Bait and Switch

[cobra]

Check out this little scam deal. About 6 months ago I contacted a vendor in the UK (first mistake) to try out the so called EMS labeled Habanos. This was a "Gold Medal" mortar and brick retailer very well established with a history going back to the 1800's. I purchased a box of HDM DC's assuming the lower prices offered to US consumers had something to do with the outrageous taxes over there (my second mistake). I received a box of cigars noting the place of origin wasn't from dear ole England but from some guy named Doug from NEBRASKA USA. They even had the iron clad "Cuban hologram" (my spider senses really started tingling). I ended up contacting them and got an amusing song and dance excuse (including this was just a trial endeavor), and of course an apology along with a refund. I did smoke one and the scary thing is the cigar wasn't all that bad. He even offered to send me some free sticks for my trouble. They must have gotten lost in the mail cause that was 6 months ago. Live and learn........

[strayvector]

» Check out this little scam deal. About 6 months ago I contacted a vendor in

» the UK (first mistake) to try out the so called EMS labeled Habanos. This

» was a "Gold Medal" mortar and brick retailer very well established with a

» history going back to the 1800's. I purchased a box of HDM DC's assuming

» the lower prices offered to US consumers had something to do with the

» outrageous taxes over there (my second mistake). I received a box of

» cigars noting the place of origin wasn't from dear ole England but from

» some guy named Doug from NEBRASKA USA. They even had the iron clad "Cuban

» hologram" (my spider senses really started tingling). I ended up

» contacting them and got an amusing song and dance excuse (including this

» was just a trial endeavor), and of course an apology along with a refund.

» I did smoke one and the scary thing is the cigar wasn't all that bad. He

» even offered to send me some free sticks for my trouble. They must have

» gotten lost in the mail cause that was 6 months ago. Live and

» learn........

Only thing I've ordered from said vendor was the MRN book, but there has been some very interesting discussions on his practices regarding EMS cigars on other boards. Boils down to the ever old adage of "Know your vendor". Integrity and customer service is something you never have to worry about with Rob and Lisa.

[habanohal]

Damn that SM. This has been gone over on numerous boards. It all came down to shipping partners and Cuban cigars smuggled into the states. Charges enormous prices with UK Duty and Vat when cigars never even were anywhere near the UK.

If you need to more just shoot me an email. By the way....there is no differance smokeing EMS HDM DC than El Prezs'

_____If this response is out of order Prez, sorry and just delete it.

[cf2112]

» Damn that SM. This has been gone over on numerous boards. It all

» came down to shipping partners and Cuban cigars smuggled into the states.

» Charges enormous prices with UK Duty and Vat when cigars never even were

» anywhere near the UK.

»

» If you need to more just shoot me an email. By the way....there is no

» differance smokeing EMS HDM DC than El Prezs'

»

»

» _____If this response is out of order Prez, sorry and just delete it.

I'm 99.9% sure this ain't SM, this is another UK vendor that has a "shipping partner" in Nebraska. Most of these transactions were proved to be fakes, most of M's are not but he still charges the duties:-(

[cigardawg]

» Check out this little scam deal. About 6 months ago I contacted a vendor in

» the UK (first mistake) to try out the so called EMS labeled Habanos. This

» was a "Gold Medal" mortar and brick retailer very well established with a

» history going back to the 1800's. I purchased a box of HDM DC's assuming

» the lower prices offered to US consumers had something to do with the

» outrageous taxes over there (my second mistake). I received a box of

» cigars noting the place of origin wasn't from dear ole England but from

» some guy named Doug from NEBRASKA USA. They even had the iron clad "Cuban

» hologram" (my spider senses really started tingling). I ended up

» contacting them and got an amusing song and dance excuse (including this

» was just a trial endeavor), and of course an apology along with a refund.

» I did smoke one and the scary thing is the cigar wasn't all that bad. He

» even offered to send me some free sticks for my trouble. They must have

» gotten lost in the mail cause that was 6 months ago. Live and

» learn........

Wow! The scary thing is...I know who those cigars came from (from another board). It truly is a small world. I kind of felt bad for him getting banned over there...I don't anymore. He deserved every bit of it. I won't even say what I think of the vendor.

[GTS21]

» » Damn that SM. This has been gone over on numerous boards. It

» all

» » came down to shipping partners and Cuban cigars smuggled into the

» states.

» » Charges enormous prices with UK Duty and Vat when cigars never even

» were

» » anywhere near the UK.

» »

» » If you need to more just shoot me an email. By the way....there is

» no

» » differance smokeing EMS HDM DC than El Prezs'

» »

» »

» » _____If this response is out of order Prez, sorry and just delete it.

»

»

» I'm 99.9% sure this ain't SM, this is another UK vendor that has a

» "shipping partner" in Nebraska. Most of these transactions were proved to

» be fakes, most of Mo's are not but he still charges the duties:-(

I've used this vendor before, and was always very pleased. It's very unfortunate that a good vendor associated himself with a bad business partner. Also, it's definately not MO we're talking about.

[El Presidente]

This is a very big lesson for retailers such as ourselves. I am not pointing fingers at anyone albeit many members here know how I feel about (positively and negatively) major worldwide Habanos dealers.

It is a temptation (to go ouside local Habanos s.a license holder) which tends to have the same ending.

