Partagas Maduro? No. 1

[NSXCIGAR]

This might be the definitive example of a Cuban Maduro having nothing to do with wrapper color. Lightest I've ever seen. Typical light Colorado Siglo III next to it for comparison:

[JohnS]

This is a great example showing that the maduro wrapper refers to a maturation process rather than a shade colour.

[Islandboy]

Is there a notable taste element this cigar (and other CC Maduros) brings to the table? After first thinking Maduro NC’s were the cat’s meow several years ago, then suddenly finding them heavy-handed and tasteless (AF Anejos, for example) I’ve completely shied away from trying the CC offerings. 

[nKostyan]

Maduro is not only the color of the wrapper, it is primarily a blend. Cubans do not paint their Maduro-only natural color, unlike NC.

[NSXCIGAR]

Although I've yet to see a Cohiba Maduro anywhere close to even a dark Colorado. 

The wrapper on this Partagas is quite attractive. Not a fan of these in general but I'm interested to see if there's a difference in taste from every other one I've had, all of which were quite dark.

[westg]

50 minutes ago, NSXCIGAR said:

Although I've yet to see a Cohiba Maduro anywhere close to even a dark Colorado. 

The wrapper on this Partagas is quite attractive. Not a fan of these in general but I'm interested to see if there's a difference in taste from every other one I've had, all of which were quite dark.

From my experience most definitely. I would be disappointed to receive the above example. 

 

[Derboesekoenig]

2 hours ago, nKostyan said:

Maduro is not only the color of the wrapper, it is primarily a blend. Cubans do not paint their Maduro-only natural color, unlike NC.

As mentioned above, maduro is a maturation process and not a color. Also from what I've read, the blends beyond the maduro wrapper have nothing to do with "maduro". In NC it is a bit different, as some maduro cigars have the same blend as their "natural" wrapper cousin and some actually don't. Not sure how this is in Cuban maduros, as there aren't really identical non-maduro cousins to the Cuban maduro cigars themselves.

[nKostyan]

What can I add on the Maduro question:

- Maduro literally translates from Spanish as "ripe". It is believed that the natural Maduro leaves should be sweet in taste and give the same sweet smoke;

- for premium Cuban cigars maduro is achieved by aging a Ligero leaf with a special technology;

- at the same time, we can see cheap "pesos / folk" Cuban cigars in the Maduro wrapper, where the color is obtained due to the fact that the wrapper is grown in the sun, as opposed to the premium wrapper which is grown under protection;

- the taste characteristic of maduro for some NC is achieved only by a mixture of filler and binder, while the wrapper can be natural.

 

Additional interesting article: http://www.stogiefresh.info/edu-tobacco/articles/Aging-Maduro-Tobacco.html

[Fugu]

'Maduro' in Cuba is - first and foremost, and historically has always been - a colour. There hasn't been any special "maduro"-processing there, looking not too far back. And that is why in Cuba - different to most other provenances - "maduro" has always been synonymous with a wrapper shade.

Then there is this second meaning, but closely going along with the first, which is a rather recent development. And that's referring to processing. Which comprises an - intentional - selection of special leaf and a particular treatment, essentially with extra fermentation at slightly elevated temperatures. But still, the aim is to produce a darker wrapper, the emphasis still being placed on colour, as well as a particular taste-characteristic coming along with it, but not on the process itself. The outcome is what's important, not the process.

The above example looks like a 'maduro' gone wrong. Even for a Cuban. At elevated fermentation temps and extra maturation the wrapper adopts a darker colour. That is almost inevitable, and it looks as if the necessary leaf selection and in particular the process parameters had not been fully attained in the above example. Don't let yourself be fooled folks, a 'maduro' should ideally come in a maduro shade, period.

My take: The crux with that is, the process in the delicate wrapper leaf can easily go astray, and a glitch in the strict temperature, moisture and timing protocol may quickly destroy the whole batch (e.g. resulting in brittle leaf). So, it seems Havana is processing "maduro" more towards the "conservative" end of the spectrum. Perhaps in order to keep the risk of potential damage and loss of precious wrapper leaf to a minimum. But that's just an assumption, I bet there are people with a deeper insight into the Cuban industry who may be able to chime in here.

[Wookie]

All good information.  I've smoked a few of the darker ones and was not impressed. That was before the price came down. Probably time to try again at FOH pricing.  

[alloy]

I bought a box of the No. 1's. Will not make that mistake again. Just not for me.

