nrl /dce backflip

[madbunny]

whats everyone's thought's on dce staying with manly ,is it time to bring the draft back ? once signed thats it no cooling off ? or what about a trade window during the year or at the end of the year ,thoughts

[partriar]

The NRL has now changed the rules. There is now a 10 business day cooling off period (after this season obv) instead of the absolutely obscured round 13 rules.

Im a queenslander and as such am excited and fond of DCE. What he has done to the Titian's is really wrong. This back-flip has totally screwed the Titans. Whilst they should have been expecting it, it has disabled that club even more. They had banked on the fact that DCE has said to the CEO he was a 'certainty to go to Titians' They release Adrian Caesar know they had DCE coming. Opps

Dog move it you ask me. I have lost alot of respect for him.

[madbunny]

a lot can change in 6 months the nrl will think off something else to do about this and stuff it up ,why would you want to go to the titians when they will have no player ,some of the contracts they are on just dont make sense ,a lot has to change on the nrl front but they jump head first in

[Ken Gargett]

shown himself to be an utter grub.

i'm neither a fan of the titans nor manly so not 'personal', but he has shown himself to be utterly untrustworthy. his word will never mean squat again.

i know that he was 'within the rules' (really incompetent set up and thankfully changed) but it is incredibly unfair to the club that signed him in good faith. they lose other players because they have spent dosh on him and cannot fit others under the cap and then they no longer have the time to chase replacements.

the bloke gave his word then dragged it out. then we have all the crap about a decision based on family - whoops, his family is in queensland. if he had the decency to say it was simply about money, he'd get a tiny bit of respect for that, but he is clearly not honest and he has shown the sort of bloke he is.

i had mates suggesting he would do this. my view was give him the benefit of the doubt. he signed the contract and gave his word. believe the guy until he proves we can't. he has proved we can't.

he is a talented player and presumably will be part of the maroons for years but i would not blink if he snapped his leg and could never play again. the game would better off without his ilk.

cam smith talked of him as the next queensland captain. i would be repulsed by that. completely disgusted if he was captain. it would devalue the jersey immeasurably.

interesting that on the courier mail website this morning, they have 16 slots for stories on rugby league (and typically, the rugby league section sits above the 'all other sports' section). all 16 were devoted to this - not even origin gets that much coverage - and all 16 were not positive towards his actions, to put it mildly (and remember that the courier mail, despite what everyone thinks, is not a queensland newspaper, it is a brisbane paper and also owned by the mob behind the broncos).

he could become the greatest player the game has ever seen but he will never get the respect he so clearly desires.

[madbunny]

they are just lucky they signed edgely to a long term contract because he looks good once he gets some more experince

[Fuzz AI]

Agree, a total grub move.

[JasnRach]

Although he hasn't broken the rules, he has shown his true colours.....a worm!!

How the NRL allows this is beyond me, the Titans will suffer badly for this as Ken stated, they built their team around this and let players go.

[JasnRach]

[soutso]

A young boy is playing the game he loves. He's playing to the best of his ability yet nobody has recognised nor appreciated his talent. No club in his home state has recognised his potential.

Down in Sydney, the best performing Sydney club has just lost it's young halfback. They invite this kid to join their star studded side and ply his trade. The boy packs his bags and gives a new life a go. He joins a club with an illustrious history, a club that has been used to success. His halves partner at his new club is the finest young half in the game.

Their first season yields Premiership success. With that comes the envious glances from their rivals. The club has just participated in their third Grand Final in just five seasons. The boy is rewarded with a contract five times it's initial value.

The boy thrives and is enjoying his new life in one of Sydney's finest areas. The boy meets and marries the girl of his dreams. A local beauty who bares him a beautiful baby. The boy's life is a dream life. He is a professional athlete playing for a glamour club that matches his glamourous bride. Life couldn't be better.

In amongst his dream existance he plays in yet another Grand Final. Winning the Man of the Match as a consolation for a match lost by a referee who cannot adjudicate the forward pass rule properly. More semi finals are contested as are State of Origin games and Tests for his country.

