At What Point Do You Say ENOUGH

[DocRKS]

I received an email from a friend this morning asking me if I wanted to go in on a split of the new Upmann Mag 50 ELs....... Now, as I love the Mag 46s, I was very excited to hear these were now available ....

Actually - I was more excited till I was informed of the asking price for these ----aprox $600 (Six Hundred USD) !!! You know -there will come a point where people are going to look at these kind of asking prices and just stop buying - I think this is just silly pricing for just another box of ELs and I turned down the opportunity to go in splits on this.

I wonder if the folks back in Habanos SA Marketing Dept will sit around the table and wonder --"What happened?" when people start leaving their product on the shelves.... Contrary to the theme of the movie "Wall Street"..... Greed is Not Good....

[shrink]

Well, $600 is more than enough for me. This is sad. If the price had been more in line with prior offerings, I would have gone for it. In this case, no thanks.

Given the popularity of the PSD4R, I have little doubt that they will sell these. Remember, they only have to sell one-half as many to make up the profit they would have realized from the earlier price. Any unsold inventory can be aged and released later for even greater profits.

That's suppy and demand, folks. :-(

[CIGARHead]

>>Greed is Not Good....

Im with ya Doc. Seems they know how crazy people go for EL's and just throw a big price out there because they know someone will shell out the cake. There will become a point where people will come to their senses and stop buying. Its a shame too; I was really interested in getting the Mag 50's, but at that price they better sprout arms and give me a message......with a happy ending:-D

[hagzo]

I bought a box of Monte#2 at havanna airport last year, got them home and found them to be either underfilled or so plugged i gave up trying to get a draw - there shite

Personally i think habanos should sort their act out on the 'bog standard' cigars before asking people to buy ELs and other special editions.

Mckeith

[1f1fan]

$600 is WAY too much.

I think this price is inflated by the vendor due to the fact this EL has not been widely distributed yet. Not a good practice....just wait a while and the price will come down. Or it could just be the market your friend is getting them from (high taxes, currency exchange, etc)

When Sublimes were first released I saw them around $750-$800 + a box...now more in the $600 range. Still too much for me, as I am not a big EL fan, especially at that price.

[Colt45]

Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on which side of the fence you're on), there

will always be those with the means who will buy them no matter how inflated the price.

[jwrussell]

They already hit the "enough" point for me. I just don't have the available cash to drop on these kinds of smokes. A box of regular production Churchills at $300+ stretches me past the limit so...

But even if I had the money...the prices on these are a joke.

To whoever posted the massage, happy ending deal...screw that...it better grow a mouth, if ya know what I'm saying.;-)

[DocRKS]

» Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on which side of the fence you're

» on), there

» will always be those with the means who will buy them no matter how

» inflated the price.

But that's my point - this is NOT a matter of means to me at all...it is an issue where some powers that be have determined that we will pay aprox. $600 for these new release '05 ELs ---- so what about the next release of ELs - maybe a PC size (hey, there has never been one of those - that makes it RARE - let's sell those at $699.99) Where does the stupidity stop and common sense kick in a bit. A box of Mag 46s can be had with a little careful looking for about 1/3 of the cost of these Mag 50s!!! Does that make any sense ?! 3 boxes of Mag 46s for 1 of the Mag 50?

I am afraid that if the consumers don't draw a line in the sand here and say ENOUGH - then those referenced powers that be will just keep raising the already absurd prices on these kinds of cigars.

Is this just not greedy Marketing and gouging of the customer base.... We're not talking DCs here - look at the size (contents) on these sticks - for that price !!!! I am not writing this from Denmark - but something sure seems rotten here......

[Colt45]

Doc, I understood your point, but as long as there are those out there - and they're out there - who will pay inflated prices, the prices will keep going up. It's the same with all kinds of products.

Habanos s.a. wanted to make Cuban cigars a "luxury" item, with prices to match, and

they may just get their wish.

[hagzo]

Is there any connection between Altadis buying into Habanos and the massive hike in prices?

