Are all Cuban cigars....Cuban?

[Zedman05]

Heard it.
Probably the same place I heard about Cuba freezing cigars before leaving. Still have never seen proof and I have more evidence to the contrary.

[...]

29 minutes ago, Zedman05 said:

Heard it.
Probably the same place I heard about Cuba freezing cigars before leaving. Still have never seen proof and I have more evidence to the contrary.

The freezing facilities have been visited and photographed by a few people, pictures have been posted on this very forum... not sure if it confirms whether the procedure is followed every single time but food for thought 

[Puros Y Vino]

2 minutes ago, Jeanff said:

The freezing facilities have been visited and photographed by a few people, pictures have been posted on this very forum... not sure if it confirms whether the procedure is followed every single time but food for thought 

And while not exactly freezing. I did see a cold storage area at the La Corona factory on the ground floor.  There were shelves with bins of different cigars sitting in there just "chillin'"    I think the tour guide said the cigars are rested there after rolling about 2-3 weeks.  It was an interesting place to visit. Up on the floor where cigars were boxed I saw a few ladies putting Monte 2's into Dip 2 25 count boxes. Then emptying them and repeating the process with another 25 cigars.  I guess they were checking the fit?  They were probably waiting on the M2 boxes to arrive 

[Zedman05]

The freezing facilities have been visited and photographed by a few people, pictures have been posted on this very forum... not sure if it confirms whether the procedure is followed every single time but food for thought 

I have seen the thread.
My thoughts are; Cuba builds something once, then usually doesn't have the resources to maintain things properly that have parts and pieces from all parts of the world. Why has it been a question that was never proven until very recently, and how much do they actually use it ?
I would lay down a sizable bet to say they MAY have a facility now, but it never gets used on cigars that are sold on-island. I have seen too many boxes of cigars (in stores, personally, and from boxes people brought home) that had beetles.
This begs another question though; storage. If they are freezing everything, and beetle eggs are frozen, why is it more common in the boxes on the island ? Do they just store the cigars in way too warm a temp and thus increase gestation probability ?
I have purchased from our host, like most of us, and a couple other places and have never seen beetles in those boxes, just to be clear. So does everything now get frozen leaving the island ?

[SmokyFontaine]

7 minutes ago, Zedman05 said:

This begs another question though; storage. If they are freezing everything, and beetle eggs are frozen, why is it more common in the boxes on the island ? Do they just store the cigars in way too warm a temp and thus increase gestation probability ?
I have purchased from our host, like most of us, and a couple other places and have never seen beetles in those boxes, just to be clear. So does everything now get frozen leaving the island ?

Folks with more definitive information than I can weigh in, but just anecdotally, you would suspect that if things leaving the island weren't in fact frozen, many of us would have rampant beetle issues and we'd all be freezing upon receipt. As far as I can tell, very few are freezing cigars not purchased on the island. To your second question, yes, my understanding is that it is known that cigars sold IN Cuba are NOT frozen, and therefore if you've purchased in Cuba, you should 100% freeze when you get home.  

[El Presidente]

22 minutes ago, Zedman05 said:

I have seen the thread.
My thoughts are; Cuba builds something once, then usually doesn't have the resources to maintain things properly that have parts and pieces from all parts of the world. Why has it been a question that was never proven until very recently, and how much do they actually use it ?
I would lay down a sizable bet to say they MAY have a facility now, but it never gets used on cigars that are sold on-island. I have seen too many boxes of cigars (in stores, personally, and from boxes people brought home) that had beetles.
This begs another question though; storage. If they are freezing everything, and beetle eggs are frozen, why is it more common in the boxes on the island ? Do they just store the cigars in way too warm a temp and thus increase gestation probability ?
I have purchased from our host, like most of us, and a couple other places and have never seen beetles in those boxes, just to be clear. So does everything now get frozen leaving the island ?

They are frozen at least for exported stock. I can tell you they are simply because rampant beetle outbreaks in shipments stopped stone cold dead in 2005.  We haven't seen them since. Single hole in the odd box and with a dead beetle at that but nothing else in 14 years. 

On island, I am being told that it now all comes supplied from the same warehouse. That wasn't always the case. 

It doesn't matter. The house rollers leaves are not frozen. The customs people walk into the shops with are not frozen. It doesn't take long to track down a beetle in a LCDH humidor. 

 

 

[Nino]

2 hours ago, Zedman05 said:

Heard it.
Probably the same place I heard about Cuba freezing cigars before leaving. Still have never seen proof and I have more evidence to the contrary.

I have been to the Guanabacoa export warehouse a few times and have seen the commercial freezing areas for mastercases  - posted a few pics too. Like 10-12 years ago.

1 hour ago, Jeanff said:

The freezing facilities have been visited and photographed by a few people, pictures have been posted on this very forum... not sure if it confirms whether the procedure is followed every single time but food for thought 

Cannot confirm that procedures are followed 100% but have seen very little problems with beetles last 12-14 years.