The boy is coming toward the end of his contract. His club make him an offer and he accepts it's terms in order to continue living his dream.

In the meantime the club is bought out by it's half owner. The new management make the decision to withdraw their offer in order to pursue the signature of his halves partner. The boy is devastated. His future is now uncertain.

He negotiates lucrative deals with the Titans and the Sharks. He chooses the Titans.

The club of his heart, the club of the home of the love of his life then fails to re-sign his halves partner. There is hope for this boy....

Within the laws and rules of the game, the Club sets it's sights on securing one of it's greatest assets. The boy makes it clear that he will honour his new agreement with the Titans and that his home club is yet to attempt to sway him. The boy is honourable and the boy is a decent lad but the heart aches for what it really wants.

His current club, a club with a history of success and glory then asks to meet. They make the boy an offer that is a fair valuation of his status in the game. They offer the lifeline that he deep down, desperately craves. He goes home and tells his wife. She is ecstatic to know that she can live where she has always resided. She can be close to Mum who is always on hand to help with raising their beautiful child.

The boy now has a chance to be a one club player. The boy can continue living his dream. The boy accepts the offer that his dream club has made and both he and his family couldn't be happier.

I don't begrudge him that. I do not judge him. I am happy for his success.

[JohnS]

I don't like what DCE did either but it's interesting how there are double standards. The Bulldogs pulled out of a $3 million long-term deal with Cronulla's Andrew Fifita and this dd not draw media disapproval like it should have.

I know I'm being objective on this point too as I am a Bulldogs supporter of old, the 80's were my golden era!

[JC67]

"Winning the Man of the Match as a consolation for a match lost by a referee who cannot adjudicate the forward pass rule properly. More semi finals are contested as are State of Origin games and Tests for his country."

A mans word is obviously not important to some. Total disrespect for the guy... He has managed to put a lot of his team mates off side over the last couple of years as well

Soutso WOW... Obviously 2013 still hurts ??? ask any non Manly fan who the best team on the day was buddy

Blah Blah we were robbed...Blah Blah Souths premiership was handed to them by the NRL... Blah Blah Morris foot was so far out of touch it was in the grandstand during the 2010 GF Blah Blah... that's the way it goes mate

[Ken Gargett]

I don't like what DCE did either but it's interesting how there are double standards. The Bulldogs pulled out of a $3 million long-term deal with Cronulla's Andrew Fifita and that this not draw media disapproval like it should have.

I know I'm being objective on this point too as I am a Bulldogs supporter of old, the 80's were my golden era!

i'll get to soutso in a moment but the two situations could hardly be more different.

fifita entered negotiations with the bulldogs, they reached a memorandum of understanding but never signed a contract and then announced that they had been unable to come to terms. no contract was signed by either party. it was hardly helped by the moronic player basically announcing in the middle of it that he did not want to go to the dogs and that as soon as he could, he'd swap to rugby union. who would continue negotiations with someone like that.

and i'm also not a dogs or sharks supporter so again, not personal.

[Ken Gargett]

A young boy is playing the game he loves. He's playing to the best of his ability yet nobody has recognised nor appreciated his talent. No club in his home state has recognised his potential.

Down in Sydney, the best performing Sydney club has just lost it's young halfback. They invite this kid to join their star studded side and ply his trade. The boy packs his bags and gives a new life a go. He joins a club with an illustrious history, a club that has been used to success. His halves partner at his new club is the finest young half in the game.

Their first season yields Premiership success. With that comes the envious glances from their rivals. The club has just participated in their third Grand Final in just five seasons. The boy is rewarded with a contract five times it's initial value.

The boy thrives and is enjoying his new life in one of Sydney's finest areas. The boy meets and marries the girl of his dreams. A local beauty who bares him a beautiful baby. The boy's life is a dream life. He is a professional athlete playing for a glamour club that matches his glamourous bride. Life couldn't be better.

