tanking? ever acceptable?

[JohnS]

In regards to the Houston Astros, in winning the World Series in the manner they did they have effectively helped to evolve the game. As Baseball fans we all had a lot of fun watching "Moneyball" and how Billy Beane made competitive teams in Oakland with little salary and plenty of statistical data, well the Astros applied the same sabermetric approach to their draft picks. Now I imagine I will see every team in MLB will copy them.

[anacostiakat]

Don't like tanking as I like to see competitive games.  With the exception of a team already in the playoffs and resting major players at the end of a season to avoid injury which I think is ok.

I don't think the Redskins fans need to worry about the team tanking.   With all the injuries, poor coaching and subpar replacements they just stink at this point.

[Corylax18]

Just hire Ben McAdoo and call it a "mistake" you'll get a great pick. I agree that tanking defined as "taking the field with no intention of winning", than yes I disagree with that completely. I think that should be the only definition, because playing your young guys, instead of your high paid vets isn't tanking. That's just smart coaching. If all the multimillion dollar a year players haven't cut it yet, it makes a lot of sense to see what you have waiting in the wings. You know your chance to win right now will probably decrease if you do this, but with the possibility that your chance to win next year may increase. 

I don't know who the Skins have waiting in the wings, you know Kirk is going to cost $30 Mil+ a year if you want to keep him around, so the chances of him actually sticking around are very very low. It would make sense to start a younger guy, with the thoughts of seeing what he can do, it doesn't appear that that QB is on the roster though. 

[alloy]

3 hours ago, anacostiakat said:

 

I don't think the Redskins fans need to worry about the team tanking.   With all the injuries, poor coaching and subpar replacements they just stink at this point.

The Skins aren't "tanking" on purpose, the injuries and very, very poor coaching have a lot to do with the way they are playing. Now, even Gruden says it was his fault for not having his players ready to play. 

DJ Swearinger (who is a POS safety who can't cover a fly) says their practices are "blah". If this crap player says the team is practicing like excrement. And then they go out and lose like they have been doing, what does that tell you about the coaching?

I don't think the Skins are tanking for a draft pick, I think they are a poorly coached and managed team.

[Santiago]

In the NFL or NBA, one superstar player (qb) can transform the team from basement dwellers to championship contenders. Play poorly enough one year and you’ll be set for the next decade or beyond: see Tim Duncan, Peyton Manning, etc

In sports like the MLB one player has much less impact, so tanking is just embarrassing and unsportsmanlike. 

[Buck14]

A few points...

1. What is “THE ULTIMATE GOAL”? For me it’s to win a championship and to have a team that objectively is good enough to seriously compete for a championship year in year out.

2. So, for me anything that doesn’t expressly violate the League rules should be done to win a championship.

3. I have no issue with tanking.  It is better to be a horrible team for a few years than a mediocre team seemingly forever.

4. Of the four major North American sports, tanking is most prevalent in the NBA.  For me this would be largely solved by giving each team that does not make the playoffs the same chance of getting the top draft pick. Right now, the chances of getting the top pick is heavily weighted toward the worst teams.  This encourages tanking.  

[CrankYanker]

So when the Colts "tanked" back in 2011 when they knew that Peyton Manning was going to be out the whole year.  They knew a really good QB class was coming up in the 2012 class with RGIII and Andrew Luck.  No one really saw Russell Wilson as a top 5 pick in that draft.  The Colts signed Kerry Collins to a deal that year and played Curtis Painter as well.  It was a terrible season to watch and the only reason it was bearable for fans is because we knew what we were getting in 2012.  Our QB of the future.  Now as we look into this year and we do not have a chance to make the playoffs, I would be fine with losing more games to get a better draft pick.  I am not sure what the result will be with Luck and if he will ever play again now.

[zeedubbya]

I don’t believe any teams in high level sports EVER purposely tank it. I believe at the highest level there’s so much focus on getting the players mindset to thinking of “The Now” and tanking on purpose would be extremely detrimental to this culture (as someone else mentioned above). Also the people who play at the highest levels have such competitive personalities they would not do this. Even if a team is completely, utterly out of any chance of winning anything they are still playing to win every day they set foot on the field of play. Further, the coaches and management of these teams wouldn’t allow this to happen. I don’t believe a tanking conversation is ever had with any professional or college athletes. Protecting Health is another thing. Tanking, never.

