My own, very personal take on this forum

[MontrealRon]

As this forum was conceived in the discussion between several of us on a thread initially about JLPs,

I thought that I would copy and paste one of my posts that, IMHO, could define the target, and the limitations, of this new forum.

For those wanting a fuller picture, please take a look at the original thread.

Basically, we were looking for a way to bring attention to those lower level Cuban cigars that tend to fly under the radar, and for which very little info has been available on this site.

Many smokers, for one reason or another, are on a tight budget.

Others might just want a broader perspective on a neglected aspect of their hobby.

This forum will be dedicated to short reviews, discussion and commentary of those "cheap and cheerful",

as well as the not-so-cheerful, lower priced Cuban cigars.

Threads in the "water hole" quickly go stale, and are lost in the distance.

This should become an easily accessible reference for those wanting guidance in this area.

So how do we define the category?

In my opinion, price should have no relevance.

(In the sense of a set price limit).

For one thing, prices can vary wildly according to our sources and locations.

I would exclude from consideration all cigars that were hand-made long filler before 2002.

So, no minutos, perlas, entreactos, etc.

Reviews and commentary on these cigars would remain in the existing forums.

Included would be all machine-made cigars prior to 2002, as well as their hand-finished variants;

their surviving post-2002 hand-made reincarnations; all Tripa Corta cigars;

and, perhaps, if we want to include the "third tier",

the current production of the ICT factory, all machine-made :

the Puritos, Clubs, and Minis, as well as the dreaded Guantanameras.

These products are not considered as "Habanos", nor are the "fourth tier",

the local market "peso cigars", yet all are 100% pure Cuban tobacco.

As this is, after all, the Friends of Habanos, my personal recommendation would be to exclude any

non-Cuban cigars.

So, brothers, now we have our new playground.

Let's have some fun!

[stargazer14]

Well said Ron.

An additional way to look at this forum would be for those cigars we might be embarrassed to admit we smoke, and enjoy,

for fear of being looked down upon by the 'big boys'.

But fear not, your secret is safe in here.

[gfoster]

Well said Ron.

An additional way to look at this forum would be for those cigars we might be embarrassed to admit we smoke, and enjoy,

for fear of being looked down upon by the 'big boys'.

But fear not, your secret is safe in here.

Uhm, I enjoyed the montecristo opens. That's about as low as you can go I think

Personally, I'm curious about both the RASCC and the lunch club. I figure those both fit into the "cheap and cheerful" category? I haven't tried either one but have been wanting to. Any feedback on those?

-- Gary F.

[MontrealRon]

Uhm, I enjoyed the montecristo opens. That's about as low as you can go I think

Personally, I'm curious about both the RASCC and the lunch club. I figure those both fit into the "cheap and cheerful" category? I haven't tried either one but have been wanting to. Any feedback on those?

-- Gary F.

Hi, Gary -

We are still trying to develop a consensus of what to include in this forum,

since, at least so far, our benevolent ruler is allowing us to play without supervision.

By my personal definition, though, neither the RASCC nor the Lunch Club belongs here,

as these have always been "first tier" cigars, i.e. hand-made long-filler.

They are only cheaper because they are smaller.

However a box of RASCC, for example, is still more expensive than a box of either

Super Partagas or R&J Coronitas en Cedro, both of which are larger cigars.

These two used to be machine-made, but are now hand-made.

Their price still reflects their lower status, even in the new versions.

This is one reason why these "second-tier" cigars can be such a relative bargain,

and why smokers looking to save money should focus more on this rather extensive category.

Once again, all this is simply my own opinion.

In time, this forum will become whatever the community finds most useful.

[gfoster]

Ok well then I guess today isn't my best day on record for positive contributions. I think I'll just sit back and keep my mouth shut until I can get the taste of shoe leather out of my mouth

-- Gary F.

[jfury76]

Well I for one am not above smoking a current La Flor De Cano Selecto when cutting the grass or in a similar situation where quality does not have to be paramount. For those of you who have partaken of this one, you will know that it is quite one-dimensional and floral. Not bad at all considering the price.