In amongst his dream existance he plays in yet another Grand Final. Winning the Man of the Match as a consolation for a match lost by a referee who cannot adjudicate the forward pass rule properly. More semi finals are contested as are State of Origin games and Tests for his country.

The boy is coming toward the end of his contract. His club make him an offer and he accepts it's terms in order to continue living his dream.

In the meantime the club is bought out by it's half owner. The new management make the decision to withdraw their offer in order to pursue the signature of his halves partner. The boy is devastated. His future is now uncertain.

He negotiates lucrative deals with the Titans and the Sharks. He chooses the Titans.

The club of his heart, the club of the home of the love of his life then fails to re-sign his halves partner. There is hope for this boy....

Within the laws and rules of the game, the Club sets it's sights on securing one of it's greatest assets. The boy makes it clear that he will honour his new agreement with the Titans and that his home club is yet to attempt to sway him. The boy is honourable and the boy is a decent lad but the heart aches for what it really wants.

His current club, a club with a history of success and glory then asks to meet. They make the boy an offer that is a fair valuation of his status in the game. They offer the lifeline that he deep down, desperately craves. He goes home and tells his wife. She is ecstatic to know that she can live where she has always resided. She can be close to Mum who is always on hand to help with raising their beautiful child.

The boy now has a chance to be a one club player. The boy can continue living his dream. The boy accepts the offer that his dream club has made and both he and his family couldn't be happier.

I don't begrudge him that. I do not judge him. I am happy for his success.

i saw one bloke post that he was a bit concerned that dce might run on for the blues next origin, given how easily his loyalty can be bought.

i can only assume that this is one giant wind up or that you are, and nothing (much) wrong with this, a more one-eyed manly fan than fatty vautin (great qlder that he is). that nonsense about the ref. seriously? wow! i'll be honest, i thought manly were courageous over the finals series, so much so that i would have liked to see them win the comp, but there was no injustice. but your utter nonsense? i had not realised that kevin rudd had joined the forum. even he would be stretched to come up with this.

in case you missed it, this was his recent wikipedia entry, subsequently amended.

""Daly Cherry-Evans (born 20 February 1989 in Redcliffe, Queensland) is an Australian professional rugby league gymnast who currently backflips for the Manly Warringah Sea Eagles of the National Rugby League.

"A Queensland State of Origin and Australia national representative halfback/Five-eighth, he won the 2011 NRL Premiership with Manly.[2]

"DCE is a genuine scumbag, leaving a club in tatters for more cash. Some say he doesn't have a soul. 0%"".

otherwise, your review of the situation would make the brothers grimm vomit. he played for a club as a kid where the coach was a former manly player or scout - forget which. they got him early. he was also at a manly feeder club. no issue with that. happens all the time.

remember that there are only three clubs up here. we can't take all the players. and we have been known to take the odd player from down south. all's fair... dogs have long plundered qld. be mad not to. ditto canberra though they are bit sick of players hating ricky stuart and wanting to come home. ditto storm. and others. he played with ben barba as a kid who went to the dogs.

terrific player, no question. we qlders have always assumed that all the turmoil at manly between watmough and stewart v dce was because watmough and stewart were turds and dce was a victim. i can tell you the last 24 hours have done wonders for the reputation of stewart and watmough. it has swung entirely onto dce.

terrific player, brilliant in his first year, gets the contract he deserves. all irrelevant to anything subsequent.

the most interesting bit of your post is "The boy is coming toward the end of his contract. His club make him an offer and he accepts it's terms". in other words, he not only backflipped on the titans, he had already backflipped on his own club. what a prince!

but actually, he didn't accept. he led them on trying to wring every last cent out of "this beloved club". they withdrew because even that bnch of misfits and vermin saw what a vile little greedy worm he was. so when he was offered more elsewhere, he jumped.

and when he was offered even more to renege on that, he jumped back.

he is the seth blatter of rugby league without the good reputation.

that halves partner of whom you speak is a kiwi. and he has had the decency to confirm he will not renege on his word. how embarrassing for all australians that we are being shown how to act with integrity by a kiwi.

the bottom line is that dce, fine footballer he might be, has proved himself a grubby little **** who can never be trusted. he has done himself and his reputation irreparable damage. he better be happy at manly and surrounds for the rest of his life because he will never be well regarded here again.

if he was never to play for the maroons again, a great many qlders would not be bothered in the least. and i'm yet to hear anyone wish him well.

grub.

