Romeo y Julieta Petit Royales Authenticity Check

[RichG]

Afternoon Gents,

I recently received two boxes of Petit Royales from FoH and two from another vendor. 

I just looked at all four boxes together and got a big surprise regarding some sizing differences. 

To begin with...I don't question the provenance of the FoH box, and I am using it as a baseline for comparison...but I do question the other vendor. 

In all images FoH are on the right...other vendor on the left. In cases where this is not applicable, the Spanish sticker is from the other vendor (referred to below as "The Spanish Box"). 

Should I find the following concerning, and request a refund, or Cuba being Cuba:

1. The main label on the top of the box is scaled extremely differently. FoH is the smaller of the two. I can't find any images online substantiating this larger label scaling on the Spanish box.
2. The FoH box dimension is a different size than the Spanish box. It is approximately 1/4" taller and deeper than the Spanish box, but they are approximately the same width. 
3. All four authenticity stickers have black light markings. 
4. All four serial numbers come up as Wide Churchill Gran Res Cos 2009, so no revelations there. 
5. This is the one that I am really hung up on...the Habanos brand on the Spanish box is about 17% larger than on Rob's box. I measured the length of the rectangle with the round ends encircling "Hecho En Cuba" on a random cross-section of boxes, and I am getting 2 1/4" on all of them. The Spanish box measures 2 5/8". 

I had questions about another item from this vendor in the past. I resolved that I would never buy expensive (Cohiba) cigars from them again. Now I am questioning whether I should have bought cheap cigars either. 

Any opinions would be much appreciated. 

Thank you,

Rich

 

 

 

[RichG]

I just remembered that we are smoking cigars here and not boxes...so I took some pics of those too. Also threw some additional interior box shot in there too.

FOH on the right...all longer than Spanish. 

[Cairo]

If these were high-end Cohibas I would be concerned.

But--context is everything.   I think these are fine--just hard to imagine anybody would fake these--and I have not seen them faked (and I follow a lot of the fake cigar threads on reddit).

[RichG]

1 hour ago, Cairo said:

If these were high-end Cohibas I would be concerned.

But--context is everything.   I think these are fine--just hard to imagine anybody would fake these--and I have not seen them faked (and I follow a lot of the fake cigar threads on reddit).

I hear you on the unlikeliness of someone faking Petit Royales, but is the different sized brand stamped on the back of the box not concerning? Should a stamped brand not be uniform size?

For what its worth...the smokes in question smell rather fantastic. I find some of these differences odd, and was wondering if others found them within the boundaries of Cuba being Cuba. 

[Meesterjojo]

4 hours ago, Cairo said:

If these were high-end Cohibas I would be concerned.

But--context is everything.   I think these are fine--just hard to imagine anybody would fake these--and I have not seen them faked (and I follow a lot of the fake cigar threads on reddit).

People can and will fake everything. 

 

Browse alibaba and see the bands and labels they're producing. You'll start questioning everything even from an lcdh. It's scary good.

 

5 hours ago, RichG-LI-NY said:

I just remembered that we are smoking cigars here and not boxes...so I took some pics of those too. Also threw some additional interior box shot in there too.

FOH on the right...all longer than Spanish.

The sticks look good to me. But the box differences are interesting. 

There's only two grey market vendors I sorta kinda trust. Beyond that I'd suggest it could be regional differences in boxes.

I read somewhere, and forgive me for not having the source, though I believe it was reddit and a link therein, that speculated spain ad being the absolute worst for selling fakes. Hearsay, I know.

[Bijan]

10 hours ago, RichG-LI-NY said:

All four serial numbers come up as Wide Churchill Gran Res Cos 2009, so no revelations there. 

This is a known issue with this cigar. There are a few threads already on the suspect cigar forum on this topic.

 

[Bijan]

10 hours ago, RichG-LI-NY said:

The main label on the top of the box is scaled extremely differently. FoH is the smaller of the two. I can't find any images online substantiating this larger label scaling on the Spanish box.

There was a redesign of HUHC in the same vein, older was bigger logo, newer was smaller logo. I'll check my boxes of Petit Royales to see which version I have.

 

10 hours ago, RichG-LI-NY said:

This is the one that I am really hung up on...the Habanos brand on the Spanish box is about 17% larger than on Rob's box. I measured the length of the rectangle with the round ends encircling "Hecho En Cuba" on a random cross-section of boxes, and I am getting 2 1/4" on all of them. The Spanish box measures 2 5/8". 

I'll take a look at my boxes to see if I notice this. But this is the thing I would be least worried about.

[Bijan]

Don't know if I got the same vendor but I think I got the same box code.

I have two boxes.

Here's the photo.

Only thing wrong with the cigars was that they were overhumified.

[RichG]

9 hours ago, Bijan said:

This is a known issue with this cigar. There are a few threads already on the suspect cigar forum on this topic.

I thought I recalled this being a known issue. Since Robs boxes came back the same way I presumed it to be a non-issue. 

 

9 hours ago, Bijan said:

There was a redesign of HUHC in the same vein, older was bigger logo, newer was smaller logo. I'll check my boxes of Petit Royales to see which version I have.

 

That is really interesting news. My boxes are only five months apart, but that is a very good explanation in sizing differences for the box graphics. Do you recall source for this info. 