[dragon]

<<< Actually - I was more excited till I was informed of the asking price for these ----aprox $600 (Six Hundred USD) !!! >>>

That must be a mistake, or maybe just the sky high UK pricing. I was figuring them to probably be in the $250.00 - $280.00 range, and the new Monte EL's in the $135.00 - $165.00 range.

[DocRKS]

» <<< Actually - I was more excited till I was informed of the asking price

» for these ----aprox $600 (Six Hundred USD) !!! >>>

»

» That must be a mistake, or maybe just the sky high UK pricing. I was

» figuring them to probably be in the $250.00 - $280.00 range, and the new

» Monte EL's in the $135.00 - $165.00 range.

No Mistake ---- and this is not from a UK vendor.

[dragon]

<<< No Mistake ---- and this is not from a UK vendor. >>>

That makes absolutely no sense to price the new Upmann EL's at nearly the level as the Cohiba Sublimes.....and you don't even get a fancy varnished box

At $600.00 a box, I couldn't imagine anyone but the most diehard collectors buying them. That must be just pre-release hype and gouge pricing.

[1f1fan]

» That must be just pre-release hype and gouge pricing.

Exactly.....

[Tampa1257]

I have said this before and I'll say it yet again. IMHO, ELs are a total waste of time, effort and money. They do not provide nearly the clarity, and deffination of complexity that Regular Production Habanos provide. ELs are a Fad, They were designed to fleese your wallet and make you think you are smoking a luxury product, when you are only smoking a muted, doesn't even come close to tasteing near the Marca that the vitola is representing, and Habanos SA as well as others are laughing their ass' off all the way to the Bank. The last box of ELs that I bought was a box of PSD3s that I smoked through fairly quick, but I'll smoke regular production Habanos daily and love them, Screw ELs, and for $600 a box, Hades must be near having the Winter Olympics because Hell froze over!

[tubaman]

Wow, 600 for these, I was thinking these would be in the 350-400 range! I love Upmann's, but that's just too steep for me.

[jwrussell]

» No Mistake ---- and this is not from a UK vendor.

Well, that's a little weird. I just got notification from another vendor and it was under $500 for Mag 50's (Still too high to me) and under $160 for the Monte Ds.

[harwellplant]

i'll agree with chuck on this one. the greatest majority of the el releases have not been great cigars for me, especially when compared to some of the other vitolas in the lines. there have been a couple of exceptions (cohiba's dc release most specifically). i have heard the opinion that, like most great cigars, the taste of the el will get better in time. that notwithstanding, i haven't smoked an el with a decidedly "young" taste and which you would be expecting to develop. additionally, of the premier el releases in my humidor, none have improved so markedly over time (granted, i haven't returned to the el boxes like i have with other regular releases). for my palate, the development of a first box of monte edmundos has been much better for a new release.

candidly, the els have disappointed me and, with the addition of the psd4 reserve line, i am concerned that a great deal of focus is being turned to marketing. many vendors have jumped on this bus and, whipping the froth, it has led to the prices like that listed above and, with the mad rush, a great decline in customer service and quality.

fwiw, that - together with the ability to purchase singles - is one of the reasons this site has become one of my primary vendors. thanks rob, lisa and the rest for what you do.

[DocRKS]

» » No Mistake ---- and this is not from a UK vendor.

»

» Well, that's a little weird. I just got notification from another vendor

» and it was under $500 for Mag 50's (Still too high to me) and under $160

» for the Monte Ds.

Nothing weird about getting unbanded and no original box cheaper than fully intact ---- so even at the 'cheaper' price - you can still get 2.5 boxes of the Mag 46s (intact !!!!) vs this 'cheaper' version of Mag 50s unbanded.

[The Prince]

» » » No Mistake ---- and this is not from a UK vendor.

» »

» » Well, that's a little weird. I just got notification from another

» vendor

» » and it was under $500 for Mag 50's (Still too high to me) and under

» $160

» » for the Monte Ds.