[JohnS]

i'll get to soutso in a moment but the two situations could hardly be more different.

fifita entered negotiations with the bulldogs, they reached a memorandum of understanding but never signed a contract and then announced that they had been unable to come to terms. no contract was signed by either party. it was hardly helped by the moronic player basically announcing in the middle of it that he did not want to go to the dogs and that as soon as he could, he'd swap to rugby union. who would continue negotiations with someone like that.

and i'm also not a dogs or sharks supporter so again, not personal.

Ken, I'll concede that I had actually forgotten about Fifita's flippancy during negotiations. You make a fair point mate!

[Ken Gargett]

Ken, I'll concede that I had actually forgotten about Fifita's flippancy during negotiations. You make a fair point mate!

it was a priceless moment. the bloke going for a massive, record contract and he tells the mob he wants the dosh from that not only does he not like them but he's planning to skip town first opp.

has to go down as supremely stupid, even for a footy player.

[soutso]

"Winning the Man of the Match as a consolation for a match lost by a referee who cannot adjudicate the forward pass rule properly. More semi finals are contested as are State of Origin games and Tests for his country."

A mans word is obviously not important to some. Total disrespect for the guy... He has managed to put a lot of his team mates off side over the last couple of years as well

Soutso WOW... Obviously 2013 still hurts ??? ask any non Manly fan who the best team on the day was buddy

Blah Blah we were robbed...Blah Blah Souths premiership was handed to them by the NRL... Blah Blah Morris foot was so far out of touch it was in the grandstand during the 2010 GF Blah Blah... that's the way it goes mate

A lost GF hurts forever. That's the best part of all sport - the emotions that we connect to it.

Many non Manly fans have have expressed to me that they also felt the refereeing had a strong bearing on that particular game. The game ebbs and flows on momentum and some poor offiating started the ball rolling for the Roosters. I feel that anyone who watched it and believes otherwise, is incorrect.

That said, if the refereeing were spot on Manly could still have lost that game. Nobody could ever predict with certainty what would have happened in any case. That's football - it works for you and against you. I still love it.

For the record, I have never believed Souths were 'handed' the Premiership and I do think that that particular moment between Easts and Saints advantaged Saints via a refereeing error. Did it decide the game? Probably not though it didnt aid the Roosters cause.

[Ken Gargett]

A lost GF hurts forever. That's the best part of all sport - the emotions that we connect to it.

Many non Manly fans have have expressed to me that they also felt the refereeing had a strong bearing on that particular game. The game ebbs and flows on momentum and some poor offiating started the ball rolling for the Roosters. I feel that anyone who watched it and believes otherwise, is incorrect.

That said, if the refereeing were spot on Manly could still have lost that game. Nobody could ever predict with certainty what would have happened in any case. That's football - it works for you and against you. I still love it.

For the record, I have never believed Souths were 'handed' the Premiership and I do think that that particular moment between Easts and Saints advantaged Saints via a refereeing error. Did it decide the game? Probably not though it didnt aid the Roosters cause.

i think a lot of what you say in general is true, though my recollection of that game, as someone independent though with a slight preference for manly (a rare thing), i thought that they were well beaten overall. but such a brave run in to the finals and, if i recall, one or two very beneficial decisions to assist them get there. assuming no corruption and dodgy officials (the sort that used to cost the maroons so often, and yes, the grasshopper), swings and roundabouts.

poor ref decisions are a blight to sport but they are also part of it. just ask the irish soccer team (it was only a little handball).

as for the pain of losing a grand final, i'll have to take your word for it - i'm a broncos fan.