 

9 hours ago, Bijan said:

I'll take a look at my boxes to see if I notice this. But this is the thing I would be least worried about.

Shouldn't the box branding stamp be uniformly sized? I think its odd that there are two brands 17% different in size, but perhaps I am being paranoid. I didn't get into a large swath of boxes...but I grabbed about six to ten and the branding stamp all measured the same as FoH Royales. The exception to this was a box of PL Galanes that had two small double stamps. I noticed this on someone elses Galanes box on the Recent Purchases thread as well. 

 

9 hours ago, Bijan said:

Don't know if I got the same vendor but I think I got the same box code.

I have two boxes.

Here's the photo.

Only thing wrong with the cigars was that they were overhumified.

I am sure we got the same exact twofer deal, shipped with 72% Boveda. I'm no expert in any way, but in my estimation they smell almost identical to the FoH boxes. Have you smoked any yet, and if so, do they ring true to good RyJ character?

[Mickey D]

The transit stamp is in place under the security seal, that’s a plus.

i don’t see anything to be concerned with visually. I’d chalk it up to regional differences.

enjoy!

[Bijan]

9 hours ago, RichG-LI-NY said:

I am sure we got the same exact twofer deal, shipped with 72% Boveda. I'm no expert in any way, but in my estimation they smell almost identical to the FoH boxes. Have you smoked any yet, and if so, do they ring true to good RyJ character?

I got mine back in December. Most likely same vendor different two box sale. They were too humid. I think they seemed ok except being too humid. I'll revisit soon to see how they are doing.

 

9 hours ago, RichG-LI-NY said:

That is really interesting news. My boxes are only five months apart, but that is a very good explanation in sizing differences for the box graphics. Do you recall source for this info. 

This was on the latest CC purchase thread a few months back.

 

9 hours ago, RichG-LI-NY said:

Shouldn't the box branding stamp be uniformly sized? I think its odd that there are two brands 17% different in size, but perhaps I am being paranoid. I didn't get into a large swath of boxes...but I grabbed about six to ten and the branding stamp all measured the same as FoH Royales. The exception to this was a box of PL Galanes that had two small double stamps. I noticed this on someone elses Galanes box on the Recent Purchases thread as well. 

If you're talking about the habanos sticker in the corner I'd assume they have different ones for different box types and they just used the wrong one because they ran out of the right ones. Happens with bands all the time. They'll use big bands on small cigars and cut the ends off.

[RichG]

8 minutes ago, Bijan said:

If you're talking about the habanos sticker in the corner I'd assume they have different ones for different box types and they just used the wrong one because they ran out of the right ones. Happens with bands all the time. They'll use big bands on small cigars and cut the ends off.

I’m referring to the recessed Habanos branding stamp on the bottom of the boxes. The one that is imprinted in addition to being stamped black.

 

[Corylax18]

I'm not sure what "Regional" difference people are talking about. The cigars are boxed in Cuba, not by the regional distributor. Different distributors may get different runs of cigars, that may have slight packing differences, but the differences don't originate or stay consistent by region. Spain does some re stickering and repacking into other boxes or jars, but those cigars are all pulled from standard HSA packaging after they've left the island.

@RichG-LI-NY I'm guessing you haven't ventured down to Cuba your self yet? It doesn't take long into our first visit to realize things are just different down there. Very different. What may seem unacceptable to you or I, is simply standard down there. They dont have extra's, so if they mess up, we get to see the results. QC is really a farce down there, for cigars and packaging. The attached photo is of the "QC" room at El Laguito, 2 of the three women where sleeping. Haha It doesn't get any better as you move down. 

The fancier bands and some of the fancier boxes are made in the Netherlands, but not stuff at this level. Cuba opened their own brand new Box factory on the island a couple years ago, these boxes look to me like they came from that factory. As bizarre as it may seem, I wouldn't be worried about the packaging differences, at all. Its just Cuba being Cuba. They have different size stamps/brands for different size boxes, the guy probably just grabbed the wrong one at the beginning of that shift. I dont know how they would build the boxes different sizes, but it doesn't surprise me. I don't think have anything to worry about regarding authenticity. Smoke em!!

[RichG]

@Corylax18 I appreciate the detailed response. It seemed a bit of a stretch that someone would fake Petit Royales...but you never know. It felt really weird to me when I put the four boxes together and saw what I thought were significant differences. 

In answer to your question, no, I have not had the opportunity to go to Cuba yet, as I have only been smoking cigars since last fall. As you can likely surmise from this four box purchase, I have fallen rather deeply into the hobby over this short time. 

I love the photo...El Laguito, top of the food chain...I picture Jack Nicholson popping up and saying..."What if this is as good as it gets?".

Even with my limited experience I have smoked enough RyJ to tell if these are real. I will proceed as you advise and give them a go. 

It's a good reminder for me of the fundamental difference between 90% faith or 100% faith in a vendor. 

[Chas.Alpha]

On 8/5/2021 at 11:12 AM, RichG-LI-NY said:

It's a good reminder for me of the fundamental difference between 90% faith or 100% faith in a vendor. 

I generally stick with the 100% faith in a vendor rule. I’ve visited the (cigar) mothership several times and the expression “Cuba being Cuba” is well earned. As far as US acquisitions, CigarCzar is one of only two on the planet that I trust.

The other is much more expensive, but we’ve been friends for a couple of decades...