rugby continues to make itself irrelevant

[Ken Gargett]

Have just discovered that the wallabies v wales game, and presumably the entire tour, will not be televised (I refuse to get cable – I waste far too much time watching sport already and if I had access to unlimited cricket, NFL, soccer, golf and more, then I may as well buy 100 cats and nail the doors shut). I could go over to the family and watch it but i could not be bothered any more.

But what on earth is the ARU thinking? They cannot even get enough interest in a local station showing the games. Way to promote the game, ARU!  

If that does not sum up rugby in this country, what will? Even club level netball now gets televised. So too, A league soccer.

Rugby now ranks with synchronised swimming as far as public interest.

Mind you, the rugby league test between Australia and the kiwis will be televised, so I have something to watch. And no doubt the level of skill will be 100 times that of the wallabies.

I have sent a note to a good mate of mine who is MD of one of the wallaby sponsors asking why on earth he would want his products associated with such a mob of losers and idiots. I have suggested that if he asked krygios really nicely, he might let my mate sponsor him as well. It would be a step up on the wallabies/ARU.

[stogieluver]

What is "rugby"?? 

 

[Ken Gargett]

6 minutes ago, stogieluver said:

What is "rugby"?? 

 

the way the ARU operates, it won't be long before even its biggest fans (i used to be one) will wonder what rugby is.

[gweilgi]

Easy solution to this.

Don't bother trying to find a broadcast.  Get tickets to the match.

I shall be at Stade de France come November 19, watching the small hoping things take on the cheese-eating surrender minkeys ... and I shall enjoy every last minute of it.  Who needs cable?

As for the cats, don't nail the door shut.  Makes it harder to get at them when you want to do a spot of dropkick practice...

[Ken Gargett]

9 minutes ago, gweilgi said:

Easy solution to this.

Don't bother trying to find a broadcast.  Get tickets to the match.

I shall be at Stade de France come November 19, watching the small hoping things take on the cheese-eating surrender minkeys ... and I shall enjoy every last minute of it.  Who needs cable?

As for the cats, don't nail the door shut.  Makes it harder to get at them when you want to do a spot of dropkick practice...

so an easy solution is to get tickets to a game in wales when i live in brizzy?

enjoy the french game - i'm sure you will. i know it is not the old fabulous parc de prince but i remember seeing the wallabies beat the french there back in 93. i can categorically say that i have never enjoyed every aspect of attending a sporting event as much as that. and kudos to the french crowd - they were brilliant (it helped that the game was delayed about 4 hours and so 60,000 fans spent another 4 hours drinking in bars around the ground pre game). the number of people who came up and congratulated me as though i'd been on the field was extraordinary. so different to going to a game in wellington or orcland and being abused and spat on by locals.

[JohnS]

I can't believe that we can't get a Free-to-Air Television Station to broadcast this....(I'm) dumbfounded and speechless!

[David88]

This is quite shocking. While I'm all for professionalism in the sport, money is destroying rugby. They care more about getting paid large sums of money for exclusive tv rights than people actually watching the game. Australia wales is normally a very good test too.

If it's any help I would imagine that BBC wales will be showing the game and so it will be viewable online. 

[Ken Gargett]

3 minutes ago, David88 said:

This is quite shocking. While I'm all for professionalism in the sport, money is destroying rugby. They care more about getting paid large sums of money for exclusive tv rights than people actually watching the game. Australia wales is normally a very good test too.

If it's any help I would imagine that BBC wales will be showing the game and so it will be viewable online. 

we have certain restrictions on what can be limited to cable and what is available for free to air. a rugby international would be available for free to air. the decision would be that the free to air channel with the rights simply does not think it worth showing (at 2am or whatever, hard to believe it is up against a heap of shows that would out-rate it) or no free to air channel thought it worth taking up the rights. it would not have been a big bidding war. simply a decision by the stations. at least, that is my understanding.

what they now have is someone who has attended thousands of rugby games, stood on sidelines at everything from club games to tests, sat in pouring rain for more games than i can remember, followed reds and wallaby sides interstate and overseas - who now would rather watch the rugby league test than either bother trying to find it online or going the ten minutes to the family to watch it. i could not even be bothered to get them to video the game so i could come over next morning and watch it.

if they lose people like me, what the hell are they left with?