Ken, to your point—I think it’s extremely naive to believe a team like the Washington Redskins would ever even have a conversation like this:

Jay: Hey guys thanks for coming to this meeting. Should we just tank the next 4 games so we can get a great draft pick next year?

Bruce: Might be a sound strategy at this point, I mean why would we want to try and win any more. It started out well, if we can just add Saquon Barkley we will probably run the whole NFC East next year. He’s so good! I’m with Jay on this one.

Dan: Yeah it makes perfect sense. My 2 Billion was made by taking a dive all the time. Sound strategy fellas, keep up the great work. Let’s tank it! Get Kurt in here and we can tell him the great news!

NEVER WOULD HAPPEN.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Geaux]

Wait - I am confused.  I was under the impression the Skins had been "Tanking" since the beginning of the season....????

 

 

[SignalJoe]

12 hours ago, JohnS said:

In regards to the Houston Astros, in winning the World Series in the manner they did they have effectively helped to evolve the game. As Baseball fans we all had a lot of fun watching "Moneyball" and how Billy Beane made competitive teams in Oakland with little salary and plenty of statistical data, well the Astros applied the same sabermetric approach to their draft picks. Now I imagine I will see every team in MLB will copy them.

I think the real interesting part will be how long they can keep that nucleus together.  Once those rookie contracts expire the Yankees, Red Sox and Dodgers among others will be offering life altering contracts to new free  agents.  

[mgcrunch]

How did you become a Redskins fan?

[Ken Gargett]

28 minutes ago, mgcrunch said:

How did you become a Redskins fan?

i worked in a law firm in DC for a year way way back. so far back it was the time that they were winning and won their last superbowl. i just assumed that was the skins and that we'd be like that forever. how wrong!

and yes, i agree with all those saying that they are not tanking, they are just horrible. sad to say but yes.

as for a conversation, first i have not suggested that they are or want to tank. it was a comment in reference to a general discussion on tanking but came up as it was amongst skins fans. i think gruden is too close to losing his job, as are a heap of players, for them to tank. and no, i doubt any club has such a blatant discussion but there are plenty of ways that it could be made known if that is what the owner/FO wanted. and clearly it has, given the responses in various posts.

as i have said, i agree that resting injured players or playing young players to assess them is very different.

[Ken Gargett]

8 hours ago, Buck14 said:

2. So, for me anything that doesn’t expressly violate the League rules should be done to win a championship.

 

i would be very surprised if most sports don't have a rule/regulation/whatever that says teams must not bring the league into disrepute. and tanking - in my definition - undoubtedly does that. it is simply a nice way to say cheating.

but there are exceptions, i believe, as i have noted. but it is very clear that aussies and americans in general have very different views on this. which is fine.

[mgcrunch]

15 hours ago, Ken Gargett said:

i worked in a law firm in DC for a year way way back. so far back it was the time that they were winning and won their last superbowl. i just assumed that was the skins and that we'd be like that forever. how wrong!

and yes, i agree with all those saying that they are not tanking, they are just horrible. sad to say but yes.

as for a conversation, first i have not suggested that they are or want to tank. it was a comment in reference to a general discussion on tanking but came up as it was amongst skins fans. i think gruden is too close to losing his job, as are a heap of players, for them to tank. and no, i doubt any club has such a blatant discussion but there are plenty of ways that it could be made known if that is what the owner/FO wanted. and clearly it has, given the responses in various posts.

as i have said, i agree that resting injured players or playing young players to assess them is very different.

That really was some time ago. Before Snyder. What an idiot. 

Having grown up outside of DC, I'm not a Skins fan. Their tribulations are unfortunate, but no emotional attachment for me. 

[Ken Gargett]

5 hours ago, mgcrunch said:

That really was some time ago. Before Snyder. What an idiot. 

Having grown up outside of DC, I'm not a Skins fan. Their tribulations are unfortunate, but no emotional attachment for me. 

dan does make one wonder. any bloke who makes about five billion by 40 can't be a fool and he is obviously as bigger fan of the skins as anyone. but then everything seems to descend into chaos. so depressing.