Professor Twain Posted February 24, 2007 Share Posted February 24, 2007 Background: I’ve been using a wine refrigerator to store my cigars. I have the Haier 30 bottle model. Since I live in Florida I wanted to have the temperature control feature, and this fridge also has a large capacity. I have somewhere around 50 boxes in it and it is pretty full but not jam packed. I have two Oust fans that have good batteries, and that cycle off and on as they should (alternating 5 minutes on, 15 minutes off). I have a little over 2.5 pounds of Heartfelt beads distributed in the fridge in panty hose sausages. I have been interested in testing out how well the fridge does in maintaining stable temperature and humidity since most people believe that this is vital in storing cigars. In the past I have put my digital hygrometer in the fridge in different locations, and monitored the readings through the glass door. I saw pretty marked variation between the lower and top shelves (higher humidity down below) and also lots of fluctuations in humidity as the fridge clicked on. But I wanted to see whether the humidity and temperature inside of my boxes might be more stable, and get a more accurate reading on the storage conditions inside of the fridge. Equipment: I was able to get a Radio Shack system with a base unit and three wireless remote digital sensors (thanks to the generosity of Kornazoo who found me a set—they are no longer widely available) and have recently conducted some tests of my fridge. The base unit monitors the three sensors on different radio channels so I can easily sit at my desk and flip through the readings on the three sensors. I was able to determine that my three wireless sensors all read within half a degree of temperature of each other, and within one percent humidity, when I put them side by side on a table. They are also pretty close to my other digital hygrometers. So I think that the readings that I report below are reasonable indicators of what is going on in my fridge. Methods: I placed the sensors in cabinets and dress boxes near the top, middle, and lower parts of the fridge, and then recorded the temperature and humidity as the fridge cycled through its temperature changes. I have the fridge set at 65 degrees, and the cooling cycle reliably flips on when the digital temperature gauge on the front of the fridge shows 67 degrees. I monitored the humidity and temperature readings on the remote sensors, and on the fridge, over about a 45 minute period (measures taken about every 5 minutes). I found that this cycle reliably repeats itself every 45 minutes or so. Results: I found that: The overall fridge temperature (as shown on the digital readout on the fridge) varied from 59 to 67 degrees. The remote sensor in a box near the top of the fridge maintained a steady reading (plus or minus 1 degree and 1 percent) of 69 degrees and 55 percent humidity throughout the 45 minute test. The sensor in a box in the middle of the fridge showed fluctuation in temperature between 58 and 60 degrees, and varied between 72 and 77 percent humidity throughout the test. Higher humidity occurred when the overall fridge temperature was 66 or 67 degrees, lower humidity occurred when the fridge was down to 60 degrees. The sensor in a box on the lowest shelf remained steady at about 63 degrees and 72 percent humidity throughout the test. Comments: Checking the temperature and humidity inside of boxes shows that they remain pretty stable at the top and bottom even as the fridge cycles through its cooling process. The middle part of the fridge showed minor temperature fluctuation but a 5 percent humidity fluctuation. But there is a marked difference in the stable temperatures and humidity at the top and bottom of the fridge. Perhaps this variability would be decreased if I used a more powerful fan (the Oust fans have very little power). I’m not sure whether the discrepancy between top and bottom, or variability in humidity in the middle section, are serious enough to be a concern for maintaining my cigars. I’d welcome opinions about this from folks who have more experience in long term storage of cigars. For now, I am rotating boxes to different levels in the fridge every few weeks, and I generally pull the cigars that I am going to smoke out of the fridge and into my desktop humidor (which stays right at about 62 percent humidity) before I smoke them. I’ll be curious as to what others have to say about these results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB24 Posted February 24, 2007 Share Posted February 24, 2007 » I’ll be curious as to what others have to say about these results. Prof., I have a wine coolidor from Haier also and I think it is the 28-32 bottle size. It does not have the digital temp and humidity readings but has a knob on the back that I can turn for higher or lower temps. Usually the bottom is cooler than the top and this purpose is for the red and white wine needs tobe stored at different temps. During the winter I dont need to have the wine cooler plugged in because we maintain around a 70 deg temp out here in Cali +/- a few degrees. Right now I have exactly 65/65 but that is not always the case. During the summer time when the cooler is plugged in I would say that the tops remains around 66deg/60rH, the middle is around 62/59, and the bottom is around 58/56. Having the cooler on def takes away the humidity. I have about 2 lbs of beads in there also. I have never tested inside of the boxes though. I would have to agree they remain stable even though the temp/rH might change a few points. I am actually starting to look at the Aristocrat DX or the Aristocrat End Table with the set and forget. I just don't want to have to worry about always maintaining exactly 65/65. How nice would it be to set it at 65/65 and never think twice about it? Hope this helps or proves what you tested. Have a nice day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccsmoker Posted February 24, 2007 Share Posted February 24, 2007 It sounds pretty good.Humidity will aiways be higher in the bottom, because it is heavier than air.If you want to distribute it more evenly you can buy a computor fan an mount it on the middle shelf and face it towards the top of the humi so it will pull the moist air to the top.;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VigorishSLC Posted February 24, 2007 Share Posted February 24, 2007 Hey Professor. Here are some ideas for you. The best thing you can possibly do to maintain accurate, stable temp within the fridge is use an external temperature controller, typically used in home brewing. This is a much more precise unit and can be programmed to maintain temp plus or minus 1 degree. They go for less than $100. I also installed an a/c computer fan. This is a MUCH more powerful fan than the oust fans...it's downright windy in there when the fan is on! My fan is on the middle shelf and points at the back wall. I've found this to be the best positioning because it helps dissipation of condensation on back wall when the cooling unit kicks on. Hope this helps....feel free to contact me for more info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wp2 Posted February 25, 2007 Share Posted February 25, 2007 Prof: 1st of all, great post! Lots of good info for those of us who use wine coolerdors (I use one because my Mini is full). I use a computer cooling fan to distribute the humid air & it really blows it around. You can get one for about $10. Just wire it to the transformer & you're in business. 