[David88]

1 minute ago, Ken Gargett said:

we have certain restrictions on what can be limited to cable and what is available for free to air. a rugby international would be available for free to air. the decision would be that the free to air channel with the rights simply does not think it worth showing (at 2am or whatever, hard to believe it is up against a heap of shows that would out-rate it) or no free to air channel thought it worth taking up the rights. it would not have been a big bidding war. simply a decision by the stations. at least, that is my understanding.

what they now have is someone who has attended thousands of rugby games, stood on sidelines at everything from club games to tests, sat in pouring rain for more games than i can remember, followed reds and wallaby sides interstate and overseas - who now would rather watch the rugby league test than either bother trying to find it online or going the ten minutes to the family to watch it. i could not even be bothered to get them to video the game so i could come over next morning and watch it.

if they lose people like me, what the hell are they left with?

Wow I assumed they had just been outbid for it. So they have the rights to show the game but would rather put Psychic Steve/The Shopping Channel or whatever it is that they show at 2am on instead?

Sadly the powers that be care so little for the rugby viewing public that they wouldn't change it if you asked them too. Perhaps the ARU have asked not to see the game after the showing in the June tests!?

[Ken Gargett]

i think that the powers that be have their collective heads so far up their sunless anatomies that they could hardly care. they do nothing to promote the game, everything to keep their own overpaid priveleded positions and care not one jot for the fans.

we are talking about the organisation who, according to one of our more respected sports journos who is sadly no longer with us, accidently left 5,000 tickets to the 2003 world cup final unsold in a drawer. sure, in the nose bleed section, but it sums up the way rugby is run. of course, rather than hold someone accountable, they did their utmost to cover for themselves.

greatest collection of village idiots outside parliament house.

[Pariah89]

I hate to say it, but with the pathetic performances the Wallabies have been putting in this year it's probably a good thing you won't be watching. Until they actually play well they don't deserve any interest from the public, other than calling for a coaching change... fire the clown!

 

[Ken Gargett]

it is not so much about performances. after we knocked off the kiwis and made the world cup final in 2003, and lost in extra time, they could not get a free to air deal up and running. this when interest in the sport was at an all time high. sadly, an all time high in australia still leaves rugby a minor sport. the diehard fans will follow the super comp - and if a side is winning then it will bring in extra fans (cooper put so many bums on seats in 2011 that the ARU should have given him a blank cheque). the wallabies are a bit of a social occasion now, a combo of genuine fans and those for whom it is an event they believe they should be seen at but don't really care. and even then, it is really only when we are playing a major nation - south africa, england or the kiwis. france, wales, ireland to a lesser extent - none of those will fill a stadium now. even the top teams struggle to fill the stadiums. it is now all a bit like today's melb cup - the nation becomes horse racing fans for a day and most couldn't give a toss for the other 364 days.

it is a wonder we have remained even vaguely relevant at rugby. it is a minor sport in two of our six states and a curiosity in the others. rugby is now so far behind league and aussie rules, it hardly matters. mate of mine was a high level administrator in aussie rules. if i'd mention rugby, he'd not be able to help himself. he would just burst out laughing. even in non-aussie rules states, they did not see it as a threat.

they say that every young kiwi lad (and as far as i can see, most of the girls) grow up wanting to be an all black. in australia, you'd be lucky if it was one in 200 young lads wanting to grow up and be a wallaby. i'd be amazed if even that was close.

