BolivarCE Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 Hello, A buddy of mine was given this box of cigars from a family friend. The family friend told him that it was 20 plus years old. Was wondering if the knowledgeable members of this forum can let me know if this is an authentic box and, if it is, possibly date it. I just took a couple of pictures and put it in my humidor. Haven't smoked one yet. I am clueless when it comes to vintage habanos. I appreciate all the help. Will Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oliverdst Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 Hello, Bolivar, Sorry, I can't help you but, at this moment, as important as its authenticity is to know if they were properly stored. Do you know if your family friend has an humidor with temp and humidity control? Like always, this is a good beggining: http://www.cubancigarwebsite.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BolivarCE Posted July 23, 2013 Author Share Posted July 23, 2013 Campanas, Yes, he was told that they were kept in a humidor. How properly it was kept, he doesn't know. For what it's worth, I looked at the cigars and they do appear to be in good shape with some oil on the wrappers. Will Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nikesupremedunk Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 Any pictures of the cigars themselves? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oliverdst Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 Searching in the mentioned website I would say your box is between '62 and '85. Yes, I know it doesn't help a lot. Tomorrow I will take some books and try to find something else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dvickery Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 I have a few boxes of party 898uv's...one from the 70's and one from mid 80's...I am not at home and wont be for a week...so pics and double checking is out of the question right now. both boxes I have...any ink stamping and the seal are on the cardboard box...not the wood box...I believe. art did a review of the ones I have and if you can smoke one...compare it to this... http://thedirtyashes.wordpress.com/2013/05/30/1984-partagas-898-unvarnished/ derrek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B3n Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 Hey Bolivar, Can you measure the width of the stamp? Might help in narrowing the date of the box. Ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdC Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 what does "patente" etc mean? i've never seen this before this is also the first time i see the seal on the box on the 8-9-8 boxes i have the seal used to be on the covering carton box and not on the wooden box ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nino Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 what does "patente" etc mean? i've never seen this before this is also the first time i see the seal on the box on the 8-9-8 boxes i have the seal used to be on the covering carton box and not on the wooden box ??? Exactly ... thanks Koen - and btw : why is the stamp only on the bottom side ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oliverdst Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 Patente means trademark/copyright, something that Habanos registered as its property. I guess in english the verb is "to patent". I googled and could find some images with the seal on the box but most of them are on the cardboard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nino Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 Patente means trademark/copyright, something that Habanos registered as its property. I guess in english the verb is "to patent". I googled and could find some images with the seal on the box but most of them are on the cardboard. Thanks Oliver, but I guess neither Koen nor I were asking for the meaning of the word Patente, quite an obvious word . It's the branding of that word ( plus the other ink stamp plus the seal ) on the bottom that's puzzling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B3n Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 Assuming the box is old the upper half of the seal just might have fallen off (or is placed so that it just reaches the upper front edge not showing on the top). I have seen numerous boxes (mostly SLBs and varnished) where only half of the seal was left. Thats not a miracle. The seal itself being on the 898 box isnt unusual either. I have several boxes from the 1990s with the seals on the box instead of the cardboard. Check Min Ron Nee as well, he has pics in the encyclopedia showing 898 boxes with the seal on the box. Maybe a better pic of the seal would help. Only concern I have with the seal is that it seems a bit fresh for a 30+ year old box. But the pic might be misleading. Concerning the Pantente stamp. That is unusual but I have seen another with the exact same stamp that was supposed to be authentic. Concerning narrowing the date without further information: Since the Cubatobaco stamp with the leaf is missing these are probably pre 1986 The Hecho en Cuba stamp is used since somewhere in the 1960s The seal seems to be the one used from early 1970s on It seems that the box is from somewhere between early 1970s and 1985. The Hecho en Cuba stamp looks like one of the variations of the reintroduced large stamp used 1980-1985 and Robert (Montehiba blog a very knowledgeable guy when it comes to vintage cubans) once told me that in the mid of the 1980s a lot of merchants began (almost arbitrarily) stamping their boxes. The stamp on the box might be such a stamp. Hence my guess: The box comes from around 1985 or slightly earlier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nino Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 Herzlichen Dank for the detailed information, Ben ! I share some of your doubts and guess further detailed pictures of the seal, the bottom stamp and, specially, the cigars would be conductive to a ( long distance ) tentative result. Gruß / Nino Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Presidente Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 Great stuff Ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BolivarCE Posted July 23, 2013 Author Share Posted July 23, 2013 Thanks everyone for their help and input. I can take more pictures and measure the stamp on the bottom when I get home. Regarding the "Patente". This box was purchased in Panama 20 or more years ago. Or however old it is. Don't know if that would explain the "patente" or not. Just thought I'd put it out there. Will Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oliverdst Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 Thanks Oliver, but I guess neither Koen nor I were asking for the meaning of the word Patente, quite an obvious word . It's the branding of that word ( plus the other ink stamp plus the seal ) on the bottom that's puzzling. Sorry, Nino, I wasn't underestimating your intelligence but FOH forum being a babel maybe some people have difficulties with spanish. But I confess I hadn't understood what you were meaning. I think now I figured it out. Well, I zoomed in the first image and I am quite sure the word stamped is "COMERCIO" and the other little sign under it is a letter "M". For those who don't know comercio means trade, business, commerce. My assumption is that the box was inspected inside the factory and then was stamped COMERCIO meaning that it was ok to go to a store, althought "Comercio" itself doesn't seem to be a quality control word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BonVivant Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 http://www.todocoleccion.net/caja-puros-flor-tabacos-partagas-cia-habana-cuba-partagas-8-9-8~x34446002 here is a varnished box with identical markings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BolivarCE Posted July 24, 2013 Author Share Posted July 24, 2013 Here are a few more photos. The stamp on the bottom is approx. 7.5 cm wide and 6 cm top to bottom. Will Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cigcars Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 Mmmmm yum!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nino Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 Sorry, Nino, I wasn't underestimating your intelligence but FOH forum being a babel maybe some people have difficulties with spanish. But I confess I hadn't understood what you were meaning. I think now I figured it out. Well, I zoomed in the first image and I am quite sure the word stamped is "COMERCIO" and the other little sign under it is a letter "M". For those who don't know comercio means trade, business, commerce. My assumption is that the box was inspected inside the factory and then was stamped COMERCIO meaning that it was ok to go to a store, althought "Comercio" itself doesn't seem to be a quality control word. Oliver, I agree on the word COMERCIO, but I guess it must be an internal store code, not from the factory. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nino Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 Here are a few more photos. The stamp on the bottom is approx. 7.5 cm wide and 6 cm top to bottom. Will Will, from those additional pictures I'd be quite re-assured that the cigars are genuine. The only irritant I still have is the seal, but the cigars look perfect & excellent. Enjoy ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdC Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 Check Min Ron Nee as well, he has pics in the encyclopedia showing 898 boxes with the seal on the box. Correct! should have double, double checked things Leaves the seal and the "patente" Cigars look great though I also tend to believe these are genuine Great story about "comercio", but I'm still intrigued where the "patente etc." comes from Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 That 'Patente No. 2357' is probably to do with the 898 box style. I say this because somebody in Yorkshire, UK found a box of Ramon Allones 898 in March last year with the same 'Patente No. 2357' stamp on the bottom. That box, he guessed, was from the early 1980s. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nino Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 That 'Patente No. 2357' is probably to do with the 898 box style. X2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mk05 Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 Yes I saw a similar box on auction from late '70s. How many people are distinguishable working on the field, on the green seal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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