Psycho-pharmalogical considerations

[Froggy]

Hello fellow drug fiends!

I read in some documents (Wikipedia "Cigar" article, for ex.) that cigar smokin is one of the srongest way to self-dosing with the "herbe à Nicot"... I'm a bit skeptical about that. My question is: how many of you consider thenselves physically dependent of cigars. Sometimes, to be honest, I do get a some kind of buzz with a stogie, but for some reason, the nicotine getting in my bloodsrtream through cigar smoking never gives me a headache. Although it sure does its trick in getting me keyed up and alert. The "placebo" effect has nothing to do with IMO... What about you, Tabaco junkies? Do you puff STRICTLY for taste, or is there some additionnal kick that you crave for?

[Colt45]

For me it's all about the flavor.

[Habanos2000]

I enjoy the total cigar smoking "experience", the visual as well as the taste and smell. I very seldom feel buzzed after one and don't feel any different a day later like I'm coming off anything.

[Jesuscookies]

I enjoy the relaxation that comes along with having a stogie. It is a chance for me to just stop, sit, and enjoy. It is a hedonistic self indulgent pleasure, if you will.

However, if I thought for a one minute that there was no type of mind altering change going on while I smoked, I would be quite disillusioned. It is an addictive habit forming substance, end of story.

For those that say otherwise, good luck, and I hope that works out for you....

[cadillacdoc]

When the Peoples Republik of Kalifornia began one of their anti-smoking crusades a few years ago, my wife and daughter became particularly incensed about a billboard that pictured a double corona with the caption "this cigar contains four packs worth of nicotine". That sunday in the pool I had three sticks and constant bickering. The next morning my staff drew a serum nicotine level on me. No nicotine or nicotine metabolites were present. I only inhale what I get by accident. I personally get no buzz and smoke for the flavor and relaxation.

[thechenman]

For me personally, I don't feel like I have a dependence on cigars, I never feel like I have to have one, only that at times I would like to enjoy one. I smoke for the flavors, smell and feel of the cigar. The nicotine is secondary...actually I prefer not to get the nicotine buzz. That may seem strange to many, but that is my experience. Whether they become a habit due to addiction, that I don't know. Ask me again in a few years.

[Professor Twain]

I have never felt any dependence on cigars. I have read that cigars have lots of nicotine in them, but very little of it is absorbed because the mouth is very inefficient at absorbing nicotine, in contrast to the lungs. I have had a few occasions where strong cigars seemed to affect me.

I just did a little search and found the following research abstract from the British Medical Journal, which suggests that people who used to smoke cigarettes tend to inhale cigars and take in lots of nicotine, while "primary" pipe and cigar smokers (never smoked cigarettes) absorb little or no nicotine.

Note the final line of the abstract, it suggests that these researchers have a lot to learn about the joys of cigars!

Br Med J 1977;2:1387-1389 (26 November), doi:10.1136/bmj.2.6099.1387

Effect of cigar smoking on carboxyhaemoglobin and plasma nicotine concentrations in primary pipe and cigar smokers and ex-cigarette smokers

J A McM Turner, R W Sillett, M W McNicol

Five ex-cigarette smokers and five primary pipe and cigar smokers each smoked a large cigar. Carboxyhaemoglobin (COHb) and plasma nicotine levels were measured. In the ex-cigarette smokers mean COHb rose from 2·9% to 9·6% and plasma nicotine from 79·0 nmol/l to 281 nmol/l (12·8-45·6 ng/ml). This response was similar to that of cigarette smokers smoking cigarettes, which indicated that the subjects had inhaled and absorbed significant amounts of nicotine. In the primary pipe and cigar smokers the mean COHb rose from 0·8% to 1·0% and the plasma nicotine from 21 nmol/l to 32 nmol/l (3·4-5·2 ng/ml), indicating neither significant inhalation nor significant nicotine absorption.

