Cigar Tasting Bordeaux

[BrightonCorgi]

[Ken Gargett]

10 hours ago, BrightonCorgi said:

interesting one. i'm sure you are aware of the references to cigar boxes as a flavour often encountered in Bordeaux. and very often tobacco leaf as well. picking the flavours as a specific House is taking it further than usual. and a bit tosserish given that even with a House, flavours can vary. that said, neal martin seems to me to be one of the better critics around. part of the vinous site and i think he leaves the others in the dust. i've not met him but he normally comes across as a decent bloke and a sensible one. 

[BrightonCorgi]

49 minutes ago, Ken Gargett said:

interesting one. i'm sure you are aware of the references to cigar boxes as a flavour often encountered in Bordeaux. and very often tobacco leaf as well. picking the flavours as a specific House is taking it further than usual. and a bit tosserish given that even with a House, flavours can vary. that said, neal martin seems to me to be one of the better critics around. part of the vinous site and i think he leaves the others in the dust. i've not met him but he normally comes across as a decent bloke and a sensible one. 

My barrel tasting notes on this vintage reference Saint Luis Rey flavors...  I guess we are on to something lol...

Was thinking of buy a few things, possibly this en premier.  Pricing has come down some across the board on a welcome note.

[Ken Gargett]

Just now, BrightonCorgi said:

My barrel tasting notes on this vintage reference Saint Luis Rey flavors...  I guess we are on to something lol...

Was thinking of buy a few things, possibly this en premier.  Pricing has come down some across the board on a welcome note.

finally. it took all the mess to finally convince bordeaux that they were overpriced. good luck doing that in burgundy yet. 

but prices will go back up so it seems an excellent vintage to buy. 

[Wookie]

I bet Clive Coates and Alexis Lichine would laugh at the notion of grapes tasting like graphite and montecristos. I think Parker started "noticing" pencil-lead. But every generation has to push the envelope a bit farther.  I still have some 80s and 90s Ducru laying around. Laughable to think the prices being paid for classified growths these days. I usually save the big names for people who haven't tried them before so I can burst the myth that these are worth the prices. 

[Ken Gargett]

8 hours ago, Wookie said:

I bet Clive Coates and Alexis Lichine would laugh at the notion of grapes tasting like graphite and montecristos. I think Parker started "noticing" pencil-lead. But every generation has to push the envelope a bit farther.  I still have some 80s and 90s Ducru laying around. Laughable to think the prices being paid for classified growths these days. I usually save the big names for people who haven't tried them before so I can burst the myth that these are worth the prices. 

coates has enough odd descriptions to qualify. not my fave critic. i have read most of his books, and find them worthwhile and subscribed to his own magazine, the vine, for a long time but in the end, i gave up. not for the wine side of things. he refused to honour a promise he made - minor thing, but i thought that if this is the bloke's character, i'm gone.

if you subscribed from the first issue of the vine (it was monthly), you got the 13th free, for the first year. so my sub would always run from after the 13th, 25th, 37th issue etc. then one year he insisted the sub was to run from the multiple off 12 (after the 144th, or thereabouts, when it should have been the 145th). a really minor thing but when i politely pointed it out, i was told very bluntly i could cop what he said or bugger off. even if i had been wrong, he had someone who was a loyal subscriber for over twelve years and he wanted to argue over one issue. so i told him i was buggering off. tosser. i told him i'd use the money to subscribe to parker because i knew how much he hated parker, supposedly. actually, i was already subscribing to parker but he didn't know that. i thought what an appalling example of customer service. 

parker, on the other hand, could not have been more different. i remember telling them, when my sub came up for renewal, that i thought i had previously subscribed for three years not two, though as i had no records left (i'd moved and they were in a box a squillion miles away), i was not complaining and happy to start the sub again after two (not sure why the discussion had even come up - think they asked me about length for some reason - they had me at two years). they came back to me and said that as i was a long term subscriber, they'd be happy to give me the extra year, even if i did not have any records or proof. 

the two approaches could hardly have been more different. no need to guess who i stuck with (although i was much happier with the notes from parker as well). i know another very famous critic, who i won't name, cannot stand coates. detests the bloke. but he would never tell me why. 

give me time and i'll pull out some notes from the 40s which suggest that some of the notes of today have nothing on back then.