1 hour ago, bundwallah said:

And while not exactly freezing. I did see a cold storage area at the La Corona factory on the ground floor.  There were shelves with bins of different cigars sitting in there just "chillin'"    I think the tour guide said the cigars are rested there after rolling about 2-3 weeks. 

That is the Escaparate - left hand side just before the stairway. No freezing there - just resting for a few months ...

23 minutes ago, El Presidente said:

It doesn't matter. The house rollers leaves are not frozen. The customs people walk into the shops with are not frozen. It doesn't take long to track down a beetle in a LCDH humidor.

Exactly the above applies and that is where the problem is   ^^^^

[Zedman05]

Thanks guys, love the discussion and not agruement.
I would have assumed the custom rolls would never have been frozen, as it is all just leaves entering. Never doubted that.
As far as newer freezing, this is a good sign. Hopefully it continues as I know everyone here likes not having to worry about it as much. I will still continue to freeze my stuff from when I go to the Island as a precaution, no matter box or bundle, for now.
Cheers.

[LLC]

When you can’t just let your product stand on its own or you are insecure, the natural reaction is to try drag down the competitors product.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[BJRPorter]

From an agriculture perspective, selling raw product to your competitors in the marketplace,  is a very common practice that is based upon supply. Neither buyer or seller ever advertises it, respectfully.

For tobacco, I’d guess it happens in each region between farmers, one is long, one is short on product, or had a poor harvest. Maybe the farmers are cousins or in-laws. Could it happen between regions?

[garnett]

Cuba has been using NC tobacco  for years just smell a 15 year Cuban compared with todays Cuban cigars. 

[Euripidespants]

My brother got a box of beetle ridden monte 4s about 5 or 6 years ago from a vendor we’ve gotten great stock from in the past...they were crazy riddled...this is before we found about FOH. I had many great boxes from this vendor but around the time of the beetle montes I got a box of terrible looking partagas P2s that looked water damaged. Like they had been dropped in a bathtub then dried out.
 

Stopped buying from them and They went out of business about a year or so later. Before that reliable but limited stock. Curious if they lost their contract and started selling fugazis then closed. The montes and p2s seemed legit but just very damaged. The monte box was replaced ...I took a discount on the p2s

[NSXCIGAR]

10 hours ago, Cigar Surgeon said:

Come on man. The same CC smokers that smoked a Brick House once and think all 762 brands of NCs taste the same? The delusion runs deep on both sides of the aisle. I know it all too well as someone with a foot in both worlds.

NC smokers say CCs are overrated. CC smokers say NCs are overrated. NC people say Cuba buys tobacco from the NC world. NC people say CCs are $25 a cigar. And so on, and so forth.

I've never heard CC smokers bag on NCs the way NC smokers bag on CCs. I've never personally heard or seen any CC smokers claim NCs are "overrated". If anything they simply say they don't prefer them. NC producers just outright say CCs are crap.

Always exceptions of course, but it's not even close which side spews the vast majority of the hate.

[Fuzz]

I'm always surprised when people say, "Oh, Cuba definitely don't freeze cigars because I found beetles when I bought a box from so and so". So beetles can't infect a box after it has been frozen? Does freezing magically convey a protective aura or special charm against beetles?

 

[BrightonCorgi]

11 hours ago, Euripidespants said:

My brother got a box of beetle ridden monte 4s about 5 or 6 years ago from a vendor we’ve gotten great stock from in the past...they were crazy riddled...this is before we found about FOH. I had many great boxes from this vendor but around the time of the beetle montes I got a box of terrible looking partagas P2s that looked water damaged. Like they had been dropped in a bathtub then dried out.

I always ask for cigars to be inspected before being shipped so things like this are less likely.

[DSegal]

On 10/29/2019 at 2:44 AM, El Presidente said:

I have heard the rumour for 25 years and always fed by those with a vested interest. 

I have never seen one scintilla of evidence. Not one bill of lading....nada. 

The Cubans have managed to screw everyone they have ever worked with. It is inconceivable that they wouldn't  have fallen out with Nic/Dom/Hond/Ecuadorian tobacco supplier/s and the end result wouldn't be plastered all over the world. 

 

Of course.....it would explain Anejados 

We know your lack of esteem for the Añejados but I would say if anything, they taste like old smooth and yes bland Cuban tobacco. Some of my oldest regular production sticks have tasted a lot like Añejados. Not unlike the pretzel companies that figured out they could market “pretzel pieces”, which until then were just broken ones that they’d sweep into the bin. 

[Euripidespants]

4 hours ago, BrightonCorgi said:

I always ask for cigars to be inspected before being shipped so things like this are less likely.

I always do as well. Either they didn’t inspect or the inspector was blind.

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1 hour ago, Euripidespants said:

I always do as well. Either they didn’t inspect or the inspector was blind.

Yep, that happens sometimes, matter of statistics. I remember getting an inspected box with all seals intact ?