a mate in nz often sends me articles in the nz press attacking the wallabies or often just australia. these articles are always angled as though all australia is up in arms about whatever subject (be it pertinent to the wallabies or the all blacks) is the focus of the article. the kiwis don't seem to understand that 99% of australia simply could not care less. sad but true.

i'd love to see a focus on rugby in the same way nz does. i was going to try and put together a combined league/rugby team to take on the all blacks but the truth is that, possibly aside from the front row being so specialised (though if our dills can learn it, can't be that hard), david pocock would be the only rugby player to make it (and izzy, but then he is a league player first). then imagine that the sporting youth in four states was directed to rugby instead of aussie rules. they could nail the bledisloe and bill to the wallaby trophy cabinet now. alas, it will never happen.

sorry for all that. was going to be half a para but i got wound up. bloody ARU.

[El Presidente]

Blah Blah Blah. 

You get the media you deserve. Netball has more players than Rugby, Oz rated No 1 in the world. Don't take it away from them. It demeans you. 

Brisbane roar pulls more fans to Suncorp than than the Reds. And the Roar are mediocre in 16. 

At the end of the day, Rugby is struggling. We all know it. We produce excellent players but they go to league or Japan or Europe. 

The only solution is to perform. Aussies generally won't support a 4th/5th/6th ranked side. If viewers won't watch.....don't blame a TV channel for not putting it on. It is only "product", and if a re-run of "coronation street" beats it....so be it. 

 

 

[Ken Gargett]

20 minutes ago, El Presidente said:

Blah Blah Blah. 

You get the media you deserve. Netball has more players than Rugby, Oz rated No 1 in the world. Don't take it away from them. It demeans you. 

Brisbane roar pulls more fans to Suncorp than than the Reds. And the Roar are mediocre in 16. 

At the end of the day, Rugby is struggling. We all know it. We produce excellent players but they go to league or Japan or Europe. 

The only solution is to perform. Aussies generally won't support a 4th/5th/6th ranked side. If viewers won't watch.....don't blame a TV channel for not putting it on. It is only "product", and if a re-run of "coronation street" beats it....so be it. 

 

 

i take it from your cheerful demeanor that you failed to pick any winners.

not sure that i am saying anything much different to you although at this stage of the evening on melbourne cup day, i'd be prepared to bet you didn't read the entire thread.

how on earth am i demeaning netball? or soccer?  how is anything i wrote taking anything from them? there is nothing in anything i wrote to suggest anything of the kind. i said that they are now televised. on what planet is that demeaning?

and then, while i am on this, where did i blame a tv station? i said exactly the same thing as you - in a much nicer way, of course. i blame rugby/the ARU. not the tv stations. instead of me having to explain this, you might have tried reading the thread!

but all that said, according the reds administration, they have far more people attend than the roar. never mind that to those of us at the ground, QRU crowd figures are the greatest piece of fantasy since tolkein.

one thing - i'm not that sure we are producing so many excellent players. certainly not the production line we had when we were young(er). take my old school. best two kids to come out in recent years would be sua and ponga. both went straight to league. in the old days, that would have been very unlikely but these days, they have been playing league throughout their young careers as well as rugby. so not so clear cut. it is not rugby producing them but a combination. as for rugby players going to league, it happens for numerous reasons - kids like those two and many more see it as a better game, the promise of state of origin etc, more opportunities and it is not the backwater that is rugby. a few stars go across for big money but there are not many and probably more the other way. or they simply can't make it in league - maranta?

anything else you wish to misquote?

[gweilgi]

9 hours ago, Ken Gargett said:

so an easy solution is to get tickets to a game in wales when i live in brizzy?

Why not?  It's only a hop skip and jump from Australia...

... and possibly a good opportunity to sample the best of English wines!

(Not to mention only a short wish train trip from there to Burgundy or Bordeaux).