[soutso]

i saw one bloke post that he was a bit concerned that dce might run on for the blues next origin, given how easily his loyalty can be bought.

i can only assume that this is one giant wind up or that you are, and nothing (much) wrong with this, a more one-eyed manly fan than fatty vautin (great qlder that he is). that nonsense about the ref. seriously? wow! i'll be honest, i thought manly were courageous over the finals series, so much so that i would have liked to see them win the comp, but there was no injustice. but your utter nonsense? i had not realised that kevin rudd had joined the forum. even he would be stretched to come up with this.

in case you missed it, this was his recent wikipedia entry, subsequently amended.

""Daly Cherry-Evans (born 20 February 1989 in Redcliffe, Queensland) is an Australian professional rugby league gymnast who currently backflips for the Manly Warringah Sea Eagles of the National Rugby League.

"A Queensland State of Origin and Australia national representative halfback/Five-eighth, he won the 2011 NRL Premiership with Manly.[2]

"DCE is a genuine scumbag, leaving a club in tatters for more cash. Some say he doesn't have a soul. 0%"".

otherwise, your review of the situation would make the brothers grimm vomit. he played for a club as a kid where the coach was a former manly player or scout - forget which. they got him early. he was also at a manly feeder club. no issue with that. happens all the time.

remember that there are only three clubs up here. we can't take all the players. and we have been known to take the odd player from down south. all's fair... dogs have long plundered qld. be mad not to. ditto canberra though they are bit sick of players hating ricky stuart and wanting to come home. ditto storm. and others. he played with ben barba as a kid who went to the dogs.

terrific player, no question. we qlders have always assumed that all the turmoil at manly between watmough and stewart v dce was because watmough and stewart were turds and dce was a victim. i can tell you the last 24 hours have done wonders for the reputation of stewart and watmough. it has swung entirely onto dce.

terrific player, brilliant in his first year, gets the contract he deserves. all irrelevant to anything subsequent.

the most interesting bit of your post is "The boy is coming toward the end of his contract. His club make him an offer and he accepts it's terms". in other words, he not only backflipped on the titans, he had already backflipped on his own club. what a prince!

but actually, he didn't accept. he led them on trying to wring every last cent out of "this beloved club". they withdrew because even that bnch of misfits and vermin saw what a vile little greedy worm he was. so when he was offered more elsewhere, he jumped.

and when he was offered even more to renege on that, he jumped back.

he is the seth blatter of rugby league without the good reputation.

that halves partner of whom you speak is a kiwi. and he has had the decency to confirm he will not renege on his word. how embarrassing for all australians that we are being shown how to act with integrity by a kiwi.

the bottom line is that dce, fine footballer he might be, has proved himself a grubby little **** who can never be trusted. he has done himself and his reputation irreparable damage. he better be happy at manly and surrounds for the rest of his life because he will never be well regarded here again.

if he was never to play for the maroons again, a great many qlders would not be bothered in the least. and i'm yet to hear anyone wish him well.

grub.

Ken,

I will respect your response with some honesty here.

1. I am absolutely certain that DCE is exceptionally proud to play for Qld. I don't think he could be bought when it comes to SOO. (though that's impossible in any case)

2. A wind up? I concede that I typed this with a smile. Fatty Vautin and Cliff Lyons are my most beloved icons of this game. They played for my team when I was a young boy thus they will forever be my only Rugby League 'heroes' so to speak. I see the game differently now as an adult who resides in the 'real world'

3. Don't believe all you read on Wikipedia

4. I will always have great affection for Watmough and G Stewart, they have been a joy to watch. The fact is our current coach chose to keep the younger players (DCE being a big part of that) at their expense. This is what created the rift. DCE was not going to accept a reduced salary in order to maintain the salaries of two aged stars. This is one of the great flaws/issues with a salary cap. Clubs are forced to make hard decisions on all players - including the long serving/loyal ones.

