Bolivar Royal Corona TEB Jul 07 V Ramon Allones Specially Selected TEB July 07

[El Presidente]

Bolivar Royal Corona TEB Jul 07 V Ramon Allones Specially Selected TEB July 07

I have been on the lookout of late for two boxes of same vitola, differing Marque, but with same box code. Minismithy (Simon) came up to me a few months back with some freshly received boxes which met the criteria in Bolivar Royal Coronas and and Ramon Allones Specially Selected both of TEB July 07. I have rested them for 90 days in identical conditions (63 RH / 18 Degrees Celsius).

There is a line of thought out there (which I do not agree with) that all (say) Robusto's from a given production are blended the same and that only the band differs. I really wanted to put that theory to the test.

For the purposes of this test I took out four cigars. Two of which I dissected to investigate the blend. Two of which I smoked. I made certain that all four cigars weighed the same and were constructed of equal density.

The Combatants

The listed Habanos s.a weight for a "Robusto" is 11.66 grams. All four cigars in the test weighed in at 12 grams (keep in mind there is a .5 gram error in the equipment we used).

I broke up the various components of each cigar to see what I would find.

From the disassembly of the cigars I found each to be roughly uniform in their proportions (Wrapper/Seco/Volado/Ligero). The minor variations had as much to do with the equipment used but suffice to say they were broadly equivalent (within .5 grams). What is more difficult to show is the aroma of the two different Ligero's used. The BRC Ligero was far less spicy in terms of aroma than the RASS. The Seco also had some slight differences (nowhere near as much as the Ligero) but again it was milder in the BRC than the RASS. The Volado and the Wrapper were roughly consistent in terms of aroma. The Rass wrapper was a tad oilier. Both were not works of art but standard good wrappers. Elasticity of wrappers was much the same.

First tasting was the Bolivar Royal Corona

Aroma at cold was tea and tobacco.

Constuction firm but decent "give". Wrapper rather matt and nondescript. Not bad, not great.....standard.

Clipped the cap and the draw is perfect. Light flavour of tobacco to the lips and tongue

Fired up the foot....lovely spicy cream opening. Some elements of charcoal intermingled. Medium bodied. No overt spice throgh the nose. Smoke is plentifull and thick.

Lovely mineral taste to this cigar. Part leather, part cream but grimy...a little oily which in the years to come will turn to greater leather. No aspect of ammonia, no youth at all. Slight reluctance to open up...understandable.

The second third of this cigar is its strength. Some nutmeg makes the creaminess come alive. Still working well with the leather earthiness. This is Bolivar! Still medium bodied, the smoke is thick/viscous with a lovely aroma of a campfire using slightly damp moss / tinder to get it started.

The final third is fuller than the first 2/3rds. It brings into play some dark roast coffee beans but overall loses some nuance and complexity. This is a cigar which needs another two years (no more than that). It is well blended and executed.

Overall right now an 88 (4/6 Smokerings) with a 90 beckoning,

Ramon Allones Specially Selected

Aroma at cold was sweet spiced tobacco. Construction appears perfect with the wrapper having a little more oil than the BRC. Feel in hand is solid but foot nice and open.

Clipped the cap and took a test draw. Perfect. Flavour on lips and tongue only light tobacco.

Fired up the foot....into stride immediately. Spicy cream opening which evolves quickly diring its first third toward Christnas Mince tarts (currants, Nutmeg, cinnamon, raisins).....in effect stewed fruits. Bloody gorgeous!!!! Medium bodied. The spice through the nose far more predominant than the BRC. Smoke equally thick, aroma of the smoke woody "Old Spice" aftershave.

Midsection of this cigar becomes even sweeter than the first (for the first section of the second section). I am in heaven. Complexity, balance. Unfortunately it does not continue. I purged the cigar, reclipped but by he end of the second third it was a seriously good cigar wthout being great. Nice dark malevolence but once you experience the sweet fruits of Ramon Allones ......you want it back! Medium full now. Again some darker charcoal elements emerging....more Stout beer than Mince pies.

The final third is solid. Very good if not exceptional. How I wish I had boxes and boxes of these for my private stock. Give it 2-3 years and I wouldn't smoke anything else. Medium full now. Some bitter coffee showing trough but still with gimpses of the prior spicy cream and fruit.

90/100 now (5/6 smokerings). A classic down the track.

For those that say all cigars are blended the same.......pull your head in

While the proportions of these cigars may be similar (Wrapper/biner/ligero/volado/Seco) the sources (plantations/fincas) of the Ligero/Seco are different. "Viva la Difference!"

