elites.

What I do find dangerous is people being radicalised to think someone having a qualification within their chosen profession, is somehow a bad thing.

 

[99call]

5 minutes ago, El Presidente said:

.....like George Clooney/ De Niro etal 

I have no desire to protect stars. I find them embarrassing and often make like harder to make political progress.

[El Presidente]

1 hour ago, 99call said:

What I do find dangerous is people being radicalised to think someone having a qualification within their chosen profession, is somehow a bad thing.

But why is that different to "people being radicalised to think someone having worked hard and becoming wealthy is somehow a bad thing."

It's the same crap. Left or right. 

[El Presidente]

1 hour ago, 99call said:

I have no desire to protect stars. I find them embarrassing and often make like harder to make political progress.

But are they not the shining stars of the left? Who act as the attack dogs for NYT/Left media opinion pieces, agitate in politics. 

To the vast majority of the right, they are the "elites". Your "radiologist" trope  is a red herring/dog whistle. I don't know anyone who begrudges their every success let alone "who gets spat on when they finish their shifts" If people are actually lining up to spit on specialists in the UK...at the end of their shift...then you have issues. 

[Chitmo]

2 hours ago, Pvalue83 said:

While on a personal level, I am no fan of cigarettes, I think this taking away of rights by stealth is a perfect example of our society's elites (e.g. politicians, health experts, bureaucrats etc.) opening themselves up to accusations of a short-term focus on good intentions irrespective of whether or not these good intentions actually deliver aggregate good outcomes (not to mention hypocrisy).

Call me simple-minded, but if you feel strongly that cigarettes should be banned, then you should propose a law banning cigarettes for all and take it to an election. Let the people decide whether the pros of this freedom are outweighed by the cons.

I think passing a divisive law (i.e. splitting our population into legal/illegal smokers) whose primary impact is on the very people who have no say in the matter is not a wise approach to building long-term consensus.

A country could go broken in a hurry having a referendum for every decision, that’s why we elect officials to make decisions. There’s not enough smokers in any population to make it an important enough decision to organize and pay for a vote. 

 

[99call]

1 hour ago, El Presidente said:

But why is that different to "people being radicalised to think someone having worked hard and becoming wealthy is somehow a bad thing."

It's the same crap. Left or right. 

To me in the UK a negative angle someone on the left may use to call someone and 'Elite' is a blue blood class thing and a doesn't relate to standard business or wealthy people. 

The use of 'Elites' by the right I find incredibly disturbing, as it's effectively an attack on education or professions, and actually places the average right wing voter themselves  in harms way. I.e. I'm not going to that elitist dentist. I'm going to rip my own teeth out. To me it victimised both the average left and right wing voter.

[99call]

1 hour ago, El Presidente said:

" If people are actually lining up to spit on specialists in the UK .......at the end of their shift.......then you have issues. 

This 100% happened during COVID. Nurses finishing shifts being picketed by vaccine nut jobs. Physically Intimidated and spat on.

[El Presidente]

1 minute ago, 99call said:

To me in the UK a negative angle someone on the left may use to call someone and 'Elite' is a blue blood class thing and a doesn't relate to standard business or wealthy people. 

I think there are some rose coloured glasses being worn here. 

The UK media is full of " rich boomer blame". Nothing to do with blue blood class. All to do with "green".  Happy to link as many articles as you want. 

[99call]

1 hour ago, El Presidente said:

But are they not the shining stars of the left? Who act as the attack dogs for NYT/Left media opinion pieces, agitate in politics. 

What can I tell you Rob? You think they embarrassing and silly. And so do I. They are not specialists in what they are trying to involved themselves in. Bono. Jolie etc etc. All tragic and pathetic.