The club (coach Toovey) made the correct decision here. Stewart misses a lot of footy with injury, the Rabbitohs are finding this currently so his worth under a cap is questionable. Watmough plays the game tough. He started his first grade career at a young age so this makes it even harder for him to perform at previous levels. How much longer can he go? My Parra supporting friends are unimpressed by him.

The release of Watmough and non offer of a contract to Stewart has put Foran offside with Manly and is the major reason for his deciding to leave. He apparently is not on speaking terms with Toovey and would only re-sign if Toovey were punted. Appartently Manly are exploring that option too, which disappoints me greatly.

Do you look after the aged stars or do you look to te future?

5. You misread the story behind DCE's initail contract talks. Manly made an offer that he accepted. Manly then halved the offer when they decided to chase Foran hard. If anything, Manly peformed the backflip.

Foran rejected Manly and so their attention turned to DCE. It would have been irresponsible of Manly not too. Second time round they got him..... at an inflated price. That's business, call it rookie management, but it is what it is.

6. You are wrong about not hearing of anyone who wishes him well. I hope that the boy wins 6 Premierships with Manly before his playing days are over! I wish him well LOL

As an aside, I do miss the days where players played for 'their' club and despised the others. Now it's about milking your career for all you can as you remain retired for such a long time. I remember watching Manly play Souths for the first time since Ian Robert's defection to Manly. Poor Ian was stretchered off the field before half time as the Souths players were baying for his blood given his 'betrayal'.

Nowadays they simply wish each other the very best and understand that he left for his family and future blah blah. I also can't stand how they all embrace and flirt with one another at full time..... The sport is too civilised!

[Ken Gargett]

Ken,

I will respect your response with some honesty here.

1. I am absolutely certain that DCE is exceptionally proud to play for Qld. I don't think he could be bought when it comes to SOO. (though that's impossible in any case)

2. A wind up? I concede that I typed this with a smile. Fatty Vautin and Cliff Lyons are my most beloved icons of this game. They played for my team when I was a young boy thus they will forever be my only Rugby League 'heroes' so to speak. I see the game differently now as an adult who resides in the 'real world'

3. Don't believe all you read on Wikipedia

4. I will always have great affection for Watmough and G Stewart, they have been a joy to watch. The fact is our current coach chose to keep the younger players (DCE being a big part of that) at their expense. This is what created the rift. DCE was not going to accept a reduced salary in order to maintain the salaries of two aged stars. This is one of the great flaws/issues with a salary cap. Clubs are forced to make hard decisions on all players - including the long serving/loyal ones.

The club (coach Toovey) made the correct decision here. Stewart misses a lot of footy with injury, the Rabbitohs are finding this currently so his worth under a cap is questionable. Watmough plays the game tough. He started his first grade career at a young age so this makes it even harder for him to perform at previous levels. How much longer can he go? My Parra supporting friends are unimpressed by him.

The release of Watmough and non offer of a contract to Stewart has put Foran offside with Manly and is the major reason for his deciding to leave. He apparently is not on speaking terms with Toovey and would only re-sign if Toovey were punted. Appartently Manly are exploring that option too, which disappoints me greatly.

Do you look after the aged stars or do you look to te future?

5. You misread the story behind DCE's initail contract talks. Manly made an offer that he accepted. Manly then halved the offer when they decided to chase Foran hard. If anything, Manly peformed the backflip.

Foran rejected Manly and so their attention turned to DCE. It would have been irresponsible of Manly not too. Second time round they got him..... at an inflated price. That's business, call it rookie management, but it is what it is.

6. You are wrong about not hearing of anyone who wishes him well. I hope that the boy wins 6 Premierships with Manly before his playing days are over! I wish him well LOL

As an aside, I do miss the days where players played for 'their' club and despised the others. Now it's about milking your career for all you can as you remain retired for such a long time. I remember watching Manly play Souths for the first time since Ian Robert's defection to Manly. Poor Ian was stretchered off the field before half time as the Souths players were baying for his blood given his 'betrayal'.