»

» Nothing weird about getting unbanded and no original box cheaper than

» fully intact ---- so even at the 'cheaper' price - you can still get 2.5

» boxes of the Mag 46s (intact !!!!) vs this 'cheaper' version of Mag 50s

» unbanded.

I agree.

[Ken Gargett]

just caught up with all of this. one of the great things about the EL's in the past was that they were often fantastic value. it does seem a very cuban habit to have something that represents good value (i'm thinking of the cost of a day's fishing in las salinas) and for them to suddenly discover this and then whack up the price to absurd levels. they seem to have done it again. what a shame. rules me out at these prices (will be very interested to see what we have to pay here - considering exchange rates etc). they did it with the fishing though that is such a great day that you forgive them and give it a go but they forget that not only are there a lot of other cuban cigars out there that are better value, they also have competitors from elsewhere. that sort of pricing just opens the door.

[Tampa1257]

» that sort of pricing just opens the door.

Ken, I would have to say that for a vast many cigar smokers, that Pricing just slammed the door in our face and that was right after they spit on us too.

I certainly hope that the normal day in and day out Habanos smoker is able to survive this marketing strategy. Actually this is bordering on Rape.

I also hope that those that do read the different cigar forums from Habanos listen and see the Outrage, Frustration, Anger, and Betrayal that the loyal Habanos Smokers feel because of this Pricing structure on sub-par performing cigars. It also shows a sign that the number of ELs coming out of Habanos is declineing, well that really shouldn't be a surprise because the value has declined, just not the price.

I'll buy the Monte D EL, when they are priced @ $100 or less for the box of 10. I can buy many, many, many Habanos for less than $10 a stick, and since regular production Habanos taste far superior to any EL, why in the world would someone spend more for a cigar that really is not worth $5.00 a stick?

Someone needs to let Habanos know they have crossed the line away from their bread and butter cigar smokers, and they are going to be scratching their head wondering why those boxes are just sitting.

Simple, the ELs are not worth the $$$.

Rob & Lisa, I love your service and product. My opinions are in no way a reflection upon you. I am truly Outraged at Habanos for the StOOpidity of their pricing structure on ELs. I know that when you receive them that you are in business, but I fear that there might not be many takers for these itmes due to the cost. Please continue to load up inventory on regular production items, which are correctly priced and affordable.

Tampa

[El Presidente]

I hope to have pricing on these by mid month and it will give me a better idea as to whether it is a retailer gouge or a Habanos s.a gouge. It will take about 2 minutes to find out ;-) and I will let you know.

I was at a few discussions at In Havana February. My guess is higher LE prices and lower LE release volumes.

[Ken Gargett]

understand. would say that for me, some of the EL's have been crackers - the hoyo and the partagas pyramides are terrific. some less so (i do not care what you say, rob, my monte C's are going nowhere). from memory, the partagas were quite cheap and the hoyo, i remember paying about $136 a box in havana and they were available over several trips. i wonder if the first couple of years were a bit 'toe in the water' and now that they are more established, it is 'gouge the clients' time (or rob joined the pricing dept). it is stupid and short-sighted in the extreme. one dead golden goose recently seen floating in havana bay.

when we find out what they are costing thru rob, i'm thinking that passing on all this to the 'source' in habanos is necessary to show them how silly this is. whether it'll do any good....

[n2advnture]

I am totaly with you Doc...I have had it. There are WAY too many other smokes to paying those ridiculous prices. That's freaking insane...I am OUT!!!

I thought $30+ for the PSD4Res was as bad as it was going to get.

I suspect that they have pushed their limits with the pricing and will have a ton sitting on the shelves 9 months from now. Wait for them to have a year's age on them and wait for them to go on sale big time (like the Cohiba Reservas, Monte Cs, etc...)

What a bunch of crap!

Quote from R&D:

"I've got it!!! Let's take a Mag46, make it fatter, slap a shiney Edicion Limitada band on it and charge 3 times as much!!! Do we still have a ton of the EL bands left over from the C's???"

Quote from Marketing:

"Brilliant!"

.