[MontrealRon]

Well I for one am not above smoking a current La Flor De Cano Selecto when cutting the grass or in a similar situation where quality does not have to be paramount. For those of you who have partaken of this one, you will know that it is quite one-dimensional and floral. Not bad at all considering the price.

I'm currently smoking from two boxes of these, one from late '09, one from '98.

The babies are quite good, though very simple.

These are some of the lightest-bodied smokes ever.

The 98's, hand-finished machine-mades, are very similar, but way more complex and tasty.

The ultimate proof that a cigar does not have to be strong to age well.

[demiurgic]

Well said Ron, and after reading what you have to say about which cigars should be in here, I agree with leaving RASCC out since it's really a first tier cigar.

However, I wonder if there are enough people who even know what the list reads like, the list of post 2002-present of which cigars are considered 'Second Tier'?

I think this should clear things up for most people.

Let's see if this category of cigars holds up to the almost cohort priced Minutos, Perlas, PC's.

Definately an interesting project!!

[dheppler]

I'm so glad to see this started! I have been in search of some reviews of this caliber.

I am tired of sitting down with a friend or two in hopes of enjoying a cigar with them only to have them leave over half sitting in the ash tray! I have no reservations to sharing, just hate the waste.

It would be nice to find something "cheap and cheerful" that I can enjoy and still not care if they want to throw half out.

Dan

[thechenman]

In all honesty I am not totally familar with this group of cigars, but am not opposed to learning more about it. I understand how you would like the thread to evolve over time to suit the needs/desires of the community here at FOH, but as you few are the founders of this thread, maybe the rest of us could impose on you few to provide a list that perhaps is drawn from a consensus of your opinions as to what cigars you think best fit into this category. I for one think it would help me in classifying and tracking down these smokes you intend to review. Just my two cents.

[reg]

Shouldn't be too hard to set some type of guidelines, some kind of max price per size. The hard part is going through which cigars are worth trying, and which aren't. I think it would be just as helpful to see which cigars are not any good, instead of just the good ones, and wondering about the others

[Ellery]

I too am not familiar with these "second tier" cigars. Just as chenman posted, I would be interested in a list of these cigars.

[MontrealRon]

I too am not familiar with these "second tier" cigars. Just as chenman posted, I would be interested in a list of these cigars.

Ask, and you shall be given;

seek, and you shall find...

Check the new thread...

[MontrealRon]

Shouldn't be too hard to set some type of guidelines, some kind of max price per size. The hard part is going through which cigars are worth trying, and which aren't. I think it would be just as helpful to see which cigars are not any good, instead of just the good ones, and wondering about the others

Are there really any, or many, that are not any good?

Other than Guantanamera, a total failure in the opinions of most smokers,

these cigars usually have their loyal followings, while others detest them.

Look at the recent comments re the JLP Petit Caz.

Some are mild, some strong, some even over-the-top strong.

Aging is also a major factor.

As those of us who smoke these cigars give short reviews and comments,

this will help others determine what might be interesting to try.

[jacksfull]

I'm currently smoking from two boxes of these, one from late '09, one from '98.

The babies are quite good, though very simple.

These are some of the lightest-bodied smokes ever.

The 98's, hand-finished machine-mades, are very similar, but way more complex and tasty.

The ultimate proof that a cigar does not have to be strong to age well.

Many thanks for the insight. I've been very curious about just this very comparo (older MM Selectos to later TC version of the same).

I found a deal on some LFdC Selectos and ordered them without being quite sure if they were newer production or older. It turned out they are MM's from Mar '97 (box code OUSC-TLP). I had been quite a while since I smoked this brand until these came my way, so I still have yet to try one of the later TC versions.

The MM Selectos I got are OK, but just OK (though to be fair, I've only smoked five of them so far). Closest thing I currently have to compare to is a box of May '08 JLP Cremas, which I found tastier. I was actually hoping to hear that the LFdC handmade TC's are superior. I've been tempted to add some to orders several times, but always seem to end up gravitating to other items. Sounds like I should smoke on through the MM's before deciding.