[Don Candido]

That is a great review. I have heard of instances where multiple smokes were in fact rolled from the same tobacco. I actually was somewhat riveted while reading it. I couldn't imagine this was true on any wide level. I am glad to hear the results.

BTW, in the US, instead of saying "Pull your head in," we say "Pull your head OUT (of your ass)". Exact Opposite. That may make sense though. If I am not mistaken, when you flush a toilet down under, the water spins the opposite way. There may be a connection.

[shrink]

Rob, thank you for doing this side-by-side comparison. Interestingly, the two cigars do look the same. I have also heard it expressed (occasionally by veteran habanophiles) that the only difference between identical vitolas of various marcas is the band. Like you, that assertion is completely at odds with my experience. I'm not saying that it never happens, Cuba being Cuba. I'm just saying that the profile differences between the major brands are quite distinctive and recognizable, at least for me.

I certainly agree that the 2007 RASS, like the other 2007 RA's, are exceptionally rich and flavorful, with that unique "stewed fruit" or "mince pie" spice that makes Ramon Allones such an exceptionally good cigar to age. I can enjoy a "young" RASS, within the first six months or so of boxdate, but much after that they lose their appeal until they are at least a few years old. I have some 2004's that are just getting into the "zone", but there is no doubt in my mind that the 2006 and 2007 vintages will handily surpass them in time. I would vote the RASS "best robusto of 2007".

This kind of "research" really appeals to my intellectual curiosity. For a lot of people, cigars are purely a sensory experience. You smoke 'em, and you either like 'em or you don't. But for me, the hobby is a much more "holistic" endeavor. I find that it enriches every aspect of life: not only the sensory, but the social, intellectual, economic, and adventurous aspects as well. Keep up the good, and interesting work.

[anacostiakat]

Rob, thank you for doing this side-by-side comparison. Interestingly, the two cigars do look the same. I have also heard it expressed (occasionally by veteran habanophiles) that the only difference between identical vitolas of various marcas is the band. Like you, that assertion is completely at odds with my experience. I'm not saying that it never happens, Cuba being Cuba. I'm just saying that the profile differences between the major brands are quite distinctive and recognizable, at least for me.

I certainly agree that the 2007 RASS, like the other 2007 RA's, are exceptionally rich and flavorful, with that unique "stewed fruit" or "mince pie" spice that makes Ramon Allones such an exceptionally good cigar to age. I can enjoy a "young" RASS, within the first six months or so of boxdate, but much after that they lose their appeal until they are at least a few years old. I have some 2004's that are just getting into the "zone", but there is no doubt in my mind that the 2006 and 2007 vintages will handily surpass them in time. I would vote the RASS "best robusto of 2007".

This kind of "research" really appeals to my intellectual curiosity. For a lot of people, cigars are purely a sensory experience. You smoke 'em, and you either like 'em or you don't. But for me, the hobby is a much more "holistic" endeavor. I find that it enriches every aspect of life: not only the sensory, but the social, intellectual, economic, and adventurous aspects as well. Keep up the good, and interesting work.

Thanks Rob. I too have heard this fallacy. I never believed it.

This is too funny as I smoked one of my RASS with the exact same box codes at the beginning of the Skins/Seahawk game. I have smoked maybe a third or less of the box so far.

I would say it was a good half of a cigar. It went kind of blah at about the half way mark and really didnt revive itself. Although I did finish it. The previous ones from the box were more flavorful.

These are buy and hold. Minimum of 3 years IMHO.

I also have the BRC with the same box codes. The last one of those I sampled was more approachable. I think they will do well with a couple years under their belt as well.

[bolivr]

What shrink said... plus my thanks for the research on putting this misconception to rest

[mkz]

Superb double review!!

Had most my interest on the RASS and I´m glad you felt the same piece of "heaven" as I did.

[Colt45]

Great stuff - bravo!

[aavkk]

I dont understand how everyone sees these as value smokes. Every time I smoke a RASS or RASCC or RA Beli they cost me an average of $125 cause I buy another box before I'm done.

[bassman]

Very interesting read. My less thoroughly researched opinion is my 06 RASS are fantastic spicy cigars, while the 06 BRC is in the good but not great catagory. Much rather have a BCE.

[Evo03]

I've got boxes of RASS and BRC in that same box code. I'll wait a year, and see how they compare.

But so far, the RASS have been more enjoyable. With the "stewed fruit" flavor prominent in the first half.