2nd of all, 50 boxes!!! Damn, sounds like Tampa has been just as bad an influence on you as he has on me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB24 Posted February 25, 2007 Share Posted February 25, 2007 » 2nd of all, 50 boxes!!! Damn, sounds like Tampa has been just as bad an » influence on you as he has on me. I 2nd that. Tampa might be the reason for a future divorce! HAHAHAH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfe Tone Posted February 25, 2007 Share Posted February 25, 2007 ». I want first dibs on the cooler when you get your Aristocrat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Professor Twain Posted February 25, 2007 Author Share Posted February 25, 2007 Thanks to all for your suggestions. I will post followup measurements as I make improvements to my system. I'll be adding some more beads in the lower shelves, and dumping the Oust fans and getting a computer fan. It will be interesting to be able to measure the changes with each improvement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Professor Twain Posted February 25, 2007 Author Share Posted February 25, 2007 » ». » I want first dibs on the cooler when you get your Aristocrat. No need, I'm letting Rob and Lisa store some of my stock, and I have a good friend with an Aristocrat who I give the occasional Culebra to for rent. And I am fine tuning my cooler like a teenager fooling around with his hot rod. And please, NOBODY TELL MRS. TWAIN I HAVE 50 BOXES. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB24 Posted February 25, 2007 Share Posted February 25, 2007 » » ». » » I want first dibs on the cooler when you get your Aristocrat. » » No need, I'm letting Rob and Lisa store some of my stock, and I have a » good friend with an Aristocrat who I give the occasional Culebra to for » rent. And I am fine tuning my cooler like a teenager fooling around with » his hot rod. » » And please, NOBODY TELL MRS. TWAIN I HAVE 50 BOXES. Prof., Do you have an Aristocrat or are you planning on getting one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Professor Twain Posted February 25, 2007 Author Share Posted February 25, 2007 » Prof., » » Do you have an Aristocrat or are you planning on getting one? Famous last words, but I am determined to stick with my fridge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
n2advnture Posted February 25, 2007 Share Posted February 25, 2007 A key note that should be considered is if these model wine chillers are compressor units or thermoelectric units. The compressor units tend to create wider temp swings than the thermoelectric units. The use of a timer and a "johnson's temp. controller" may also help prevent the compressor coming on more times than needed to maintain whatever temp you are looking to maintain. Hope this helps ~Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justinphilly Posted February 25, 2007 Share Posted February 25, 2007 I CANNOT imagine NOT using a temperature controller.. There really isnt a wine fridge that is designed to keep wine in the mid 60's.. sure some can run high, but when the compressor or whatever coolant switches on, its gonna blast it down to the normal temperature. red wine is supposed to be served anywhere between 60-65 degrees. but, not alot of wine fridges can maintain that temperature regularly. wine fridges are more designed for white wine which is served at 50 degrees (a little warm for me, imo) the johnson controller in my opinion is the MOST vital part of the fridgeador.. thermo-electric or compresor style cooler, it doesnt matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wp2 Posted February 25, 2007 Share Posted February 25, 2007 » » ». » » » » And please, NOBODY TELL MRS. TWAIN I HAVE 50 BOXES. LMAO Prof!!! Reminds me of the time Bunker told my wife she was great for letting me spend $500 for cigars. Then he quickly added "that's for 5 boxes." :-D BTW, if 1 computer fan doesn't move the air, try 2. They're cheap, I got mine at Staples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colt45 Posted February 25, 2007 Share Posted February 25, 2007 » I’m not sure whether the discrepancy between top and bottom, or » variability in humidity in the middle section, are serious enough » to be a concern for maintaining my cigars. It would be for me - mainly the 55% reading. Specifically, I'd be concerned about losing oils, though I certainly don't know at what humidity level this starts to happen. Another concern would be how rapidly these changes in climate occur. Very gradual changes would not bother me much, but rapid swings would be cause for concern. Having said all this, if you aren't really having any trouble, my post is rather moot. Thanks for taking the time to share your findings, and good luck with the improvements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kodiakbr Posted February 26, 2007 Share Posted February 26, 2007 Great Post Professor Thanx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Professor Twain Posted March 5, 2007 Author Share Posted March 5, 2007 FURTHER UPDATE After writing up my previous test, I was heading out of town for a week. So instead of making any major changes, I tried shifting my lower level boxes and beads (with high humidity) to the top of the fridge, and shifting the top level boxes (with lower humidity) to the bottom. I had not been making major systematic shifts before. Upon my return, I see that my humidity is much more consistent throughout the fridge. Still usng remote sensors inside of boxes, I am now getting: Top--64 degrees, 68% Middle--62 degrees, 65% Bottom--62 degrees, 68% So--this suggests that a good routine of rotating boxes might be an easy solution to the humidity stratification that I was getting before. I'll keep updating on this little Weird Science experiment. Note, I may still look at some of the other changes recommended, like a more powerful fan... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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