Nowadays they simply wish each other the very best and understand that he left for his family and future blah blah. I also can't stand how they all embrace and flirt with one another at full time..... The sport is too civilised!

i had no doubt you had a bit of fun writing the original piece. might have done the same in reverse circumstances, though those who've backed away from the broncos largely did it the minute they met bruno cullen - what a toxic and destructive presence he was for us. i believe bellamy was set to sign until he met cullen. from a very good source. and a few more.

the SOO comment was a bit of fun by the original poster but i liked it. it is how everyone i have spoken to up here feels. it really is amazing how he has gone from respected, almost loved, to detested overnight. everyone understands the bloke did it for money and that he was able to do so because of the absurd rules but that doesn't mean he gets away with people still respecting him.

he may earn respect as a footballer in qld, but he'll never ever have respect as a bloke. qlders have long memories. but if it happened to a sydney club, i'd have the same thoughts.

in 24 hours, he went from 'we are all looking forward to dce back in the origin team' to 'well, morgan was pretty good, happy to stick with him' and quite a few saying 'we hope hunt is next up and not dce'. i have no doubt he'll go back in but he will be the first qlder ever booed by his own supporters. he'll be as popular as mundine.

i don't follow the wikipedia bit - surely it was obvious that it was simply a pissed-off fan having some fun?

would never ever suggest dce accept less than he get at a club and certainly not take less so others can get more. that would make no sense. and am agreed it is usually better to let a star go earlier rather than later. don't be surprised to see sam thaiday on the market soon, for that reason. bennett has long held that as policy.

but the rift with dce was long before g stewart or choc W left. it was clear that there were serious divisions at the club a season or two earlier. that may have ignited it to a much greater extent but there was no doubt he was seriously unpopular with a number of senior manly players well before.

i don't really have any problem with what manly has done. i do have a problem with dce. he signed the contract but then he assured the titans board and fans he was coming. they lost players and could not chase others because of this. the bloke lied. he has been shown to have no integrity. if he had said, i've signed but i could have my mind changed, they would have had warning, though it is hardly ideal. but he lied to all.

he has badly hurt a club, the game, a great many fans (imagine you have a young son who was a titans fan and who was so excited dce coming to the coast and then he sees this!), and fellow players. all for his own selfish greed. what a great role model for kids.

and this coming from a fan of the game, not of the titans. imagine how they feel.

two days ago, i was a fan of his. now, not that you'd wish it on anyone, if he copped a career-ending injury tomorrow, i would think he got what he deserves and the game was better off without him.

but i do agree re the old days. the game is poorer for it.

[Ken Gargett]

re toovey, it does seem that he is for the chop. seems very harsh.

did hear a bizarre chat with toovey and others where toovey defended dce as an honourable man because even though he knew he was going back on his word, it really hurt him to do so.

holy crap.

it is now perfectly aceptable to act without a shred of integrity and to lie, as long as you feel a bit bad about doing so.

[soutso]

Ken, I find your take on Bruno Cullen an interesting one. By their standards the Broncos have been quiet for a long time now and I thought it was perhaps due to their talent pool being chewed up by Melbourne that accounted for it. I'm not being 'cynical' when I say that I feel the NRL diluted the Broncos to strengthen the Storm. It is perhaps neccessary that for Melbourne to succeed in the long term, they will need to have a strong team. It makes sense to keep Melbourne strong - and I always thought that the Broncos suffered more than anyone for this.

That said, they look pretty good at the moment.

Stemming from what youve said I've had a look to see what they are saying in Qld about DCE and I am genuinely surprised by the amount of vitriol. From Titans fans I get it but all the neutrals are fired up too. Oh well, Manly is hated anyway so its back to usual business for us.

I will be gutted if Toovey is given the boot. It would be undeserved and more as a result of the club being a basket case than for footballing reasons.