Question about low temperature

[Jbhunter223]

So I’ve searched the forum and didn’t really find a definite answer, and maybe this will yield the same results but I’ll ask anyway.  I have two wineadors. One sits upstairs in the bedroom, and one in the basement.  Neither are plugged in or running. The one in the basement sits around 55-57 degrees Fahrenheit.  Is that too low!?  The RH sits around 64-65% if that helps.
 

thanks! 
-Jayme 

[Derboesekoenig]

In my personal experience (which isn't very long), I find that under 70* and over 62 works out pretty well, but there are other variables. I shoot for 63-65, and 63-66 rH. @PigFish is the resident hygroscopic effects expert. Maybe he can chime in

[PigFish]

How do your cigars smoke? In my world, they would end up too wet.

Rob refrigerates his cigars. He appears to have no problems. He controls a lot of cigars.

I frown on temps like this. Here is one type of problem with consumer storage of cigars at this temp. If you open a 50ish F space to a 75ish temp space that is say 75rH, you are going to get micro condensation over just about every surface in the humidor. I can prove this to you. It is a matter of dew point. If you watch real time air exchanges in a sensitive controlled humidor, you will notice a flood of water hit your sensor when you open the controlled space. Unless you can actively dehumidify, you are really screwed with high rH in short order. This is just one sample.

Cold temps, lock up water in cigars. If your cigars happen to be too wet from a vendor, and you drop it in a cold space, you may just get mold.

The only time I have had mold in one of my humidors is when I let a humidifier overflow and soak a box of BBFs. I mean the box was swimming in a pool of water. This was not humidor error, it was human error. I thought I saw the water line low in the humidifier. I was wrong!!!

My humidors recycle water. They actually collect free excess water from a working humidor that is gained from a high exterior ambient, from air exchanges. That water goes somewhere and in my humidor it ends up in the humidifier for reuse. If I have a hot humid summer in the shop, I have to empty my humidifier in my humidors at least once a season. The humidor actually collects water instead of using it... It is all apart of active humidor administration.

Use what works for you. Just be mindful of mold. I think you are trending on hallowed ground here, but that is just my opinion.

Cheers -Piggy

[Jbhunter223]

@PigFish  I appreciate your response!   So far I have no mold issues. And I don’t smoke much over the winter so I really don’t know how the sticks stores in the basement are smoking.  I think I’ll have to grab something and see how it goes. Now that I think about it when I take sticks out and check them the don’t make a slight crackle like my sticks do at the higher temps. Sounds like I need to move it or get the basement warmer.  But I’ll try a stick or 2 to see what they’re like!  
 

Thanks!

[Jbhunter223]

@PigFish  possible dumb question.   Would there be a way to warm the inside of a wine fridge without creating more problems?  I’m just assuming if the inside was 10 or so degrees warmer that the outside environment that would just cause more issues? 

[PigFish]

Heat rarely creates a mold problem for cigars, despite rumors to the contrary. Heat will displace water from your cigar. It makes the cigar exchange water more freely, and that means that water content can change more rapidly. It really is rapidly cooling, or cold cigars that typically will generate surface mold.

Yes, there is. Stego and others make enclosure heaters that you can use. Your issue with an enclosure heater will not be the heater itself, the but precision control of the appliance and the circulation of the heated air throughout the box.

Today I use various heating elements, and have moved to make my own heat exchanger (heat sinks) to work them into a small circulation duct. This is actually a lot of work and it is costly. This is what happens when someone else does not make exactly what you want! Furthermore, I use a PLC to control the temperature, the unit sensor along with empirical testing of specific units and timed on/off cycles to make sure the heater does not overheat the duct.

You don't want your cigars in an 'EasyBake' oven. You want to be careful with a heater. Don't go looking for items over 20 to 30 watts. Typically I am using about 15! It does not make much to heat a nicely insulated small space. You don't need it fast, you want it controlled. There will always be a hysteresis with heaters as with other climate controlled devices. You need to empirically test their response, start and stop cycle heat curves in your own humidor to see how they are working.

There are 'accidental' system and controlled systems. Accidental systems can work if they are held to small deviations in ambient. You could perhaps purchase a 12VDC engine block heater and stick it to the bottom side of your cooler. Running it a few minutes in an hour could be a nice accidental system if you monitor it. However two or three warm days in a row without turning off the heater can have your cigars in a sauna.

Issue two here would be the overheating of the cigars by accident, cooking out water, and then allowing that water to condense in the confined space before the cigars can take the water back. This is what can happen potentially causing 'travel sickness.' I don't like the term and have dubbed the problem 'water migration issues.' Travel sickness is a misnomer, water migration is the core issue. Mold can happen with cigars that would not be moldy if not for water migration. I know this does not make sense on face value. Water concentration in specific parts of the cigar can and will cause mold. Water migration is real, is caused by rapid temp changes, and the natural hysteresis of tobacco.

If you take a balanced EMC cigar. Run it thought rapid heat changes in the right order, cook out the internal water, allow that water to condense on the wrapper, you get a cigar that was perfectly conditioned to generate mold.

Good luck. -R