 

9 hours ago, Ken Gargett said:

enjoy the french game - i'm sure you will. i know it is not the old fabulous parc de prince but i remember seeing the wallabies beat the french there back in 93. i can categorically say that i have never enjoyed every aspect of attending a sporting event as much as that. and kudos to the french crowd - they were brilliant (it helped that the game was delayed about 4 hours and so 60,000 fans spent another 4 hours drinking in bars around the ground pre game). the number of people who came up and congratulated me as though i'd been on the field was extraordinary. so different to going to a game in wellington or orcland and being abused and spat on by locals.

SWMBO is an avid Rugby fan (she attended the last four world cups in person!) and she categorically refuses to go back to New Zealand, so bad was the reception she got from AB fans and Kiwis in general.  On their home ground, they are quite insufferable and no credit to the sport at all.  A greater contrast to French or Irish fans at home is hard to imagine ...  

French fans' friendliness is one big reason why I look forward to the match so much.  Add a bottle or two of something decent, and a good cigar among new-found friends (or foes), and any Rugby match is a memory to treasure....

 

 

[JohnS]

A little reprieve...

SBS, a free-to-air Broadcaster in Australia, will show the game against France on November 20th and the 'big one' against England on December 4th, but I can help but feel that the ARU has again missed a trick by now showing the game against Ireland in-between on November 27th. Again, what are the ARU thinking? Ireland just beat the All Blacks for goodness sake!

I'm still miffed (to put it kindly) that I couldn't watch another thriller against Scotland last night, which the Wallabies won in the last 5 minutes 23-22 in front of a record crowd of 65395 at Murrayfield Stadium, Edinburgh. The Scots were up 10-0 in the 1st half, and 17-10 at halftime, and were in the lead for 75 of 80 minutes. Heartbreaking stuff! Did you catch the game our dear friend, @ayepatz? @Ken Gargett, were you able to get some highlights?

England beat South Africa 37-21 to make Eddie Jones coaching record 10-0. It's nothing personal against England, but yeah, I would like the constant smirk of Eddie Jones' face wiped off soon with a loss, just to balance things out and induce a smidgeon of humility!

[Ken Gargett]

4 hours ago, JohnS said:

A little reprieve...

SBS, a free-to-air Broadcaster in Australia, will show the game against France on November 20th and the 'big one' against England on December 4th, but I can help but feel that the ARU has again missed a trick by now showing the game against Ireland in-between on November 27th. Again, what are the ARU thinking? Ireland just beat the All Blacks for goodness sake!

I'm still miffed (to put it kindly) that I couldn't watch another thriller against Scotland last night, which the Wallabies won in the last 5 minutes 23-22 in front of a record crowd of 65395 at Murrayfield Stadium, Edinburgh. The Scots were up 10-0 in the 1st half, and 17-10 at halftime, and were in the lead for 75 of 80 minutes. Heartbreaking stuff! Did you catch the game our dear friend, @ayepatz? @Ken Gargett, were you able to get some highlights?

England beat South Africa 37-21 to make Eddie Jones coaching record 10-0. It's nothing personal against England, but yeah, I would like the constant smirk of Eddie Jones' face wiped off soon with a loss, just to balance things out and induce a smidgeon of humility!

john, if the season he inflicted on the reds is any indication, there is not the slightest possibility of a shred of humility. none.

the english experiment with the toxic hobbit as coach is going exactly to prediction. all smiles, and joy and wins in the early days before the insanity emerges and it all turns to custard.

saw a couple of the tries but didn't bother to watch. poor scots have been unlucky. that dodgy win to us last year and now to lose by a point after a kick hits the post (agonising memories of the 03 world cup). sounded a better game than we have played for a while but, with the greatest respect, it was only scotland.

[ayepatz]

43 minutes ago, Ken Gargett said:

... but, with the greatest respect, it was only scotland.

I am bathing in the warmth of your respect, Ken. ?