1. Good Business Model including good service.

2. Explosion in demand.

3. Explosion in undercutting competitors

4. Need more stock at cheaper prices.

5. Start investigating grey market supply and new distribution models.

6. Start losing control.

7. Reputation gone.

We made the decision a while ago to turn away business rather than seek new suppliers in order to meet excess demand. We have a great relationship with both PCC and FOH members. I can't see how it would be strengthened by us seeking out new suppliers.

***PS...no direct mentioning of retailers. Some would love nothing more than to launch a legal action***

[Ginseng]

» 1. Good Business Model including good service.

» 2. Explosion in demand.

» 3. Explosion in undercutting competitors

» 4. Need more stock at cheaper prices.

» 5. Start investigating grey market supply and new distribution models.

» 6. Start losing control.

» 7. Reputation gone.

»

» We made the decision a while ago to turn away business rather than seek

» new suppliers in order to meet excess demand. We have a great relationship

» with both PCC and FOH members. I can't see how it would be strengthened by

» us seeking out new suppliers.

Right on, Rob.

I would add that a good business model would include contingency and responses to points #2 and beyond. Discipline against an onslaught of demand is hard to create in-situ if one is not already resolved to handle it in a specific manner.

Well done Czar-ists!

Wilkey

[CigarZen]

» This is a very big lesson for retailers such as ourselves. I am not

» pointing fingers at anyone albeit many members here know how I feel about

» (positively and negatively) major worldwide Habanos dealers.

»

» It is a temptation (to go ouside local Habanos s.a license holder) which

» tends to have the same ending.

»

» 1. Good Business Model including good service.

» 2. Explosion in demand.

» 3. Explosion in undercutting competitors

» 4. Need more stock at cheaper prices.

» 5. Start investigating grey market supply and new distribution models.

» 6. Start losing control.

» 7. Reputation gone.

»

» We made the decision a while ago to turn away business rather than seek

» new suppliers in order to meet excess demand. We have a great relationship

» with both PCC and FOH members. I can't see how it would be strengthened by

» us seeking out new suppliers.

»

» ***PS...no direct mentioning of retailers. Some would love nothing more

» than to launch a legal action***

We are MOST athankful for that!

[CigarZen]

As an aside, many years ago I did get some great cigars from this vendor, including some awesome Epi 2s, but they came over the pond.

That's just a shame.

[swl]

You are only as good as your worst partner or employee. Reputation takes years to build but only a few bad mishandled deals to lose.

» This is a very big lesson for retailers such as ourselves. I am not

» pointing fingers at anyone albeit many members here know how I feel about

» (positively and negatively) major worldwide Habanos dealers.

»

» It is a temptation (to go ouside local Habanos s.a license holder) which

» tends to have the same ending.

»

» 1. Good Business Model including good service.

» 2. Explosion in demand.

» 3. Explosion in undercutting competitors

» 4. Need more stock at cheaper prices.

» 5. Start investigating grey market supply and new distribution models.

» 6. Start losing control.

» 7. Reputation gone.

»

» We made the decision a while ago to turn away business rather than seek

» new suppliers in order to meet excess demand. We have a great relationship

» with both PCC and FOH members. I can't see how it would be strengthened by

» us seeking out new suppliers.

»

» ***PS...no direct mentioning of retailers. Some would love nothing more

» than to launch a legal action***

[sloth]

Oh damn... well I'll do my part and hunt down every "Doug" in Nebraska and punch them in the nose.

[Van55]

This particular guy is Doug Hiner of Omaha, Nebraska who was, for a time if not still, the U.S. based "fulfillment partner" of a UK vendor whose location is Wales (not London).

(The other UK vendor also has U.S. based fulfillment partners, but so far as I know the authenticitly of the product delivered thereby is not in question. He recently stopped advertising his product as 100% English Market Selection after having been confronted on another cigar bulletin board,)

Mr. Hiner offered to send me a free box of "Cuban" cigars of my choice to prove his bona fides. Whether the box of Esplendidos was genuine or not, I will never know., though the packaging appeared legit. Mr Hiner shipped to me with this box a handful of single cigars, one of which he claimed to be a Cohiba Behike that was rejected by the inspectors for inclusion in the limited humidors as well as other cigars bearing apparently authentic Cuban cigar bands but that he described as "specially forumulted" for him and his Welsh partner to have dark wrappers suited to the U.S. preference.

Under the circumstances I decided that I could not in good conscience keep the "free" cigars, so I sent them back to Mr. Hiner.

[El Presidente]

Nice work Van ;-)

[cobra]

As a little update, I had notified Habanos SA sometime ago and let them in on what happened. I don't know if that directly had any effect, but after I made the initial post here I checked back at the retailers web site and they no longer ofer a second price for buyers in the US.

[Ken Gargett]

i would have thought that any suggestion of a behike in any circumstances other than as one of the 100 boxes should set off alarm bells the size of big ben.

[Van55]

» i would have thought that any suggestion of a behike in any circumstances

» other than as one of the 100 boxes should set off alarm bells the size of

» big ben.

What makes you think it didn't???? That's part of the reason I sent the whole lot back to him.

[sloth]

Omaha, huh? I live just south from there. I find myself there quite a bit. Never heard the name before... but if I do...

I'm not a violent man.;-)

[Ken Gargett]

» » i would have thought that any suggestion of a behike in any

» circumstances

» » other than as one of the 100 boxes should set off alarm bells the size

» of

» » big ben.

»

» What makes you think it didn't???? That's part of the reason I sent the

» whole lot back to him.

that was just meant as a comment agreeing with rejecting the bloke, not as any criticism.