[Tampa1257]

I believe that most if not all of us have heard the claim by some so called "Experts", that the only difference between vitolas was the different band. Thanks Rob for your experiment and continued support of the greater good for the Habanos Cigar Community.

[strayvector]

Great stuff, Rob. Not that I needed any reassurance, but thanks for the experiment.

[tacmedic]

I've got part of a box of RASS with same box code.....they have been outstanding, I would love to have a humi full of them...

[greenpimp]

Fascinating, Rob, thank you. Extremely interesting about the ligero aroma differences.

I also think 2007 was a great year for the robusto period.

[trumpetchris]

Ah, Science! Great work- great experiment. You would win the science fair for sure!

[lusitanias]

great hard job, Rob!

why don't you try to compare the RASS with the D4 or the Cohi Rob?

[Spartan]

...why don't you try to compare the RASS with the D4 or the Cohi Rob?

Yup, I'd love to see how the RASS compares with the Cohiba Robusto.

Outstanding review Prez!

[El Presidente]

Yup, I'd love to see how the RASS compares with the Cohiba Robusto.

I am happy to do a series of these reviews but it is not as common as you think to find the same vitola with the same box code across different Marques.

I will continue to do one a week where I can.

[Mr. Japan]

Rob this is very interesting and I would like to ask you to make another review, lets say in a month time, but blind. (Just ask Lisa to take off the anilla) or if too busy send to me the two cigars

This remembers me when few years ago I was in a Havana factory seeing packing Selection Piramide

[El Presidente]

Rob this is very interesting and I would like to ask you to make another review, lets say in a month time, but blind. (Just ask Lisa to take off the anilla) or if too busy send to me the two cigars

This remembers me when few years ago I was in a Havana factory seeing packing Selection Piramide

Shall do Gino. I am ok at picking fresh tobacco differences. It is not often I get thrown by say Fresh HDM E2/CORO/RASS/ etc. I play this game regulalry of taking off the bands.

However the more aged a cigar is the greater my error rate particularly in Robusto/Hermoso and Corona Gorda.

[HawaiiBill]

Wow very cool review AND dissection of cigars Rob! Nicely done!

I too have heard the notion that the BRC & RASS are the same blend, but NEVER could understand WHY people thought that? The flavor difference between Bolivar and RA is VERY distinct..at least IMHO. In fact, over the years I have known many a Boli fan who does not care for the flavors of a RASS.

Oh well now we have scientific proof mrcoin was right he said "trolls dont know their RASS from a hole in the ground".......lol

[Ginseng]

Wonderful comparative review, Rob. A most excellent study and well controlled aside from a blind smoke. Wonderful in every other way though.

Oh, and Chuck, I have followed some of the claims almost to the originator and I'm not sure that "expert" really applies with respect to these reports. The one notable case I investigated placed someone from the non-Cuban cigar industry at a production facility in an outlying province. That individual merely noted what they saw. Beyond this, it is the people who took this report, expanded it, and propagated it that gave it a life of its own.

On another point, I'm really a bit dismayed at the casual "air quoting" of the term expert as a pejorative. There are very few people who blatantly abuse what that term means. Usually when we see the term applied, it is not by the person it refers to but is meant as a slur. Those who love this avocation in all its diverse incarnations work toward expertise in one way or another whether experiential or through study. I'm not aware of any of my learned colleagues, Rob included, ever referring to themselves as an expert. Knowledgeable, possessed of a hard earned understanding, able to perceive patterns and nuance, yes. Expert, no. There is room for all approaches to the cigar. We need not demean one to elevate another.

Sorry if that came across as a bit heavy. But I guess this is something that's been on my mind, in general, for some time.

Wilkey

[kmax]

Well done as usuall Prez, and thanks!

[Colt45]

Sorry if that came across as a bit heavy. But I guess this is something that's been on my mind, in general, for some time.

Wilkey

Wilkey, I think the same could be said for any avocation or occupation - any time I hear a self proclaimed "expert" in any field pontificate, I tend to take what they have to say with a grain of salt.

Certainly knowledge is power, but with regards to cigars in general and Havanas specifically, isn't it all about flavor, comraderie, introspection -- friendship, laughter, loyalty, fraternity?

I try not to let the esoteric spoil what should be a good time.

[Lanthor]

I have never heard this claim, but have the RASS code and BRC code that is only two months off, you could never convince me these two are the same cigar, taste completely different to me (I do enjoy the RASS more).