Seriously though, it's a fair point. There has always been a huge gap between the Scots and the Southern Hemisphere teams, so I'm sure you can all appreciate how doubly frustrating it is for us to come so close and lose. Twice! ☹️

[Ken Gargett]

2 hours ago, ayepatz said:

I am bathing in the warmth of your respect, Ken. ?

Seriously though, it's a fair point. There has always been a huge gap between the Scots and the Southern Hemisphere teams, so I'm sure you can all appreciate how doubly frustrating it is for us to come so close and lose. Twice! ☹️

indeed. i can remember scotland touring around 1982, i think.

they went close to beating qld, back in the days when we believed, quite rightly, we could beat anyone (including the all blacks, which we did). they were 6-0 up (tries four in those days) with about 15-20 minutes to go. we'd played crap (you could feel the embarrassment - this was just scotland, though i think you'd either just won the 5 nations or gone close). i remember the ball going to that greatest number 8 of all time, mark loane. i will swear till i die that he set off for the far side of the field and then thought, bugger it. had enough of this. where are those scots? turned and ran back into the scottish pack at full tilt, as he did in those days. left the lot of them on the ground. went through and scored. qld (long before we were called the reds as the jerseys were actually maroon - same colour as state of origin these days) finally clicked.

now if i recall, the wallaby side had 14 qlders and 1 from nsw (hawker on the wing - unless memory has blurred this - possibly also the ella brothers at 5/8 and fullback). needless to say, we were outraged. saw it as nothing but a token selection so nsw were not completely embarrassed. and if i recall, we got beaten? at ballymore. the following week, gould and mclean returned to the wallabies and we had a record victory. nsw was stuffing us up even then.

but i remember players like andy irvine, renwick?, leslie, gregor townsend and others.

[gweilgi]

8 hours ago, Ken Gargett said:

john, if the season he inflicted on the reds is any indication, there is not the slightest possibility of a shred of humility. none.

the english experiment with the toxic hobbit as coach is going exactly to prediction. all smiles, and joy and wins in the early days before the insanity emerges and it all turns to custard.

With respect, 11 wins in a row is a bit more than a fluke.  

As for the last match, admittedly the SAFAs are in transition right now (and suffering from a coach imposed on them for race-political reasons, I suspect), but even so, they were well outclassed.  

Ah well, we shall see next month in Twickenham how well they will do against Cheika's lot...

 

8 hours ago, Ken Gargett said:

saw a couple of the tries but didn't bother to watch. poor scots have been unlucky. that dodgy win to us last year and now to lose by a point after a kick hits the post (agonising memories of the 03 world cup). sounded a better game than we have played for a while but, with the greatest respect, it was only scotland.

With the greatest respect, that was what the Springboks said before they met Japan.  And I suspect that's what the ABs said before they played Ireland the other day...

[Ken Gargett]

3 minutes ago, gweilgi said:

With respect, 11 wins in a row is a bit more than a fluke.  

As for the last match, admittedly the SAFAs are in transition right now (and suffering from a coach imposed on them for race-political reasons, I suspect), but even so, they were well outclassed.  

Ah well, we shall see next month in Twickenham how well they will do against Cheika's lot...

 

With the greatest respect, that was what the Springboks said before they met Japan.  And I suspect that's what the ABs said before they played Ireland the other day...

never ever said that these wins by the poms are flukes. (10?). in fact, i've made plenty of comments to the complete contrary. i think i even predicted the poms winning the 6 nations last year. my point is definitely that the early wins are not flukes. eddie has a long history of very strong early results - almost everywhere he has been (except the reds but the less said about that train wreck the better), he has done exceptionally well in the first year, or two or three. but everywhere he has been has seen it all end in tears when crazy eddie can no longer be held in check and takes over from early eddie.

i'll go on record to say i'll be stunned if we beat england. i expect them to comprehensively outplay us. by the time of the next world cup (well, they will probably still be able to thump us), it will be interesting to see if all is roses in the england camp, and not just on the jersey. i fully expect some assistant coaches, administrators, players to have been quoted that it is not all rainbows and hymns.

re, 'its only scotland', was partly tongue-in-cheek, as they certainly deserved to beat us in the cup. that said, as a gross generalisation, when you tour the UK and france, the first game you'd expect to win would usually be scotland.