Since ex-cigarette smokers do not seem to lose their habit of inhaling when they change to cigars, measures aimed at persuading smokers to switch to cigars will have little effect on their health. Pipe and cigar smokers who have never smoked cigarettes do not inhale, which probably accounts for their reduced incidence of coronary heart disease and lung cancer. But they also appear not to absorb nicotine, which suggests that nicotine is absorbed largely from the lung and that the buccal mucosa is unimportant. It also raises the interesting question of why primary pipe and cigar smokers do smoke.

[thechenman]

Interesting...

[cadillacdoc]

Another interesting thing I've read is that cigarette tobacco is acidified so that the nicotine is more readily absorbed in the alveoli. Cigar tobacco is totally natural and not chemically altered or enhanced with additives.

[aavkk]

Id like to address a couple of points brought up on this thread. First off, I smoke cigars strictly for the flavor and relaxation it provides and not for any "additional kick". I do concede that there are some properties in very minor levels that elevate blood pressure and awareness (most likely nicotine). When I smoke certain cigars before going to bed I sometimes have a hard time falling asleep right away.

Also, when my girfriend at the time suggested approximately 7 years ago that I was addicted to cigars I decided to do something against my will to prove a point. I didnt smoke a cigar for 6 months. I only did this because I knew that if I didnt nip that in the bud it would be a nag which I would be dealing with now 3 years into our marriage. She understands that it is NON ADDICTIVE and I thoroughly enjoy the 2-3 cigars which I smoke a week.

[lutharthegreat]

I used to smoke cigarettes and hated the feeling of needing that nicotine buzz. I have never had that urge with cigars and as far as inhaling them, no thanks.

[Ellery]

I agree with a lot of the posts. I smoke primarily for the flavor, relaxation and plain old good times with friends. I use to smoke cigarettes and I have never experienced any dependency/withdrawal from cigars that I use to get with cigarettes. I don't wake up and reach for a cigar, and if I don't have a cigar, I am not irritable...etc. The only time I get "sick" is after a long day with friends and smoking 5 cigars or so, then I get headaches and upset stomach.

[aea6574]

Howdy All:

I hope you are well.

I have an addictive personality, just the way I am. I used to smoke cigarettes and was glad to be rid of them. I have begun smoking cigars and have none of the feelings or "needs" that I did with cigs.

Now onto the other aspect that I am finding difficult is the collecting of all the various accessories and that there are so many different ones to try as well. For cigarettes it was Marlboro Reds in a box, with cigars it seems to be oh how about this?

Best regards, tony

[Guest rob]

Relaxation and enjoyment of flavour (and experience) are what I smoke cigars for.

[Tampa1257]

Its all about the flavor and relaxation for me.

[Kangaroo495]

I haven't had a cigar since Monday, and before that, not for a week (i.e. I've smoked one cigar in the last two weeks) and to be honest, never felt like having one all this time. Was going to pick one up on Wednesday but changed my mind. Have absolutely no physical inclination to pick up a stick. All depends on mood and circumstance.

And to be honest, the Partagas Shorts I had on Monday was so rich and flavoursome, that I felt like I'd eaten 10 pieces of extremely sweet cake. Just the thought of having another "piece" was almost nauseating!

I've got my eyes on a Partagas 8-9-8 tonight though...

[bolivr]

Yep, I am with pretty much with all you guys. Smoke for the flavour, aroma, relaxation and contemplation. For me, setting aside an hour or so to smoke something good or doing some hobby work I enjoy while smoking is one of life's major pleasures. It is also great to discover more about the world of cigars - growing, curing, rolling etc, a fascinatingly complex process

I must also say it is good to read so many similar experiences. I don't have any smoking buddies, my very good friends are mystified by the attraction of cigars. I try to convert them but I realise some folks just don't like smoking; that's all there is to it. Non smokers just don't get it

I have never found it addictive either. I find the thought of having a cigar is very much dependant on circumstance. Not something to be rushed but for when there is time and space for it.

I have had a 'rush' experience the one time. Smoked a Monte Petit Edmundo and thought that was so good I just have to have another cigar of some sort. Well, learnt a lesson then - too much of a good thing can make your heart race, feel sick and headache.

