5x5 and age

[brettgross13]

Hello. I'm new here. I've been enjoying cigars for the last 2 years and I've been gradually becoming obsessed with cubans. I've finally got involved with buying boxes more seriously. However, I'm obviously still new. I've become more concerned lately with acquiring boxes with older dates on them. My latest pick up is a box of La Gloria Cubana Medaille d'Or no.1 dated 02 (haven't tried them yet). So I'm trying to navigate the issue of age. I don't have a very large humidor with long-aged boxes in it. Anyway...do you think it's worth it to buy a 5x5 box if it's 5-7 years old? Or would you say it's a waste, i.e. the cardboard is not good for the sticks (something about the contact of the oils with the cardboard) and 5 years in this format is not desirable in terms of aging? I take it one would want to get the sticks out of the cardboard and into a cedar setting for some months. Anyway, how about y'all? Does a 5-year old box in the 5x5 format tempt you? A related question: if you buy a smoke from a tobacco shop (which I do on occasion), do you pester the store people about box-age? My tobacconist here (in Japan), whom I trust, rather downplays age. He's a good guy who genuinely knows and loves cubans but I get the feeling that most customers are not asking him about which cigars have the best age on them. A related related question: I notice that he's quick to smoke limited and special releases (and people are quick to buy them). Wouldn't most connoisseurs hold onto these for age? I'm trying to understand the behavior of connoisseurs vis-a-vis aging so I can get the most of of my hobby (seeing as how it's difficult for me at this stage to buy cigars for very long term aging). Sorry for all these questions. I apologize in advance for my rather naive questions. I'm a novice and I really appreciate your indulgence. I'm really excited to get on the forum and really appreciative of the knowledge and expertise here. It's a privilege to join in!

[PigFish]

I don't think the cigar knows it lives in a cardboard box! While a dress box is wood it is lined with paper and it can absorb oils out of your cigar too. I am not really a believer in collector rules as it applies to how well your cigar will smoke. I have been known to buy cardboard boxed cigars any time the price point is right. I buy them based on price and the knowledge that the future for them is to become ash and satisfy my taste.

For the sake of an opposing view I do tend to remove too much cardboard from my humidors. Why? Because sealed airtight climate controlled humidors like I use can promote a mildew odor if allowed to get too moist. I believe that this odor originates in paper products. The cardboard as well as the paper in dress boxes are my primary culprits. I think if cardboard boxed cigars are not overly humidified and in the company of many other cigars that ware well ventilated such as a vendor's walk in, I would not worry about it.

Some years ago I bought a bunch of Siglo-3's in cardboard because the price was right. I have taken all those cigar out of the cardboard and put them into old lonsdale cab boxes. I kept them in their cardboard for some time and moved them at my leisure. The act was more to remove the cardboard from my sealed humidor than to remove the cigar from the cardboard! Just my 2cts.

Cardboard would not dissuade me from a cigar purchase. I think more about how the cigar increase my average smoking experience and what it will cost me to do it. Best of luck, -Piggy

[thechenman]

Welcome to FoH. You'll find a lot of useful information here. Piggy knows what he is talking about, but you will find varying views. For me, I do feel there are benefits to aging, but I don't feel that about all Cuban cigars. Some have more potential than others, but if you have the cash flow...then experiment. There are others who prefer to smoke their cigars young, to each his/her own. You need to smoke a variety and determine which direction your palate lies.

[El Presidente]

Some of the greatest cigars I have had have been vintage Davidoff No 1's in 5x5's.

