Aged tobacco in ELs & Maduro5s etc

[frenchkiwi]

Ok, so you get these E.L.s, special edition cigars of various types (gran reservas etc.), and the Cohiba maduro 5 series - they all have a guaranteed minimum ageing e.g. for maduro5s 5 years for the wrapper and a few for the filler.

Bearing in mind that the rest of the habanos have tobacco in them of varied ages (apparently the average age has increased since stock has risen in recent years)...

... have you found the ELs et al more likely, on average, to smoke better when young than general Habanos stock?

Just another un-scientific polling exercise. So comments will help just as much as votes.

[MrGlass]

For me, from the handful of EL's I've smoked, they did seem to do better young than the general Habanos stock. But I haven't smoked all that many EL's and the likes - maybe somewhere along the lines of 5-10 in total.

[gigabyte056]

I am not a fan of EL at all, the first release is usually good and then all goes down hill from there.

Exceptions to that were to me at least the Mag 48 which was very good of the truck and not too overpriced.

Again I had only about 25-30 EL stick to date and have two boxes of the Mag 48 to age, I am more of a collector then a chimney .

The Maduro 5 are usually good OTT but will benefit from 2 years.

[Ghabanos]

Really depends I think. Haven't smoked them alot but the maduro Genios

was great out of the box but the secretos was rather disappointing. My opinion only. No experience with ELs yet... 2011 may be the year to try...

[Puros Y Vino]

I agree with Ghabanos. The Genios are great out of the box. The Secretos I found to be bland. I opened the box up abotu a week ago to check on them and they seemed "sick" as I was getting a bit of ammonia off them. Maybe another in another six months I'll light one up to see if they've improved.

[Charltonc]

If I am going to smoke maduros I am going to smoke non cubans such as anejo 46 and Padron 26, 64. I do not think they even compare. I think the Cohiba Maduros were decent, but not in the same ballpark as Padron and Fuente. I have only smoked five or six limited editions and I was not impressed.

[PigFish]

The EL is just another cigar. A fancy box and a second band makes them no better or no worse than any other cigar!

What makes them worse is that they are untested. They have no history, so you are guessing as to whether you will like them or not. They are costly... so they replace more that a stick for stick in you standard Habanos budget. They carry a higher risk/reward ratio. They are production problem cigars... but I an not going to go into that here.

As an odds player, while skirting the topic here, they are a waste of good smoking money. Lastly and more on topic, empirically, I see no difference from an age perspective. What I do see however is that they are markedly subpar when stacked up against a known cigar of limited production and of a preferred ring size.

If you know what you like, and you like fat untested cigars, EL's may be your thing. I like none of the aforementioned!

-Piggy

[dB69]

I've smoked only a handful of one year or less aged ELs (more with some age though). I have not noticed any difference between them and regular production cigars. I have also tasted only one young Cohiba Maduro5 Magico and Secreto. Magico was excellent and Secreto was crap.

To the question I would say: I think there's no difference - voted for "definitely not".

This is my very minor experience about those cigars, so the answer is not very helpful, but it's still an answer/opinion. It is also possible that my opinion may change with time - can't be sure about that..

[thechenman]

My personal opinion is that the use of aged tobacco leaves in Cuban cigars does not make them any more ready to smoke than their regular production smokes. Let me also add that when it comes to Maduro leaf, the Cubans lag far behind the NC cigar companies. The NCs generally do a far superior job with the maduro leaf, especially Padron, Fuente and a host of other cigar manufacturers.

Addressing the first...I would have to say it is becasue while aged tobacco may be better on its own, when rolled into a cigar and combined with another leaf, the oils in the different leaves most likely have not had sufficient time to blend with each other. This could lead to a cigar not being fully balanced or not living up to its true potential. I think that is the same with NCs as well, and many of the NC manufactuers use aged tobacco in their cigars.

As to the latter point...I really have no idea, other than to attribute it to experience with the leaf as Cuba makes a fairly small number of maduro cigars.

[kevinfj]

I agree with Piggy. Perhaps it is my palate that is lacking but it seems to me that the EL's (and RE's) are a confusing bunch when it comes to flavor and construction.

But bravo Piggy for bringing an economical approach to the table. A "Habano's Budget"....well done.

Stay away from the hype....smoke the regular production stuff.

FJ

[Michel1968]

I would have to say it is becasue while aged tobacco may be better on its own, when rolled into a cigar and combined with another leaf, the oils in the different leaves most likely have not had sufficient time to blend with each other. This could lead to a cigar not being fully balanced or not living up to its true potential.

Was waiting for this comment... Thanks!

[Tarks]

My personal opinion is that the use of aged tobacco leaves in Cuban cigars does not make them any more ready to smoke than their regular production smokes. Let me also add that when it comes to Maduro leaf, the Cubans lag far behind the NC cigar companies. The NCs generally do a far superior job with the maduro leaf, especially Padron, Fuente and a host of other cigar manufacturers.