[sloth]

I always say that I crave a cigar like a crave a steak. I can get by without either one, but when I get the chance I pounce!

Only a few cigars give me a buzz... a few years ago when I had the habit of session drinking I like to have a cigarette... the first gave me a buzz, but anything after that gave me no satisfaction. I can never understand the 2-3 pack a day habit.

[sloth]

Non smokers just don't get it

I was a non smoker before I tried a cigar... frowned upon cigarettes as a kid.

Also, where I live, non smokers seem to be more complimentary about my cigars, then cigarette smokers.

In fact, when I would light up a cigar in a bar at a table full of cigarette smokers they would all look at me like I just took a BM on the table.

[Froggy]

Un gros merci pour toutes ces réponses intéressantes!!

Prof Twain, that was good food for thought; your explanations and theories motivate me to do further research on this topic, in my leisure time...

In my case, it seems that the younger the stogie, the stronger the nicotine hit might be. Fresh, oily sticks tend to give me a rush similar to a cigarette`s but lasting longer and giving me no nausea and/or headache. Most cigars don`t give me that kick, even though they offer me tons of simpler pleasures. I should also add that I used to be a moderate cigarette smoker who did inhale, but I don`t swallow ciggy fumes. The nicotine intake probably depends also on environmental factors, such as smoking in a closed room, inhaling your own second-hand smoke, etc. There must be also a small amount inadvertently inhaled, producing its subtle effects on brain reward pathways...

Lighting up a very youg Vegueros Mareva right now... let`s see if my thought processes improve.....

[sinnyc]

I smoked cigarettes for 20 years before focusing on cigars exclusively. I smoke at least 1 cigar a day and usually 2 or 3. For me, there is no question that I am getting a "nicotine fix" when I smoke a cigar and I'd be naive to think that nicotine addiction didn't have some role here. However, it is far different from the quick fix sort of nicotine delivery that cigarettes provided me. Cigarettes take 5 to 7 minutes to smoke. Cigars require anywhere from 30 to 90 minutes or more. The entire approach is fundamentally different.

When I smoked cigarettes I tended to run outside for a smoke the moment the nic fix bell rang - every 30 to 60 minutes. These nic fix sessions were purely a way of getting nicotine in to my system. They tended to be manic and not relaxing in any way. They were the smoking equivalent of fast food. Cigars require that I set aside a block of time to properly enjoy them. To carry the restaurant comparison farther, a cigar is like a fine, relaxed, multi-course meal.

Although my addiction to nicotine may be alive and well, I know the way I've been satisfying it over the last 10 or 15 years as changed from that of a Pavlovian-conditioned wretch (cigarettes) to that of a someday aficionado (cigars).

Of course, none of this touches at all on the level of enjoyment I get from cigars vs. cigarettes. Regardless of whether I'm alone or amongst friends, there's no contest - I prefer cigars.

- Tim

[Ellery]

I was a non smoker before I tried a cigar... frowned upon cigarettes as a kid.

Also, where I live, non smokers seem to be more complimentary about my cigars, then cigarette smokers.

In fact, when I would light up a cigar in a bar at a table full of cigarette smokers they would all look at me like I just took a BM on the table.

And it completely irks me when the cigarette smokers say " I hate the smell of cigars."

[cadillacdoc]

And it completely irks me when the cigarette smokers say " I hate the smell of cigars."

A hand rolled long filler stick smells SOOOO much better than cigarettes/cheap cigars

[Torontonian]

I agree with the majority of comments above . . . Just a quick caveat: remember that Wikipedia is not a reliable or accurate source of information, about cigars or anything else.

[Torpo]

I smoke because it's an experience pleasurable to the senses, not to satisfy a chemical dependency. To me, the physical effect of nicotine is not a desirable part of the experience.

It's the flavors (too numerous to mention here), aromas, feel, the visuals, (wrapper colors, smoke color and density, ash) and the diversity, (in each growing season, marc, box and individual cigar there is variance).

I generally smoke one cigar a day (sometimes more). Would I smoke a cigar every day if the flavor profile was the same? No. IMO, there's a difference.