[gweilgi]

8 minutes ago, Ken Gargett said:

never ever said that these wins by the poms are flukes. (10?). in fact, i've made plenty of comments to the complete contrary. i think i even predicted the poms winning the 6 nations last year. my point is definitely that the early wins are not flukes. eddie has a long history of very strong early results - almost everywhere he has been (except the reds but the less said about that train wreck the better), he has done exceptionally well in the first year, or two or three. but everywhere he has been has seen it all end in tears when crazy eddie can no longer be held in check and takes over from early eddie.

As long as Crazy Eddie doesn't take over until after the next RWC in Japan, I'm not worried....

The other alternative might be to replace him in 2018, having revitalised and reformed the squad, and replace him with a pair of safe hands.  Which gets me to thinking ... how long until Cheika's contract runs out?  

8 minutes ago, Ken Gargett said:

i'll go on record to say i'll be stunned if we beat england. i expect them to comprehensively outplay us. by the time of the next world cup (well, they will probably still be able to thump us), it will be interesting to see if all is roses in the england camp, and not just on the jersey. i fully expect some assistant coaches, administrators, players to have been quoted that it is not all rainbows and hymns.

Yes, that is the big question.  English sport has a long and sad tradition of snatching abject defeat from the jaws of victory.  Whether it is soccer, Rugby, Cricket or other sports, we will often have early successes that then ramp up expectations (expertly fuelled by our press) which we then promptly turn into a vale of tears ..

 

8 minutes ago, Ken Gargett said:

re, 'its only scotland', was partly tongue-in-cheek, as they certainly deserved to beat us in the cup. that said, as a gross generalisation, when you tour the UK and france, the first game you'd expect to win would usually be scotland.

The first win would be Scotland?  And what is Wales, chopped liver?  

[ayepatz]

52 minutes ago, Ken Gargett said:

re, 'its only scotland', was partly tongue-in-cheek, as they certainly deserved to beat us in the cup. that said, as a gross generalisation, when you tour the UK and france, the first game you'd expect to win would usually be scotland.

Lol. Don't worry, no offence taken. ?

You can't spend years and years watching your team lose to all and sundry, then take offence when others don't see you as much of a threat. 

The big frustration is the frequent sign of improvement, which often flatters to deceive. We're now pushing 3 decades since our last Grand Slam.

It wears you down.

[Ken Gargett]

2 hours ago, gweilgi said:

As long as Crazy Eddie doesn't take over until after the next RWC in Japan, I'm not worried....

The other alternative might be to replace him in 2018, having revitalised and reformed the squad, and replace him with a pair of safe hands.  Which gets me to thinking ... how long until Cheika's contract runs out?  

Yes, that is the big question.  English sport has a long and sad tradition of snatching abject defeat from the jaws of victory.  Whether it is soccer, Rugby, Cricket or other sports, we will often have early successes that then ramp up expectations (expertly fuelled by our press) which we then promptly turn into a vale of tears ..

 

The first win would be Scotland?  And what is Wales, chopped liver?  

not at all. wales is normally a reasonable side. no idea of the actual record but i'd bet that in head to head contests between wales and scotland, wales would be well ahead.

[gweilgi]

2 hours ago, Ken Gargett said:

not at all. wales is normally a reasonable side. no idea of the actual record but i'd bet that in head to head contests between wales and scotland, wales would be well ahead.

Wales has played Australia 40 times to date.  The Wallabies have won 29 matches, Wales won 20, and there was 1 draw.

Scotland and Australia have met 30 times so far, with 21 wins to Australia and 9 to Scotland.  

The ratio of points scored would suggest that Wales do slightly better than Scotland when either meet the Wallabies.