Addressing the first...I would have to say it is becasue while aged tobacco may be better on its own, when rolled into a cigar and combined with another leaf, the oils in the different leaves most likely have not had sufficient time to blend with each other. This could lead to a cigar not being fully balanced or not living up to its true potential. I think that is the same with NCs as well, and many of the NC manufactuers use aged tobacco in their cigars.

As to the latter point...I really have no idea, other than to attribute it to experience with the leaf as Cuba makes a fairly small number of maduro cigars.

Bingo! There is a big difference between aged tobacco and aged cigars. The tobacco in a cigar must marry and this takes time. I will get excited when HSA releases "aged cigars" that contain premium leaf and not the gimmicky "aged tobacco" LE's.

[Wil]

The EL is just another cigar. A fancy box and a second band makes them no better or no worse than any other cigar!

What makes them worse is that they are untested. They have no history, so you are guessing as to whether you will like them or not. They are costly... so they replace more that a stick for stick in you standard Habanos budget. They carry a higher risk/reward ratio. They are production problem cigars... but I an not going to go into that here.

As an odds player, while skirting the topic here, they are a waste of good smoking money. Lastly and more on topic, empirically, I see no difference from an age perspective. What I do see however is that they are markedly subpar when stacked up against a known cigar of limited production and of a preferred ring size.

If you know what you like, and you like fat untested cigars, EL's may be your thing. I like none of the aforementioned!

-Piggy

It's fun to try new things, so I don't mind the odd EL. Of course, they won't replace my staples.

And speaking of odds, how many of us actually profit from gambling, let alone break even, over the long term? Very few I'd suggest. But sometimes it pays off, which is why most of us just do it for a bit of fun rather than income. For me ELs are the same, a bit of fun on the side.

[PigFish]

It's fun to try new things, so I don't mind the odd EL. Of course, they won't replace my staples.

And speaking of odds, how many of us actually profit from gambling, let alone break even, over the long term? Very few I'd suggest. But sometimes it pays off, which is why most of us just do it for a bit of fun rather than income. For me ELs are the same, a bit of fun on the side.

You make a valid point. There is enough variation in the Habanos in general to keep my interest. I believe that size and production numbers as a function of time have a role in the quality of the finished product and that, while not insurance, increases my odds of getting a good smoking experience. I am pretty much, while not completely out of the experimental phase of smoking cigars. Every cigar is an experiment when you view them as individuals, like I do. Experiments with untested cigars, typically mean a letdown for me. I am interested in a good or great experience and therefore find the letdowns perhaps more traumatic than others. Experimenting with an expensive cigar for example, like I just did with a BHK 52, just to be let down, I find enraging. I mean.... it really pisses me off!

When I gamble I like craps. I know the odds and I can make backed bets that are even money. I ride my Harley, but wear a helmet. Perhaps it is just me, but I don't like to gamble anymore with my smoking experiences. Variance is fine and acceptable. A disappointment, while inevitable is not!

Some focus on trying new things. I focus on an exceptional experience every time I smoke. It is a matter of focus. My goal is not to say I have smoked every cigar. My goal is to say that for my taste, I have smoked more exceptional cigars than average or below average cigars. EL's and RE's just **** up the statistical results.

-Piggy

[frenchkiwi]

I would have to say it is becasue while aged tobacco may be better on its own, when rolled into a cigar and combined with another leaf, the oils in the different leaves most likely have not had sufficient time to blend with each other. This could lead to a cigar not being fully balanced or not living up to its true potential.

yes spot on, this is one of the reasons i put this poll up. there is no question that the blending of separately aged tobaccos will take time to operate.

however despite the fact that we know this about E.L.s et al., they have - at times - seemed to me like they smoke better at a young age relative to other cigars. [this certainly doesn't mean that they have reached their full potential]. so the aged tobacco could be pulling through but i'm wondering what The Tribe thinks.

of course this depends on the blends (e.g. celestiales finos - don't know if they were ready to smoke early but it could be that this was intentional!) etc. i imagine that a lot of E.Ls are designed with a "ready-to-smoke" aim in mind - hence why a lot of them seem to be easy-going blends with a standardised sweet cocoa flavour profile and only a passing resemblance to their respective marcas. easier to achieve this easy-going profile with aged tobacco maybe?

[frenchkiwi]

Bingo! There is a big difference between aged tobacco and aged cigars. The tobacco in a cigar must marry and this takes time. I will get excited when HSA releases "aged cigars" that contain premium leaf and not the gimmicky "aged tobacco" LE's.

there is always PCC vintage program, and all these London topshops if you have a very good credit rating and no wife lol

[bassman]

Lost interest in ELs after finding they taste more like each other than anything else. That being said, the older ones I liked were fine on release & then sometimes faded.

Only smoked a couple Cohiba maduros. They didn't taste like Cohiba, so I moved on.