If the cigars are great, don't sweat on the packaging

[brettgross13]

Thanks for taking the time to reply to my post. I really appreciate it. I'm really happy to join this forum. I'm pretty alone in this hobby where I am. I had a good friend who smoked stogies with me, but he left the country. Somehow, it's more fun to share the experience. But I seem to spend a lot of time thinking about cuban cigars these days. About year ago, I was convinced that non-cubans were just as enjoyable as cubans. These days, I've completely lost interest in non-cubans. Anyway, I actually don't have the resources to keep a lot of cigars for aging. Hence, I've been focusing on box-dates. It's good to hear that some people smoke young cigars. I've been under the impression that all cubans have to be substantially aged. Honestly, I have some cigars in my humidor (Bolivar Petit Corona, Hoya De Monterrey Epicure number 2, Partagas serie d 4, Vegas Robaina Famosos) that are pretty young. I'm just not going to be able to wait years for these. But I have been making a conscious effort to look for deals with older box-dates. Do you think that that's wise? I've seen some 5x5 deals with years on them.

Again, thanks for your answers.

[brettgross13]

One more thing I wanted to ask was...are there any particular cigars that people think are good young smokes?

[thechenman]

There are several smokes that I have found to smoke will young:

El Rey del Mundo Choix Supreme

Fonseca No. 1

H. Upmann Magnum 50

Hoyo de Monterrey Epicure Especial

Montecristo No. 2

Montecristo Edmundo

MontecristoPetit Edmundo

Partagas Lusitania

Partagas Serie D. No. 4

Partagas Shorts Shorts

Romeo y Julieta Wide Churchill

San Cristobal de La Habana El Principe

Trinidad Robusto T

Trinidad Reyes

Vegas Robaina Unicos

All of these have smoked well for me young. I'm sure I missed a few, but this list is pretty complete in terms of what I have been smoking. I hope you find something that you really like among these cigars and have the same luck I did.

Box codes are not all that important IMHO, but there are others that have differing opinions. El Pres recently ran a blind taste test on FoH that I think pretty much exemplifies my statement.

As far as years go...Cuban cigars use tobacco from different years in their blend. The tobacco used in the standard production cigars are not aged as long as NCs are, so many believe CCs beneift from additional aging in the box, where NCs are good to smoke ROTB. This is all personal preference in my opinion. In terms of some years being better than others...that can be true, for both quality of tobacco and construction. A lot of the vintage cigars you find out there now are from 2000 and 2001 which are years taht are notorious for construction problems. That is why cigars from this period can still be found at very reasonable prices. I don't think you need to focus on these really old boxes though. Cigars from 2007, 2008, 2009 and 2010 have all been smoking exceptionally well. I would focus on these.

[PigFish]

Mate... you have asked the questions that without a doubt, besides gun control and whale hunting (this is board humor) have defined this board and many a CC consumers conversation. You are not going to learn it all in one day! And what is there to learn anyway? Why my tastes differ from yours? Which one of us is right? Hints and opinions are great amigo but the last stop for any one of your cigars in your palate, not mine!

Are there better cigars to smoke young? Read and ask some others but ferret out the BS as there are not hard and fast rules in this endeavor. Learn, gather knowledge, explore hints, but don't follow another. No gurus here, not by my account anyway! The rules change year in and year out and my rule is another's taboo. It is just the way it works.

I smoke few cigars now under 5 years of age. Not because I am something special, because it is what I have stocked and what I like to smoke. Don't let age fool you. Get a box you are interested in and smoke them if they are good. Hold them for a while if you think age will improve them. It is pretty simple! If your tastes follow that of the majority, you will find many cigars to like and many that smoke well young.

Don't over humidify your cigars. The young taste (some of at least), the bitter and acrid I often attribute to too much moisture in your cigar. These don't store like NC's and smoke better when dried out a bit. I will leave it to relative terms for you to explore more on your own. We have a search function here and there are a lot of years of smoking under the collective belts of the folks around here.

The topics are fried, baked and frozen just to be thawed again with a new crop of members so there is a lot of data on the board already. Look over the opinons on the daily smoke thread for some hints on what people like. There is also a review forum for more detailed comments. Bwana, Rob, H S Ayala, El Prez,, our generous host and patron merchant has a good bead on what is smoking well in his mind, albeit a twisted one!!! He looks through a lot of stock so he can help you out if your are looking for newer vintage purchases and occasionally some others. He might even be a guide to the best little ***** house in Havana!

Cheers mate, enjoy the forum. Your resident Pig. -