[The Squiggler]

6 hours ago, Derboesekoenig said:

As mentioned above, maduro is a maturation process and not a color

but the maturation process does/should produce a dark color (while a leaf can be dark/oscuro without having gone through the process, proper maduro processing should always lead to a darker color).  At the risk of sounding like a redundant, redundant parrot, I think it should be noted that all while cigars with maduro wrappers should be dark (I would say "all maduro cigars", but as others have noted, some use the maduro tobacco inside the cigar to deliver maduro flavor), all cigars with dark wrappers are not necessarily maduro. ??

[Capt. Corona]

The single cigar on top from a [oct 18 box] was purchased by me in Havana.  The ones below [apr 19 box] were from this site.

I enjoyed the couple I smoked from the 18 box and decided to go for another.  As far as wrapper appearance ...you could interchange from either box and not pick out which is which from the color.  Maybe I should consider myself lucky or just don't know a bad cigar from a good one but I believe these to have a possible future.  At least the 18 box anyways as I haven't tried any from the 19 yet.

[bbguardsp]

10 hours ago, Fugu said:

'Maduro' in Cuba is - first and foremost, and historically has always been - a colour. There hasn't been any special "maduro"-processing there, looking not too far back. And that is why in Cuba - different to most other provenances - "maduro" has always been synonymous with a wrapper shade.

Then there is this second meaning, but closely going along with the first, which is a rather recent development. And that's referring to processing. Which comprises an - intentional - selection of special leaf and a particular treatment, essentially with extra fermentation at slightly elevated temperatures. But still, the aim is to produce a darker wrapper, the emphasis still being placed on colour, as well as a particular taste-characteristic coming along with it, but not on the process itself. The outcome is what's important, not the process.

The above example looks like a 'maduro' gone wrong. Even for a Cuban. At elevated fermentation temps and extra maturation the wrapper adopts a darker colour. That is almost inevitable, and it looks as if the necessary leaf selection and in particular the process parameters had not been fully attained in the above example. Don't let yourself be fooled folks, a 'maduro' should ideally come in a maduro shade, period.

My take: The crux with that is, the process in the delicate wrapper leaf can easily go astray, and a glitch in the strict temperature, moisture and timing protocol may quickly destroy the whole batch (e.g. resulting in brittle leaf). So, it seems Havana is processing "maduro" more towards the "conservative" end of the spectrum. Perhaps in order to keep the risk of potential damage and loss of precious wrapper leaf to a minimum. But that's just an assumption, I bet there are people with a deeper insight into the Cuban industry who may be able to chime in here.

This.  Absolutely agree.  One thing I'll add is the leaves higher on the plant are naturally thicker in texture.  When going into fermentation - each pilon is comprised entirely of  pre-sorted tobacco with a specific size and texture.  The thicker the tobacco the longer fermentation is required.  This inevitably produces darker tobacco the thicker the leaves are.

[slowsmoke]

Am I really the only one who thinks it's just Cuba being Cuba? As in, they probably just used the wrong damn leaf ?

Pretty hard to believe that's a maduro, either by color or process.

 

[nKostyan]

Excellent natural Maduro color. No.1 from 24:24 RUM ABR 19, No.2 from Havana MSU AGO 19

[PigFish]

... only the Cubans could f'up the understood meaning of a maduro cigar and get away with it. What next, maduro claros?

Face it. Tabacuba will throw almost anything in a box and call it a cigar these days. The loyal amongst us will offer any reason to let them off the hook for just about any reason.

If the market demands, Tabacuba will put a double band on a pig and call it a panatella, AND people will buy it!

-the Pig

[nKostyan]

If the market demands, Tabacuba will put a double band on a pig and call it a panatella, AND people will buy it!

Not a good example. With formats they have brought order. Vitola allows unambiguously determine the size of the, unlike mess which is happening among NC. It's something Cubans can be proud of

[PigFish]

2 hours ago, nKostyan said:

Not a good example. With formats they have brought order. Vitola allows unambiguously determine the size of the, unlike mess which is happening among NC. It's something Cubans can be proud of

I have to agree to disagree.

Tabacuba is no longer the leader, trendsetter. The only thing likely stopping them form making more fat sizes is the lack of a CNC machine to make the molds! Pardon my cynicism, but there you have it!

-Piggy

[nKostyan]

I have to agree to disagree.

Tabacuba is no longer the leader, trendsetter. The only thing likely stopping them form making more fat sizes is the lack of a CNC machine to make the molds! Pardon my cynicism, but there you have it!

-Piggy

We have only ourselves to blame. Shoving our dollars into the socialist system - corrupting Cubans

An artist must be hungry