Initial effects of plain packaging in canada?

[El Presidente]

One for our Canadian brethren. 

Fill us in on the initial effects of cigar plain packaging for retailers in Canada. 

I know it won't be pretty, but it would be great to hear of green shoots/ resilience.  

[Bijan]

I've only been to a brick and mortar once since plain packaging came in, due to covid, etc.

That wasn't too long ago, maybe a month ago. None of the cigars I looked at was plain packaged. Don't know if it was old stock, etc. But by now that should have been sold off anyways.

I do see people buy the plain packaged cigars though.

I also see individual "unofficial" suppliers on Facebook with non-plain-packaged product.

Makes you wonder if vendors are going to start going behind Havana house's back (the Canadian distributor) and get grey/black market product.

Edit: On further reflection I have seen a box from a Canadian domestic online retailer that was not from Havana house and had the serial removed (the micro printed ones were intact and valid). The vendor claimed it was from a source they have been dealing with for 10 years+, but it's the first I come across such a box in this scenario.

[El Presidente]

No brickbats intended  to any retailers. 

From experience, you do what you need to do to get it done. Fly the Jolly Roger where you can. 

[Puros Y Vino]

9 hours ago, Bijan said:

I have seen a box from a Canadian domestic online retailer that was not from Havana house and had the serial removed (the micro printed ones were intact and valid). The vendor claimed it was from a source they have been dealing with for 10 years+, but it's the first I come across such a box in this scenario.

I think I know which one. A lot of distributors scratch out the serial #'s as to not reveal themselves. It helps them move stock outside of their region.  And I think you're right. Some retailers may find another sales route.  The FB flippers are getting their stock from "cheaper"(ie not taxed) sources so it will be hard to compete.  I haven't gone into a B&M in a while myself but a friend did hand me a PL Galanes and LFDC with a green band on it.  The original bands were underneath. Don't know about the boxes though.

[Cigar Surgeon]

Bit of a mixed bag. Consumption went way up during COVID so some of the shops in Calgary and Edmonton have done quite well. People are buying plain packaged cigars, and apparently the Feds secretly gave another 12 months of leeway for clearing out existing inventory due to COVID. Ironically because of plain packaging SKUs have been cut to the bone, and what product is being marketed isn't available because of supply chain issues.

One of the retailers told me there was a manufacturer that had a release that was delayed to market because of COVID. I can't remember how many boxes it was, 5,000 or 10,000 but the retailer reached out to him and offered to buy the entire run. The manufacturer said he'd talk about it after he made the boxes available on the market, but he was completely sold through in less than 6 hours across Canada.

Alberta has a bit of reprieve with the out of nowhere cigar lounge reversal. It remains to be seen who is going to be the first one to take the risk and build. 

[benfica_77]

As Frank alluded the bands are actually under the stupid plain packaging green labels but the actual boxes are flimsy cardboard that i'm surprised if you can stack more than 3 on top of each other. 

B and Ms are hurting for sure and even though there has been aggressive expansion of one chain here in Ontario called Havana Castle I don't see their long term sustainability. My local B and M is pushing more non-cubans and the product lines being kept in stock is a lot less. 

People are finding alternative routes to get their cigars, when people are showing their purchases  on FB very few are showing plain packaging i.e. purchased through proper channels. 

[ChanceSchmerr]

I was in my local B&Ms here in Victoria about 2 months back, just to check in and get my latest issue of Cigar Journal.  A bit of a mixed bag, most of the NC's are now plain packaged but most Cuban stock was still original packaging.  Lots of disgruntlement with the plain packaging look (particularly the cardboard box, rather than the bands).

The biggest issue here actually is the lost access to American tourist market.  Cuban cigar shops here in Victoria catered to Americans travelling through on Cruise Ships, Whisky Festival, etc.  With that traffic dried up, they are not moving stock in anywhere close to the volume as before. I suspect one of the stores will close down as a result (their building is up to for lease, TBH).  

[Bijan]

I don't follow the NC world much, but just saw on Facebook that Alec Bradley is pulling out of Canada and I think a few other names too.

[benfica_77]

1 hour ago, Bijan said:

I don't follow the NC world much, but just saw on Facebook that Alec Bradley is pulling out of Canada and I think a few other names too.

I'm not surprised. I expect more to follow.... 

I won't be surprised that if you can get a cheap flight to Cuba for 2/3 days, bring an empty suitcase and load up and bring it back it will cover for your flight and a good chunk of your own boxes selling the rest on FB. 

[Bagman]

2 hours ago, benfica_77 said:

I'm not surprised. I expect more to follow.... 

I won't be surprised that if you can get a cheap flight to Cuba for 2/3 days, bring an empty suitcase and load up and bring it back it will cover for your flight and a good chunk of your own boxes selling the rest on FB. 

Because Canada regularly allows unlimited purchasing and bringing thru customs???  Let me know how that works out

[Puros Y Vino]

1 hour ago, Monterey said:

Because Canada regularly allows unlimited purchasing and bringing thru customs???  Let me know how that works out

It's a crapshoot.  Sometimes you walk through sometimes you get hit.  In 5 trips I've been lucky. First and second trip I brought back 250 & 375 cigars.  I know of guys who bring over 500+ per trip. 

[Cigar Surgeon]

21 hours ago, Bijan said:

I don't follow the NC world much, but just saw on Facebook that Alec Bradley is pulling out of Canada and I think a few other names too.

According to AB that's a rumor started by CC and AB wasn't even aware they were selling their cigars. 

[BellevilleMXZ]

On 9/24/2021 at 11:22 PM, Puros Y Vino said:

It's a crapshoot.  Sometimes you walk through sometimes you get hit.  In 5 trips I've been lucky. First and second trip I brought back 250 & 375 cigars.  I know of guys who bring over 500+ per trip. 

I wonder once things start to open back up and we can more easily go there, if they will be more or less apt. to check? I think the first time ill stick to limit and see what happens

[Hammer Smokin']

returning with 20 boxes of cigars? 

I can't imagine that going through without questions....is it cuban 100 cigars per person? 

[Bijan]

14 hours ago, Hammer Smokin' said:

returning with 20 boxes of cigars? 

I can't imagine that going through without questions....is it cuban 100 cigars per person? 

I think legal tax free limit is 50 cigars per person.

 

[Cigar Surgeon]

2 hours ago, Bijan said:

I think legal tax free limit is 50 cigars per person.

 

For the US? it's 100. For Canada, it's 50. 

US customs most of the time couldn't give a rats ass about tobacco though.